Manchester United

[yusuf eeli]

i disagree wit dat.......altho keane aint bn playin his best football i think dat wen united put players like o shea in midfield it works betta

[Figо10]

From www.soccernet.com:


Rio wants new contract and captaincy

Rio Ferdinand insists he has no intention of leaving Manchester United - and would like to replace Roy Keane as captain when the Irishman retires.

Ferdinand: Chance meeting (AlexLivesey/GettyImages)
Sir Alex Ferguson and Arsene Wenger yesterday became unusual allies as both cast aspersions over Ferdinand's 'chance meeting' with Chelsea chief executive Peter Kenyon in a London restaurant.

Ferguson described the meeting as 'at least ill-advised', but Ferdinand has reiterated his desire to stay at Old Trafford in the long term.

The England defender told The Sun: 'I've said everything about that meeting. It wasn't planned and I don't want to leave. In fact my big ambition is to be captain of this club. It is one of the things you dream about as a kid.

'For me it does not get bigger than leading this club, which is one of the most famous in the world. It would be the most fantastic honour.'

The Blues insisted on Tuesday night that they had no plans to make a transfer swoop for the England defender, declaring: 'Both the player and Manchester United are fully aware of the circumstances of the meeting and Chelsea's position on it.'

However, with Chelsea already under investigation following an alleged attempt to poach Ashley Cole from Arsenal, Ferguson and Wenger refused to let the issue drop.

United boss Ferguson said: 'The club has accepted Chelsea's explanation? Well, that may be someone else's view, but it's certainly not mine.

'I've not been over-encouraged by Peter Kenyon's words that he does not want to sign Rio.

'For a chief executive of a Premier League club - with the recent history they have had - to sit in a restaurant like that is amazing.

'I don't know if it's contempt or whether he is thumbing his nose at us or what. I just don't know.

'I'd say that it was, at least, ill-advised. Therefore, we will leave the matter with the football authorities.

'We're discussing it here and I think the Premier League are aware of it.

'My concern is for our supporters. I just want to let them know the club are not happy. It's an issue we are discussing.'

Arsenal manager Wenger also responded in a cynical manner when asked about the incident, declaring 'it looks like a film we've seen already'.

Wenger added: 'I don't know if it really happened like it happened with Ashley Cole. First of all, a club should not be involved in any kind of incident.

'I respect what Chelsea are doing on the pitch but I expect them to behave and respect the rules off the pitch, like everyone else.'

Ferguson is at least confident Ferdinand will soon pledge his future to United by signing an extension to his current contract, which still has over two years to run.

It is understood the England international, his agent Pini Zahavi, United chief executive David Gill and club solicitor Maurice Watkins were involved in serious discussions at the Red Devils' Carrington training ground yesterday, which appeared to have inched the possibility of a new contract slightly closer.

'I must say that I don't blame Rio. I believe what he's telling me,' said Ferguson. 'If he was enticed to that meeting, I do not know, but I believe he'll sign a contract and he'll stay here.'
Hope he's not heading for Stamford Bridge... ;)

[marcrulz]

look, if he goes to stamford bridge, he would be a traitor, us united fans and all united players and staff supported him and stood by him through his 8 month ban when some clubs may not have, he shud repay our loyalty.

[Figо10]

look, if he goes to stamford bridge, he would be a traitor, us united fans and all united players and staff supported him and stood by him through his 8 month ban when some clubs may not have, he shud repay our loyalty.
He's already a 'traitor' to Leeds' fans when he left their club, as captin, with a record transfer fee after they'd just voted him player of the year.

[marcrulz]

also after all this quieroz shit, I think roy keane shud take the post of assistant manager/player as he is basically that already, but the tactics and quierozs contribution are damaging our chances of silverware.

[marcrulz]

He's already a 'traitor' to Leeds' fans when he left their club, as captin, with a record transfer fee after they'd just voted him player of the year.

yes but leeds didnt help him like we helped him,look at mutu at chelsea, wud chelsea have stood by rio, nope they wud have bought a new centre half.

[marcrulz]

wisely, Im afraid ferdinand is almost irreplaceable, but I think he will sign the new deal.

[Jonny2J]

also after all this quieroz shit, I think roy keane shud take the post of assistant manager/player as he is basically that already, but the tactics and quierozs contribution are damaging our chances of silverware.according to the sun.........

[Papa Lazarou]

I dont think Rio will leave as he is probably going to be the next Man U captain and there is no way in hell Ferguson will let him leave. As for Ruud he wont leave either because the fans love hime and it will only be a matter of time before he gets his goals back

[Papa Lazarou]

Well i see that Van Nistelrooy proved all of the doubters wrong by scoring 2 goals 2day. SHAME ON ALL WHO DOUBTED HIM HE'S GOIN NOWHERE!!

Great performance 2day by united Newcastle werent in the match at all!!

Alo rio is gonna sign a new deal on monday (i think) so he aint goin nowhere either!!


BRING ON ARSENAL

3 VICTORIES THIS SEASON LETS MAKE IT 4!!

[Stella Artois]

Clutching at straws I think, trying too hard to find the cause of your problems.

It's like Gilberto at Arsenal - they've been shite, someone realises that Gilberto's not been in the side while they've been shite, and suddenly he's the saviour.

When in fact he's not, he's the same decentish player he was when they got injured.

The usual load of bullshit from LiamK.

Don't you get bored of writing absolute crap?

[Gary G]

We made it very easy for you lot today, our midfield was nowhere to be seen, I honestly don't know why we signed Nicky Butt, he's either injured or suspended or he just plays shite.

We were'nt pressing at all today, your midfield was allowed acres of space, you wouldn't have been able to guess it was an FA Cup semi-final we were playing,

[Stella Artois]

I've got to say, having players banned for Cup competitions for what they have done in the League is pathetic. The fact that both Dyer and Bowyer were missing affected Newcastle big time and ruined the game to be honest.

[yusuf eeli]

yeh lol i saw dat b4...............heres da funny bit,

'Rooney opted for a jumbo sausage with his chips'

[Stella Artois]

Here's something even funnier:

"yusuf eeli learns to spell"

[]NikE[]

It was a great game today,it was made easy slightly,great stuff that ruud is back on track,should make things interesting heading towards the end of the season!

NIKE

[Singh]

David Bellion - chicken and chips
Gabriel Heinze - chicken and chips
Cristiano Ronaldo - chicken and chips

thats wat its all about :cool:

Anyway good result today against a weakened newcatle team but neverthless a profesional display, ruuds back :)

[marcrulz]

full speed ahead cardiif.

[yusuf eeli]

im sure dey can beat arsenal with a full squad

[marcrulz]

well theyve not been beaten by arsenal for 2 years (6games)

[yusuf eeli]

yer i guess dat also helpz

[Singh]

Form goes out of the window when playing a final match anything can happen though I cant see man utd losing.

[marcrulz]

I like being optimistic, united will win!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[yusuf eeli]

u can never be too sure about these matches

i have to agree with stoneman, the match won't be straight forward, remeber its gonna be played in front of a packed house in cardiff

[Singh]

Its not all about playing in front of a big crowd man utd beat arsenal 4-2 at highbury with arsenal having 35,000 supporters there.

[yusuf eeli]

i think man utd will always have the upper hand on arsenal, but sometimes playing with such a big crowd you rely more on instincts, so im just saying you never know what could happen

[marcrulz]

well united are more used to a big crowd.

[Singh]

Well, I believe that was a one-off. It was the first time that Arsenal had lost at home since they lost to Leeds in May 2003. They won't be losing any more home games like that, that's for sure.

Anything is possible in football. Who would of said PSV would reach semis of champions league?, or West brom getting out of relegation zone.

I dont reckon it was a one off. :rolleyes:

[Alex"pes"hilty]

I think that we can win the Final, but it will be nerve rackin, Arsenal wont win at Chelsea, so United have to now concentrate on Everton, Which is on SKy Right on Wednesday night.?

[Singh]

Yea it is both games on same night, same time, but different channels.

[Alex"pes"hilty]

I will have to miss the Chelsea Arsenal game then, i will tape it, i want Chelsea to win we need Chelsea to win. :( Get ready for 90minutes of Rooney getting called a fat bastard on Wednesday, :laugh:

[marcrulz]

isnt that what happens every 90 minutes by jealous opposition.

[AgentZero]

very true marcrulz...every where rooney goes he gets stick from the opposition crowd.
Good game against newcastle, although at times the defence kinda looked shaky.
why did fergie bring back two not 100% players in late in the game, i thought quinton should of been changed instead of ronnie and leave giggsy in the bench still

[marcrulz]

it may have been a case of him wanting to give them the minutes on the pitch and assesing their fitness.

[Jonny2J]

isnt that what happens every 90 minutes by jealous opposition.just like what your fans were doing to day with Shearer;)

[marcrulz]

well, yes, but Im sure he regrets his decision now.

[AgentZero]

Wes did an alright job with keeping shearer down, had hardly a chance

[skullverine]

it was a good match.. I'm still mad about Ameobi's goal though.. Brown shouldnt have gone up!

[Cristiano07]

class perfermance. now thats how we should play every week not just wen its a must win game

[pier69]

i think it's a really good game , man utd plays like there's no tomorrow , and they look relaxed too

[Morientes19]

newcastle were crap as well. but manu were ace.

[yusuf eeli]

when keane is playing good and scholes too man utd can beat any team

hopefully keane and scholes can do the same against arsenal

[Papa Lazarou]

Keane and Scholes will because they always fire themselves up for the big games.

Also i hope Fletcher starts because he has a really major effect on our performances

[martin_cranie]

At the risk of jeopordising the sanctity that is "The Official Manchester United Thread", i'd would like to offer my condolences for your loss tonight.

Of course i'd also like to laugh at you. Not that Everton are a bad team of course, quite the opposite infact, but your performance tonight was more a kin to that of Blackburns talentless rough-housing than that of a top notch team.

Thanks for giving me a good laugh tonight, i can't wait 'til Cardiff.

[Stella Artois]

Yeah, I think Fletcher is underrated. I can't understand why people are calling for him to be sold.

We never lost once while he was in the team this season. Maybe because, the midfield became a lot more balanced when he played in a 4-4-3 formation with both Keane and Scholes.

Ah, so United are cheaters, eh? Always knew it.

[pier69]

i think thats cuz fletcher always lose the ball a lot of times , but other than that he's a good contributor , i never think taht he sucks , he needs a bit more time

[AgentZero]

dissapointing lost...didnt create enough chances but i think thats due lack of control in the guts of the team.
Always next season to better our results, hopefully youngsters like Fletch, Ronaldo, Roons and smudger kick in2 a higher gear and make life easier for the older geezers

[Stella Artois]

Or Carrol, Rooney and Ronaldo? Or even Scholes and the Nevilles.

One day you'll be able to beat me in an argument. Keep trying, sonny.

[marcrulz]

Im sorry, u can get sent off for gently lobbing the ball into the crowd, also would any1 agree with me that ferdinand showed a complete lack of guts, in that he backed off from ferguson, if hed stayed with him ferguson wudnt have had such a clean header, ur still gr8 tho rio, but a little greedy. I'd like to also say that rooney was excellent last night, he looked world class! Very disappointed, I still cant get over the last month for united, I hope there isnt an internal problem as suggested in the sun, of course they'll write anything to sell a paper tho.

[marcrulz]

yeah the tits are always fake on pg 3

[LiamK]

My cousin was a page 3 girl once a few years ago, yes, they were fake.

Also been doing some work for Nuts magazine after winning that photo competition in it. A load of girls send in risque photos of themselves, four are chosen and published then there's a vote for the winner.

Since that she's done one photo wearing an Arsenal shirt, which is incredibly bad form for a supposed Chelsea supporter. I've not spoken to her since*

*not really because she wore an Arsenal shirt, just because I hardly ever see her anyway.

[gollan]

"My Cousin Was a Porn Star - LiamK's Story".
Soon!! In a bookstore near you.

[Papa Lazarou]

I'll take 7 copies!!







Does It Have Pictures??

[LiamK]

Not to my knowledge anyway, just the standard wannabe Playgirl lifestyle.

Worked as a dancer at Stringfellows, trying to date footballers (Micheal Duberry the only one so far, although she claims Lampard keeps on giving her the eye when they see each other in clubs) while at the same time living at home (she's 29) and arguing with her mum constantly about the rent. Moving out only to move back in a weeks time and generally just not doing a great deal.

Wouldn't make a great novel, although if something with Lampard works out then I'm sure some tabloid scumbag like Max Clifford would make her a great deal of money.

[Cadbury]

I'm not one to change the subject on boobs, but a little :offtopic: here. Little late but I haven't gloated enough about the win. :D

We won!

[Dan]

My cousin was a page 3 girl once a few years ago, yes, they were fake.

Also been doing some work for Nuts magazine after winning that photo competition in it. A load of girls send in risque photos of themselves, four are chosen and published then there's a vote for the winner.

Since that she's done one photo wearing an Arsenal shirt, which is incredibly bad form for a supposed Chelsea supporter. I've not spoken to her since*

*not really because she wore an Arsenal shirt, just because I hardly ever see her anyway.
whats her name i collect nuts mag:)

[gollan]

I'm not one to change the subject on boobs, but a little :offtopic: here. Little late but I haven't gloated enough about the win. :D

We won!

Damn a gloat winning on Man U is almost as good as tits discussion, even though LiamK's cousin's boobs give that reason a good fight..

:D

[yusuf eeli]

very off topic

[Cadbury]

Hey about those boobs, eh?

[LiamK]

It wasn't recent, a few months ago. Possibly before Christmas.

It was on that 'send in your own photos' page, she was the top right entry I think. 'Wendy, 29 from Herts' she was referred to as. Then in the next issue (I think) she did a proper photo shoot where she looked completely different.

[martin_cranie]

You can't blame Roy Carroll for the fact that the referee disallowed the goal against Tottenham. Any other keeper would've done the same in his situation.

And since we're talking about keepers, let's talk about Lehmann. Oh yeah, the keeper who can't stop lashing out at Kevin Phillips.

And if you're talking about diving, then I can think of Ashley Cole, Vieira, Pires, Ljungberg, Bergkamp and Reyes. All of them either dive or fall down too easily.

And what about Van Persie? He went diving into tackles left, right and centre earlier in the season. He got what was coming to him last Saturday. What goes around comes around.

The fact that some of our players go down too easily is certainly undeniable, however it's another one of those hypocritical arguments, as so many players do it now, Manchester United included. So hey we're even.

And so to the real issue.

Lehmann lashing out at Phillips is one thing, however no matter how many attacks, justified or not, that you throw at Arsenal, all we have to do is state one name and we instantly come up clean and tidy next to your team: Roy Keane.

As soon as Lehmann, Ljungberg, Van Persie or Reyes ends someones career like Keane did to Haarland, or for that matter Giggs did to Busst, then maybe i'll take on board what you have to say.

I respect the fact that you support your club, after all every it's every fans duty, but when you start becoming that ignorant and biased then you really are pushing it mate.

[LiamK]

And so to the real issue.


Sorry to interrupt, but I think the real issue is my cousin's semi-naked photo shoot.

[Singh]

Why would you want to show everyone your cousins semi naked photos?

[LiamK]

Ummm...they're not like I snuck into her bathroom while she was having a shower and silently clicked away from behind the towel rack.

I think when she sent them into a magazine and when she did a proper photo shoot she had a good idea that other people were going to see them.

[yusuf eeli]

show us the photos then

[LiamK]

I think Dan19 is currently searching frantically through his soft porn collection for a Wendy, 29, Herts.

[Singh]

Ummm...they're not like I snuck into her bathroom while she was having a shower and silently clicked away from behind the towel rack.

I think when she sent them into a magazine and when she did a proper photo shoot she had a good idea that other people were going to see them.

ok thats eased my worries. :rolleyes:

[gollan]

What goes around comes around...
What a stupid remark, really. Even if that elbow was pure accident, which I don't truly believe, that's still a stupid remark. The guy played for fuckin 10 minutes, scored twice, and all of the sudden it's ok to open up his lip?!?
Gimme a break.

[martin_cranie]

What goes around comes around...
What a stupid remark, really. Even if that elbow was pure accident, which I don't truly believe, that's still a stupid remark. The guy played for fuckin 10 minutes, scored twice, and all of the sudden it's ok to open up his lip?!?
Gimme a break.

No doubt that Todd did it on purpose. I'm not at all surprised though that the FA have let him off, being the incompetent bastards that they are.

200 posts! yay.

[gollan]

Yeah I do and no I don't accept it. Usually hurting other players happens when:

a. They played aggressively throughout the match - happens every match, usually around 60th-70th minute, happens a lot to Ashley Cole, who I admit is a rough guy, or Zlatan, and this happens every match. Just simple retaliation (the guy that you fouled and received a yellow for it will eventually receive a yellow for fouling you).
Clearly not the case here, he played for only 10 minutes.

b. They have a "personal" history with you. Like Keano and Hallstrad (sp.). That was setlling the score. No one likes what Keano did, but we all know WHY he did that. Or you could know that Zlatan and Sinisa will be going at each other. Ethnich grounds and such. But it's not the case here either - it's V.P's first season ever, he only played Blackburn once, and scored. But that's not enough to open "an account" to be settled.


So what happened?

Todd is a violent scumbag. VP scored his magnificent first, and celebrated like the annoying peacock that he is, and when he scored his even better 2nd goal, 94th minute, Todd was like "Over my dead body is this youngster going to celebrate again. I'll give him a little taste of celebrating". Clear and simple, malicious and unjustified. He hurt him because he scored, and the way he celebrates. Not for being a hard man.

[gollan]

I can understand that.

I mean, this is why they're being labelled a dirty team.

Exactly. Unless the FA decides to do something about it, it's going to happen next season as well. Do we need to see someone's career hurt? I mean, as much as I was grateful to the treatment Robben received - that was just ugly. Notice they go for the creative, hard working player too.

Bastardos.
:realmad:

[Cristiano07]

Exactly. Unless the FA decides to do something about it, it's going to happen next season as well. Do we need to see someone's career hurt? I mean, as much as I was grateful to the treatment Robben received - that was just ugly. Notice they go for the creative, hard working player too.

Bastardos.
:realmad:

well they'r gonna go 4 the creative 1's cause they'r the people who r gonna hurt them. ive noticed though that no team ever tries 2 take henry out, i'd think it would have been tried be4 since he is involved in nearly all of their goals

[Singh]

Manchester United boss Sir Alex Ferguson has aimed a swipe at Chelsea counterpart Jose Mourinho.

Ferguson believes his job at Old Trafford is a lot harder than the one Mourinho has at Stamford Bridge.

Although Mourinho is on the verge of leading Chelsea to The Premiership title this season, Ferguson insists his job at United entails more than that of the Portuguese tactician.

"It is said that Mourinho is the number one but at 63 I'm not jealous of my competitors and what they win," Ferguson told The Sun.

"I have been a manager for a long, long time and won many trophies. Anyway, my job is completely different and carries a heavier load than Mourinho's.

"Mourinho has a completely different culture at Chelsea than I do in charge at Manchester United. I'm a manager, not merely a coach.

"I make decisions about signings. I have the responsibility for the first team - plus the reserves and the United academy."

[Stella Artois]

You can't blame Roy Carroll for the fact that the referee disallowed the goal against Tottenham. Any other keeper would've done the same in his situation.

And since we're talking about keepers, let's talk about Lehmann. Oh yeah, the keeper who can't stop lashing out at Kevin Phillips.

And if you're talking about diving, then I can think of Ashley Cole, Vieira, Pires, Ljungberg, Bergkamp and Reyes. All of them either dive or fall down too easily.

And what about Van Persie? He went diving into tackles left, right and centre earlier in the season. He got what was coming to him last Saturday. What goes around comes around.

How is going into challenges strongly cheating? Stop making a prat of yourself.

Or can we include Roy "I go out to intentionally injure fellow professionals" Keane, in the list of cheats?

[marcrulz]

first jumping into tackles left right and centre shows tanascity and I admit it is a good quality for a footballer, I think blackburns tactics are being unfairly treated.

[gollan]

^^^
Wrong Forum. Rugby is in the forum next door. Unfairly treated? Are you serious? The only problem is that the FA's balls are far to small to handle their violence. They don't have a chance winning a football match, so they start a bar brawl where they have a shot at winning. No wonder it's the team that scores the least amount of goals in the premiership.

[Stella Artois]

Jumping into challenges left, right and centre shows that you have no self-control. Which also means that you have a temper and you can't control it.

That isn't cheating.

Not to mention the amount of times I've seen Rooney do the same thing.

Ronaldo is as petulant and behaves as poorly as RvP, so I would categorise in that too.

Therefore, lashing out when things aren't going for you and deliberately trying to stop the opposition playing is cheating in most people's eyes. Look at Blackburn as an example. I can guarantee that opposition fans believe that Blackburn are a dirty team. I'm sure you do aswell.

He doesn't deliberately attempt to stop the opposition playing - he just lashes out. There is a huge difference between the two.

[Stella Artois]

When have I said they weren't as bad as each other?

[Hunter]

We all know that Ronaldo dives every match and we can pretty much all agree he is crap at it. Gets caught a fair bit but hardly ever booked with the exception of the last two matches. He must learn his lesson with diving, it is just not acceptable. It's cheating!

But fouling is most definetely not cheating, thats just stupidity. Diving is cheating not fouling. Everyone commits a foul. A lot of players commit several fouls every match. But labelling a person a 'cheat' due to commiting several bad tackles is silly.

Heinze is a rather strange character I have to say. He just can't control himself, he is one of the best LB's in the world none-the-less though. But he has no technique, his arms are all over. He runs while waving his arms making sure no-one approaches him whilst on the ball. Really silly but I must say it does the job very well.

[Stella Artois]

You posted earlier that you've always thought that we were cheaters.

Why make that comment if you acknowledge that Arsenal have their own share of "cheaters"? It makes your earlier comment (about branding us cheaters) invalid.

Oh dear. Look at what I quoted when I made the original comment, and then look at how you go off on one, moaning about Arsenal being cheats.

Lighten up.

[Hunter]

Oh dear. Look at what I quoted when I made the original comment, and then look at how you go off on one, moaning about Arsenal being cheats.

Lighten up.

It's never going to stop is it.
A lot of the big clubs cheat in many leagues, but simply because we are 'rivals/enemies' we have to repeatedly call each other cheats.

Can't wait till 21st May. It's going to be hell!

[Hunter]

But even if you plain aim for the twat, it's not cheating. Its just very dirty and malice. Then the player who commits the 'hack' usually sees red anyway. So it only goes as a disadvantage to his fellow team-mates.

[marcrulz]

look, football isnt a game for prats who are afraid of hard tackles, for goodness sake I love utd vs arsenal cos of the tenacious nature of the game, I think it is more entertaining and at least shows that the players care, I wud rather this than a game without tackles.

[yusuf eeli]

everyone can say that every other team cheats, but that is how football is with the tackling and diving, i dont think it's ever going to change

[marcrulz]

I hate diving, but I dont mind tough tackling.

[yusuf eeli]

but some of the tackles made can be career threatening

[marcrulz]

thats only in very extreme cases

[martin_cranie]

Jumping into challenges left, right and centre shows that you have no self-control. Which also means that you have a temper and you can't control it.

Therefore, lashing out when things aren't going for you and deliberately trying to stop the opposition playing is cheating in most people's eyes.

As ever i agree hole heartedly that Arsenal can be just as ragged as anyone at times, however do at least try to bare in mind the ages of many of the Arsenal players you've mentioned.


You know, I would have to say that fouls can be classified into groups (depending on severity). There are some fouls that are just plain dirty and you can clearly see the malice, and some are accidental.

Agreed, but i'd argue that there is another important consideration, namely that of experience.

RVP, Reyes, Fabregas, Flamini, Senderos etc... are extremely young and petulent at times, but thats just youth for you. It's the same with Rooney and Ronaldo.

However for players of Roy Keanes' or Robbie Savages' experience to be behaving so pugnaciously... well now that is taking the piss somewhat.

[AgentZero]

I agree. It's almost impossible for any team to go through an entire season without one or more of their players being branded cheats.

That's why I think that claiming that a rival team is full of cheaters is hypocritical. As nearly every team has at least one tough-tackler or excess diver.

that and its our duty as rival teams to brand their players as cheats its nature we hate their players they hate ours

[-=[101st]=-]

you know.. you call everyone a cheater.. but when u play you get away with what ever u can.. because i do the same.. if i cna push the rules.. and if u say u dont your full of shit.. i mean.. u might admit to something meaning less.. like in out indoor football final last year.. i scored one of our semi final goal with my arm.. it wasn't picked up and i sure as hell wasn't saying "it hit my arm sir"

so in conclusion.. everyone "cheats" or "pushes the rules" in sport.. so there is little point complaining

[Hunter]

=-']you know.. you call everyone a cheater.. but when u play you get away with what ever u can.. because i do the same.. if i cna push the rules.. and if u say u dont your full of shit.. i mean.. u might admit to something meaning less.. like in out indoor football final last year.. i scored one of our semi final goal with my arm.. it wasn't picked up and i sure as hell wasn't saying "it hit my arm sir"

so in conclusion.. everyone "cheats" or "pushes the rules" in sport.. so there is little point complaining

Exactly.
No-one should really fling the word 'cheat' back and forth.

[gollan]

I once read that the difference in the public reaction (and commentators', for that matter) in the UK and in the rest of the world to the following situation demonstrates the difference in attitude toward "cheating":

A player dives in the box, gets a peno, scores.

England: They go all ranting about him diving and cheating
Rest of the World: They go all ranting about the ref being a turd not able to see that it was diving.

England - blame the player for trying to push the rules, like you guys said. It's not nice, true, but it's the reality. Football is a fight. There are rules, that can be broken. If you get caught you get fucked.
Rest of the world - blame the person who was supposed to see to it that the rules aren't broken. If they fucked up, it's mostly their fault (the ref).
Also note that the refs in England are shockingly bad.

[Akineye]

Also note that the refs in England are shockingly bad.

There's a lot to be said for letting the game flow and adopting the more leniant approach we have here. I'm not sying English referees are fantastic, but I'd much rather watch a fast-paced Premiership game than a game from La Liga where the slightest touch is deemed as a foul.

Blaming the referee for not spotting every dive is ridiculous too, that's like saying somebody who committed murder and got away with it is innocent because he didn't get caught.

[gollan]

No, that's not a good comparison at all. The pace - I'll argue with you, but I do agree that matches that stop all the time are shite, it should be something between the pacey-yet-violent EPL and the every-second-stop La Liga.

No for our example. Crimes are not part of "the game". If the prosecution fails to convict someone, it means he going to get off free. Or like you said - they never got caught. (which statistics show is a very low chance for that to happen - they almost always get caught!!) But like you said it doesn't mean they are inncocent. The thing is a criminal committing a crime doesn't play for the "crooks" team - it's not an adversarial fight between the "crooks" and the "citizens", for that matter. In a football match you have 2 supposedly equal sides that have an opposite goal - to score and not concede (zero sum game) and your ref is there to keep things in order. His role is much more vital in the blame imposing procedure for failure to catch an offense than the blame imposed on a shitty prosecutor (still the criminal would be the major one to hold blame). When a ref fails to see someone diving and whistles for a peno - that's absolutley not ridiculous to say that he fucked up big time. That's the main reason why he's there! To see those things. And if he failed to spot that single dive that resulted in a peno that never should've happened, and that changed the match, then yeah - in my opinion it's mostly the ref's fault.

[Akineye]

It's impossible for referees to spot everything. Especially when diving is so rife in today's game. Sure, it's the ref's job to spot dives and the vast majority of times he does, but a large amount of blame lies with the player who deliberately tried to con the referee.

It's unreasonable to expect the referee to get every single decision right in the game. If a player dives and a penalty is given, you cannot blame the referee for not spotting it. Referees are human, and it's obvious they are going to make bad decisions. Unless you advocate trying to breed a super race of perfect referees then the only way to limit the number of wrong decisions is to cut down on the diving and cheating. You can bemoan bad refereeing decisions until the cows come home, they will always exist. It's part and parcel of the game. There never used to be this level of diving because there never used to be this much at stake.

Oh, and the Premiership is hardly violent. Try playing grass roots football in England or even academy matches and you'll see how much tougher it is. I would hate it if the Premiership ever turned into the stop-start affair some La Liga games are, when even minimal contact is penalised and players go down as soon as they are touched.

[pier69]

that's why they have linesman too , to help the ref look at the game

[gollan]

I'm not saying the divers should be hailed as heroes - but the interesting fact is who is the major one to blame, WHEN a diving results in a peno that shouldn't have been called for. Of course refs are human, and you can't expect them to get every single decision right, but I really think that it's their responsibility in those critical decisions.

[Papa Lazarou]

Hey when did this thread turn into "the official who's a cheat" thread???

Lets get back to Man U

i predict that we'll beat necastle tomorrow 4-0

[Singh]

I dont think it will be 4-0 but it would probably be 2-0, 2-1 to man utd a tight game to start with im sure. Man utd need to win and hope arsenal slip up on monday against spurs.

[Akineye]

Of course refs are human, and you can't expect them to get every single decision right, but I really think that it's their responsibility in those critical decisions.

If somebody goes out of their way to con and decieve an official, there's a good chance of a wrong decision. It's futile to blame referees because bad decisions are a part of the game. Referees may not be the most popular figures, but on the whole they do a damn good job.

[Phatmann]

I dont think it will be 4-0 but it would probably be 2-0, 2-1 to man utd a tight game to start with im sure. Man utd need to win and hope arsenal slip up on monday against spurs.
Are Gary Neville and Scholes banned for the Newcastle match? If so, I reckon it'll be very close, but I can't see Arsenal slipping up on Monday, so it's gonna be hard to get 2nd place.

[marcrulz]

3-1 to united, arsenal will draw on monday.

[Alex"pes"hilty]

2-0 Man Utd win for me, I doubt Arsenal will slip up against Spurs though sadly.

[marcrulz]

well it is a local derby and arsenal still dont look all that convincing, but it is more hope than belief.

[Singh]

Are Gary Neville and Scholes banned for the Newcastle match? If so, I reckon it'll be very close, but I can't see Arsenal slipping up on Monday, so it's gonna be hard to get 2nd place.

yea i think they are but still i reckon we got enough to beat newcastle.

[Akineye]

If you believe the papers Ruud is supposedly going to Real Madrid in a swap deal for Michael Owen.

It's utter bollocks and was rightfully rubbished by Fergie, if we sign Michael Owen I will lose all faith in United. Still, selling Ruud for thirty odd million to Real Madrid wouldn't be a bad piece of business.

[yusuf eeli]

its not like fergie to lose 3 in a row, he'll definatly make sure united win like 3 maybe 4 nil

[Akineye]

No way.

Without Scholes and Neville it will be a hell of a lot tougher, plus Newcastle's side looks a lot stronger since the FA Cup whitewash last weekend.

[marcrulz]

to be honest, I think brown will fill in well for neville, and giggs can go to the left and rooney can go up front with fletcher and keane in the middle of the park.

[Gary G]

No way.

Without Scholes and Neville it will be a hell of a lot tougher, plus Newcastle's side looks a lot stronger since the FA Cup whitewash last weekend.

Well we've got Dyer available, which is a boost, seeing as otherwise we would have to play the bumbling Ameobi or the disinterested Kluivert up top.

Like I said in another thread, Dyer alongside Shearer will be far more effective, as Shearer needs someone who will run all match and chase balls which Shearer can't anymore, a la Bellamy, Dyer is the next best thing we have to Bellamy.

I'm honestly more bothered about the peformance than the result tomorrow, as if you's are on top of your game you will invariably win, a good peformance by us will get the morale of the team up a little, and some of the pressure of Souness.

The best I can hope for is a draw, but I agree it won't be a walkover, I reckon the biggest winning margin will be a couple of goals.

[marcrulz]

I dont know ur defence is just pathetic and robert at the moment is pathetic I think hes trying to lose.

[Gary G]

I dont know ur defence is just pathetic and robert at the moment is pathetic I think hes trying to lose.

When we have a fully-fit defence it is hardly 'pathetic'

----------------------Given------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------
Carr-----------Boumsong-------Bramble-------------Babayaro

Boumsong and Bramble is a good partnership, Boumsong leads well, Carr isn't too bad, I'd still rather have Bernard back than Babayaro, but he'll do for the moment.

[marcrulz]

babyaro is playin useless, bramble is one of the worst defenders in the premiership and carr is average at best, boumsong is good, but thats 1 out of 4.

[Ryder Style]

Im not a man united fan but does anyone think that its time there was a change at united, ferguson is a ledgend but I think a new manager will bring a fresh outlook to the team, and it needs it to compete with chelsea. I personally think that in the summer they should look at replacing him, although b. charlton has said they wont sack him

[chris248]

with scholes and neville out, this will be harder than last weeks game. newcastle also have dyer back and he was playing well before the incident with bowyer. scholes will probably be replace by fortune although it should be giggs or even give kleberson a go. neville will be replaced by either o'shea or silvestre, with brown goin 2 right back. i predict 2-1 to united, cristiano and ruud scoring

[Akineye]

Well we've got Dyer available, which is a boost, seeing as otherwise we would have to play the bumbling Ameobi or the disinterested Kluivert up top.

It's mainly Dyer that will cause us the problems. I anticipate it to be a pretty evenly-matched game, we simply don't have the class in midfield for me to be confident of winning by a large margin. Especially without Scholes.

[Ryder Style]

For some reason i think martin o neill may be overrated and not achieve what the united fans want. no way should queiroz be in charge. Roy keane is not going to be ready yet. I think that it should definitely be Moyes. He has great potential and I could see him developing rooney further along with improving united overall, possibly allowing them to compete with chelsea again. Moyes seems a great choice for the summer

[Ryder Style]

Yes Capello would be a good choice for the immediate future and would achieve instant results, i just wonder if Moyes could deliver though, i think given time he could be a world class manager, who knows though as its unlikely that he will take over and your right fergie will be at united for a while yet. To me it just appears things have almost gone stale at united in the wake of chelsea and i dont think they can come back under fergie

[Singh]

Well i would like Fabio Capello he is an experienced manager and he has won a major trophy with each club he has managed.

Though i reckon it could be Carlos Queiroz or Roy keane. Carlos has had a spell at real and done not too bad he has the experience and roy keane a bit like Stuart pearce a bit raw but has fight and the players respect im sure.

[razor]

I think Fergie should leave. it is best for the clb. they will never sack him and we might end up like nottingham forest where clough wouldnt get sacked because of what he ahad done in the past and they ended up getting relegated. I would love to see an italian manger at manchester united because i believe they are the mangers who are the most tactically knowlageable. some drastic changes really need to be made.

[AgentZero]

i reckon we should get Del Bosque he did bring trophies into Real if not him give the job to Carlos itd be appropriate he knows the job after being n0.2 for two seasons

[pier69]

why do u want to sack one of the best in the world ? i think fergie had developed and bought one of the unknowns to be the best in the world like keane , giggs , beckham , ruud . he's clearly a really good manager , people like rooney and ronaldo and fletcher are gonna follow the footsteps of these greats and be huge in the future , i have full confdence of his ability to do a good job at man utd

[Singh]

I think every manager has there time at the club Fergie has had numerous shots at winning the champions league and only done so once if he was manager of italian, Spanish team he would not have had many chances like ancelotti said(Ac Milan coach)

For sure ferguson has done a good job and building man utd up around the likes of neville bros, giggs, keane, beckham, butt, scholes etc.

But i think its time there was fresh ideas around old trafford, ferguson is a legend for man utd and always will be, but I think his time is up.

[AgentZero]

c'mon pier 20 years of winning everything under the sun and then 2 years of just FA cup glory, i think the board think its time he retires (not sacked) to retain what it left of his [ride and illustrious career

[pier69]

at least it's better than not winning anything at all , but it's ok , i think if he leaves queiroz can take good care of utd , both of them are excellent top class manager

[AgentZero]

yeh and Quieroz had a decent spell at club he doesnt know and at utd hes familiar w/ players and coaching staff so i see him as my front runner

[pier69]

yup , and queiroz had managed real madrid quite well , but i dunno wat happen in the end , of all the coaches after del boaque and luxemburgo , i think queiroz is one of the better ones

[LiamK]

I think you should fight them off with a great big shitty stick.

After all, you can't have foreigners coming in and buying clubs and possibly giving them loads of money, it completely ruins football and yadder yadder yadder...

UNITED NOT FOR $ALE

(Not aimed at you stoneman, you're alright, not one of those whinging United fans who might all of a sudden have to eat their words)

[yusuf eeli]

hopefully none of them will get united

[Singh]

Man utd are losing 1-0 to newcastle at half time.

Heinze looks badly injured, howard makes another mistake, man utd cant score for 3 games and a bit, Ruuds injured with an ankle injury.

Not looking good so far.

Full time man utd 2-1 Newcaslte :D

good result but newcastle played well at times what a goal by rooney surely goal of the season :mellow:

[svendust]

What a goal!

Shame about Heinze he was doing well for me in the fantasy league.

[marcrulz]

go, on united, u didnt play the best, but what a player he is. Once a blue always a red.

[Gary G]

I wasn't sure whether our new formation would work today, it was untried and we had players playing out of position and a youngster making his debut. I was impressed with our peformance today, we battled and showed far more energy and tenacity than last Sunday's shambles, Ambrose in particular had an excellent game , and took his goal very well.

There's not much more to say about that goal really, it was literally unstoppable, and it showed what fantatsic technique the kid has, I don't mind when we concede goals like that, it's when we give away soft goals like Brown's header, Shola is about 20cm bigger than Brown and he still outjumped him with ease.

The reasons why I now dislike Kluivert were shown this afternoon, once again he looked disinterested and lazy, he really is taking us for a ride, along with Butt, good riddance to the both of them in the Summer.

I thought we were at least good enough for a draw today, it was the best peformance i've seen from us in a while, and will at the very least, lift morale slightly ahead of the 'Boro match on Wednesday.

[yusuf eeli]

good performance by united and whats happening with heinze?

[Singh]

Heinze had his x-ray at local hospital and they were saying his ankle aint broken just alot of brusing.

[Hunter]

Heinze will be alright, but a lot of rest is needed.
X-Rays have fortunately shown that he hasn't broke nor' fractured his ankle as first feared.
He is due for another check tomorrow (Monday). To see the full extent, and possibly an announcement will be made if we are lucky.

EDIT: Beaten' to it. Bastard! :cool:

[yusuf eeli]

i guess thats good news

i just want him to be fit for the FA cup final

[Singh]

Anyone pleased about the way giggsy played i thought he played good to start off with, good to see kleberson playing what seems like his last months at the club.

[yusuf eeli]

giggsy played great especially in the first half, made great runs and gave great passes, good to see him back

i want kleberson to stay

[Singh]

Kleberson is ok he is a good set piece taker and thats about it really but he has got the ability just that he is not using it. I think he should go and make way for new players which man utd do need, a new keeper is a must.

Also bet wenger feels like a fool.

Arsenal boss Arsene Wenger has revealed that he turned down signing keeper Paul Robinson before he moved to Tottenham. :D

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/a/arsenal/4479429.stm

[Papa Lazarou]

i think Kleberson should get a run of games (ahead of fortune even though i rate him too) cause i thought he played well today an a run of games will give him more confidence

[Singh]

Na fortune is a much better player then kleberson on form man utd cant afford to give kleberson a run of games with the season coming to a close and the chase for the 2nd spot hotting up.

[sheringham316]

Good result today, though not the best performances on united's behalf.
WHAT a goal by Rooney.
Has anybody got some footage of it?

[Phatmann]

Good result today, though not the best performances on united's behalf.
WHAT a goal by Rooney.
Has anybody got some footage of it?
http://www.ottvg.com/forum/index.php?act=Attach&type=post&id=21


If that doesn't work go here: http://www.socceram.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=16402

[marcrulz]

I heard a rumour that gerrard has signed a pre contract at united but I think it is a load of shit

[Singh]

Source?

[marcrulz]

it was a guy that my dad knows who works for man united

[yusuf eeli]

i don't think gerard would come to man utd, but wouldn't that be just great

[Papa Lazarou]

Gerrard wont come to United. He's too much of a Liverpudlian an too faithful (an i know that Smith was Leeds thru an thru but his case was different)

[yusuf eeli]

well i dont think there is any chace of gerard coming but hopefully a good central midfielder will come this summer

[codename 47]

Been hearing rumours that figo is very likely to leave R.madrid at the end of the season with inter being favs to sign him but its been said that carlos queroz is trying to persuade Sir Alex to go in for him

The Manchester United number two is set to hold talks with Madrid president Florentino Perez at the end of the current season in a bid to capture Figo on a free transfer.
Ferguson has been a long-time fan of the former Barcelona midfielder and would not take much convincing that he is worth a risk as a free agent.
Figo has fallen out with Madrid after they decided not to renew his contract which expires in 2006 and he is also furious that he been dropped to the bench for the last three league outings.
The Spanish giants could be willing to let the player leave for nothing as they would not have to pay him €6million for the final year on his contract.
The 32-year-old has often stated that he would like to play in The Premiership and he would have little problem adapting as he and his model wife Helen Svedin both speak fluent English.
Figo moved to the Bernabeu in 2000 for a world record fee of €55million after agreeing a pre-contract with Madrid when negotiations with then-Barca president, Joan Gaspart, broke down.

Glazer gets United deadline

The American tycoon has been seeking to buy the Old Trafford for some time only for his attempts to be rebuffed.
Glazer has handed over detailed proposals for a possible takeover in February but the club stated they were unlikely to accept the American's offer.
Now the takeover panel have set a deadline on May 17 for Glazer to disclose whether or not he is to pursue a takeover of the club's plc .
A statement from the club read: "The board of Manchester United plc welcomes the announcement by the takeover panel of a deadline of May 17, 2005 for the Glazer Family Limited Partnership either to announce a firm intention to make an offer for the company under rule 2.5 of the city code or to announce that it does not intend to make an offer for the company."
"The board remains of the view that the assumptions in the Glazer business plan are aggressive.
"The board recognises, however, that the price of 300p per share is a fair one and may be attractive to some shareholders of Manchester United.
"Given the board's concerns about the potential impact of the proposal on the company, the board has informed Glazer that it cannot provide a recommendation to shareholders to accept any offer made on the basis of the current proposal."
If Glazer does not make an offer he will not be allowed to make another one for six months.

[AgentZero]

the prospect of figo at United is good but would he be useful...no, he'll demand first team action week in week out and we can't afford to either drop either cristiano or giggs for long stints

[Morientes19]

I agree he would demand massive wages and 1st team football. If i was fergie i would go for someone younger and not so demanding

[yusuf eeli]

i think man utd have brought some young central midfielder who is 18 years old.....miguel or something, still not sure

[Papa Lazarou]

Heres the link to the statement on the official website

http://www.manutd.com/news/fullstory.sps?iNewsid=171406&itype=466&icategoryid=120

[yusuf eeli]

they haven't given much info about him, but i hope he turns into a good signing and united play him

[marcrulz]

fuck this is the announcement we've been waiting for for 3 years

[razor]

the prospect of figo at United is good but would he be useful...no, he'll demand first team action week in week out and we can't afford to either drop either cristiano or giggs for long stints


by the looks of things giggs wont be here next season! therefore it would make sense to get figo.

again i just want to say:

SACK FERGIE

Nearly took us down when we didn't have money but a decent set of players?
Stole Eric Harrison's thunder and claimed the class of 92 as his own?
Was lucky when he started out with transfers - should have got Hysen, got Pally, should have got David Hirst, got Cantona?
Wasted millions buying good players who didn't suit our system, most notably Veron?
Destroyed the youth academy to such an extent that Man City now have a far better one and we resort to poaching players from Spain and Italy?

I'm not sure about you but I find myself unable to defend Ferguson any longer. There was a time when I truly believed him to be a great manager and he was. Why does he have to issue the hairdryer treatment? Is his management style to scare and bully people? I'd rate Wenger as a better manager - pound for pound, Arsenal have had better value from their purchases over the last 5 years. Arsenal haven't been averse to the odd transfer cock-up themselves, but they've only gambled 2million on players whereas we've thrown 7million away *cough*Forlan*cough*. Why do you think the likes of Real Madrid have never made a formal approach for him? n

whoever said he is the best anager in the world needs their head checked. coming third in the league doesnt sound like the best manager in the world to me.

even on past glories he isnt. 1 chapions league win!! i think its quite ridiculous. the amount of money and young talent we had, we should have won it more. all the league titles he has won, people might say, but when has there really been any commpetition. only since wenger reformed arsenaland now that abromovich has come. lets see what he can do when there are other good teams in the league, oh! wait, finish 3rd two seasons in a row. do shit in the chapions league 4 seasons in a row. maybe losing to madrid wasnt bad, but we shouldve beat milan, porto and leverkusen.

[marcrulz]

fuck its people like you that puts united fans to shame.

[Gary G]

by the looks of things giggs wont be here next season! therefore it would make sense to get figo.

again i just want to say:

SACK FERGIE

Nearly took us down when we didn't have money but a decent set of players?
Stole Eric Harrison's thunder and claimed the class of 92 as his own?
Was lucky when he started out with transfers - should have got Hysen, got Pally, should have got David Hirst, got Cantona?
Wasted millions buying good players who didn't suit our system, most notably Veron?
Destroyed the youth academy to such an extent that Man City now have a far better one and we resort to poaching players from Spain and Italy?

I'm not sure about you but I find myself unable to defend Ferguson any longer. There was a time when I truly believed him to be a great manager and he was. Why does he have to issue the hairdryer treatment? Is his management style to scare and bully people? I'd rate Wenger as a better manager - pound for pound, Arsenal have had better value from their purchases over the last 5 years. Arsenal haven't been averse to the odd transfer cock-up themselves, but they've only gambled 2million on players whereas we've thrown 7million away *cough*Forlan*cough*. Why do you think the likes of Real Madrid have never made a formal approach for him? n

whoever said he is the best anager in the world needs their head checked. coming third in the league doesnt sound like the best manager in the world to me.

even on past glories he isnt. 1 chapions league win!! i think its quite ridiculous. the amount of money and young talent we had, we should have won it more. all the league titles he has won, people might say, but when has there really been any commpetition. only since wenger reformed arsenaland now that abromovich has come. lets see what he can do when there are other good teams in the league, oh! wait, finish 3rd two seasons in a row. do shit in the chapions league 4 seasons in a row. maybe losing to madrid wasnt bad, but we shouldve beat milan, porto and leverkusen.

That's bollocks, Milan are simply a better team, they proved that over the two legs.

[razor]

That's bollocks, Milan are simply a better team, they proved that over the two legs.

ok maybe not milan. but certainly the other two.

[gollan]

Wow. A ManU fan that has seen the light. You have no system. That's old news for someone who watches football religiously for the past 12 or so years like me. Fergie might be a good psychologist - or was - but he's shit at tactics. What you've said (apart from the we should've won against some european sides which was utter crap) is very true. If he doesn't have Quieroz, he's nothing. Again. You have no system. Buying players who are aggressive, win a lot of 50-50 and manage to squeeze the ball in is not a system. you have spirit - I'll give you that. But 99' in Barcelona was pure luck. You have a great striker, an amazing supporting striker, great wingers, great defenders - but no system.
What does he want with that system? you probably ask yourself. Look at AC Milan, look at Juve, look at Barca, look at Chelsea ffs. Even at Arsenal (and I must admit that Fergie was the first and one of the only managers to break our system). Your game looks like a mess. You don't know who's gonna do what when - all you know is that maybe someone talented is going to pull off something (Ronaldo or Giggs in the wing, Rooney, maybe, or a chance that Ruud, a natural predator, can do something in the box). That's it.
Sack Fergie. Get a new manager. Good luck.

[AgentZero]

the news ive been dreading for......ronnie is targeted by real for a summer swoop...im 50-50 on this because i hear he is un happy at life in england.

[-=[101st]=-]

Ronaldo to madrid? doubt it will happen, Madrid want players that have achieved more

[AgentZero]

hopefully it doesnt, but he seems like the kinda of player that ends up later on in life at a great club like Real.

[Akineye]

But 99' in Barcelona was pure luck. You have a great striker, an amazing supporting striker, great wingers, great defenders - but no system.

Whilst we may have been fotunate in the final there was no doubt that we were the best team in Europe in 99 by a considerable margin. Not only did we win the final without two world-class midfielders, we scored the most goals in Champion's League history throughout the competition and beat four previous winners on our way to the final.

Saying Fergie is a useless tactician is just laughable. You can't compare any manager's recent success to his. Some of his transfer targets have been shite, and after 99 the club really should have been more ruthless with buying and selling players, but you can't doubt the man's managerial accumen simply because of what he's won. United have dominated English football for the past 13 years and it's no secret that a huge part of that success comes from excellent management.

This season we have played like a team without a central midfield: because we don't have worldclass central midfielders any more.

[gollan]

No system. I'm not saying your weren't a good team at 99, but you weren't the best (Juve was), fortunate is a very humble word to use for those 3 minutes, and as far as I can recall Sir Alex always employed a tactical aid, unlike other managers. If you follow basketball you could say that Phil Jackson (a legend if you look at success) is similar to Fergie - a great person-to-person manager, but no tactics. Utd success has a lot to do with Kenyon and the fact that they enjoyed (up until recently) an overwhelming advantage as far as bank account is considered, although like you said you bought great players who weren't suitable for your game. That's the problem. You can't use a tactical player in a team that has no system.

[-=[101st]=-]

Lol, Phil Jackson didn't need tactics when he had Kobe and Shaq on the same side, if ur team is good enough they can play well with no tactics, but with no tactics your effectively shooting yourself in the foot

[Akineye]

That's laughable.

but you weren't the best (Juve was)

We progressed from one of the hardest groups in Champion's League history before going on to beat Inter, Juve and Bayern Munich. Juve scraped through a mediocre group before playing the mighty Olympiakos. Juve were a class side with world class players like Zidane and Del Piero at their top form, but it's ludicros to suggest that United didn't deserve to win the Champions League that season despite beating the best teams in Europe at that point.

And I say that we were fortunate in the final. Fortunate to score two late goals, but to win the game without two of the best midfielders in the world at that time was a huge achievement in itself. Over the course of the Champions League competition only an idiot would argue that we weren't the best performing team in Europe.

Utd success has a lot to do with Kenyon

Kenyon was probably the main reason why United DIDN'T enjoy more success over the past few years.

[gollan]

All you do, and all Alex does, is still live on the glory of 99'. A glorious year indeed, but remember I didn't start watching football that year and I didn't stop afterwards. And I'm not familiar with the term "deserve" in football tournaments (not championships). Greece deserved to win the Euro? Porto deserved to win last year CL? You are not a young kid yourself, you must remember stuff, and you were not a kid in 99' either. So yeah, IMO Juve was the best team playing in 99' despite losing to you (in a great match) but still I maintain that 99' Juve was a better team than 99' Utd, and that's a very valid argument. That has a lot to do with me thinking that winning the scudetto is a much harder job than winning the EPL but that's a whole different story.

What a load of shit. Kenyon's the only reason why you had the money flowing in all those years.

[Darth Daft]

but still I maintain that 99' Juve was a better team than 99' Utd, and that's a very valid argument. That has a lot to do with me thinking that winning the scudetto is a much harder job than winning the EPL but that's a whole different story.

youre a prat. winning seria a isnt better than winning the TREBLE whilst beating 99% of the top teams in the CL along the way and defeating Arsenal in the FA cup in the same year.

If Juve were the better team they would have beaten united, end of.

[gollan]

youre a prat.
Wow. I'm a prat for having my own opinion. I guess it never occured to you that it's OK to have an opinion, not OK to use bad language against people who have an opinion, and a bad idea when those people are staff.

If Juve were the better team they would have beaten united, end of.
Like I said before - do you really think Porto were the best team in 2004? Or Greece in the Euro?

[yusuf eeli]

United had a great team in 99 and were by far the best team in the world at that time with the best midfield

[Papa Lazarou]

ANYWAY

Great rsult against Charlton 2day who didnt seem to turn up at all! great goals by smith and rooney. an also Kleberson played well after coming on

[Akineye]

All you do, and all Alex does, is still live on the glory of 99'.

Can you give one example of when Fergie or I have lived on 99'(sic)?

You're entitled to your opinion, but United proved to the vast majority that they were the best team in Europe that season by performing wonderfully in the Champions League and not only winning it, but coming out of the hardest group in the competiton and going on to beat three prior winners.

As for today, good performance. Charlton really played woefully. They had no physical presence whatsoever and we really were passing it around at will. Rooney was another class at times in the match and I am so glad that United can rely on the services of such a talented player for years to come.

Kleberson impressed me too. He isn't world class, but perhaps after some regular first team action he'll be a decent squad player... Still, if anybody wants to buy him I'd listen to all offers.

[marcrulz]

wait a minute, haven't united won 3 titles and an fa cup since '99 oh yeah they have, and kenyon is a complete twat.

[marcrulz]

great united performance, rooney great again.

[Darth Daft]

Wow. I'm a prat for having my own opinion. I guess it never occured to you that it's OK to have an opinion, not OK to use bad language against people who have an opinion, and a bad idea when those people are staff.

hmm, prat is bad language? or perhaps dumb fuck, which you have applied to me is not as bad where you come from?


Like I said before - do you really think Porto were the best team in 2004? Or Greece in the Euro?

Porto & Greece were obviously good teams possibly not the best, as they both won very tough competitions. However you were talking about United, who i believe won THREE very hard competitions in the same year, beating a lot of very good teams, teams most would consider better than Juventus. Yet you still think Juve were better for some reason i couldnt possibly fathom :rolleyes:

[Dreamteam]

what transers do u want united tyo make i think we need a creative midfielder , defensive player to fill keanes position and a winger. Giggs is poor, mainly because he puts in little effort

[Singh]

Well recently i heard the chairman of Psv talking about how its likely that Van bommel will be leaving to go to Man utd or some other team. Van Bommel would be an ideal signing for Man utd.

Rumours-

Bellion- back to Sunderland
Miller- Norwich
Kleberson-Corinthans

[Phatmann]

I'm probably one of very few who would like Bellion to stay at Man U, and I'd like to see Saha go as he's been too injury-prone and now we have too many strikers with the young ones (i.e. Rossi) not being able to break through in the future. I also want Carroll to leave as he has stalled way too long on his contract and obviously wants to leave. I also expect Miller, Kleberson and Richardson to leave in hte summer.

[skullverine]

Well recently i heard the chairman of Psv talking about how its likely that Van bommel will be leaving to go to Man utd or some other team. Van Bommel would be an ideal signing for Man utd.

Rumours-

Bellion- back to Sunderland
Miller- Norwich
Kleberson-Corinthans
that would be cool if van Bommel join Utd.. as for the rumours who to leave, I'd like to see Saha to go to any club because he's too injury prone

[vanNistelrooy]

I don't think Miller will leave, he's been brought in as a youth player. Bellendion and Kleberson can go, but Richardson is finally starting to show some talent, I'd like him to stay.

[marcrulz]

apparantly barca have a 'done deal' with van bommel, ah well.

[Singh]

Van Bommel played well today commanded his team and controlled midfield though when bommel was asked he said i dont know where im going hopefully a big club he said. I hope the barca deal aint done.

[razor]

Again fergie picked a wek tema and we were punished for it. when i saw the starting line up i thought it would be like norwich all over. it was toi some extent. why are players like phil neville, fortune, kleberson and o shea in midfield starting a game for manchester united. is fergie seriouisly trying to get sacked. at this moment in time i hate him more thatn any one in the whole world. he is destroying manchester united. he is an even bigger threat to united than glazer. if having glazer meant fergie would get sacked i would say ok. maybe not that but i seriously am feeling that there is no way back to the top under fergie. were finished unless fergie is sacked at the end of the season.

[vanNistelrooy]

Have you been taking your medication son? Yes, we started with a weaker team, probably because we have Chelsea on Tuesday. If it wasn't for their goalie we'd be 4 up at half time! The longer we went without scoring the second you knew WBA would score, and let's face it, The Horse dived. We played some of our best football in the first half, it was unusual to see Giggs and Ronaldo both playing well in the same game. Finishing 2nd wasn't going to happen, and to be honest we didn't deserve it. Atleast we set up a cracking last day by giving West Brom that point!

[Akineye]

I read in a paper that United are supposed to be trying to buy Ballack as a replacement for Keane. I would love to see Ballack in a United shirt, and I think he'd bring precisely what has been missing from our side this season. Other transfer speculation sees us buying Nigel de Jong and Mark van Bommel but selling Ronaldo and Rio.

If it was Ruud we sold instead of Rio I'd say that would be a good deal.

[Phatmann]

I'm not too sure about Ballack, but I would welcome Van Bommel, definitely. According to Sky Sports, Sagnol is likely to leave Bayern in the summer and may come to us or Arsenal. Sagnol is a great player, but considering he plays right back, it wouldn't be worth us getting him (he's 28 too, so he isn't one for the future), as Gary Neville is one of our most consistent players and we have other areas where we could do with a player or 2. However, Sagnol wouldn't cost us anything and would be good back up, but to be honest he'd be better off at Arsenal as he'd easily get first team there.

Source (http://skysports.planetfootball.com/list.asp?hlid=275246&cpid=22&CLID=1&lid=&title=Sagnol:+United+want+me&channel=Premiership)

[Papa Lazarou]

i say Get Ballack but not Sagnol we need a young right back to replace Gary Neville eventually not someone who will just warm the bench for a few seasons and then retire.

Also i thought Kleberson played well today but i think it may be finnaly time to get rid of Phill Neville cause he didnt play too well and will only warmt the bench form now on

[Phatmann]

The problem is: Who wants Phil Neville? I can't see many teams rushing to sign him for their team. Possibly one of the promoted teams might try, but then again I don't see Fergie selling him as he sees him as a useful utility player.

Kleberson started off well, with some good off the ball runs and neat passing, but towards the end he missed a couple of good chances and was losing the ball more often.

[skullverine]

i say Get Ballack but not Sagnol we need a young right back to replace Gary Neville eventually not someone who will just warm the bench for a few seasons and then retire.


Brown can be his replacement.. or maybe Spector

[Phatmann]

Brown can be his replacement.. or maybe Spector
True, or even Phil Bardsley, who in my opinion could be a very good player in the future and would probably have ahd a few 1st team games this season had he not broken his leg. But Brown seems to play a lot better at right bck than centre back, as there is less responsibility I guess, and I'd like to see Spector go on loan to a half-decent side (like Richardson has) to get him some first team experience, as it seems to have helped Richardson a lot.

[uA - 1905]

Did anyone else notice that WBA's penalty should have been disallowed?

[vanNistelrooy]

They had a couple of players running in the box before he took it, as Carrol had a moan at, but then again so did we, so the ref couldn't really disallow it.

[Papa Lazarou]

I Didnt think it was even a penalty to be honest!!

[vanNistelrooy]

Neither did I, then again we've had out fair few dodgy pens (nearly all of them).

[razor]

I would love ballack at united. i have said before we need a player like him and the other players like him dont seem likely to be leaving their clubs at the end of the season, but ballack could be persuaded. then again if it is at the expense of rio and ronaldo i would never say yes. rio is one of the reasons why we actually have finished 3rd rather than 4th. our defense has been good to some extent. just the keepers arent brilliant and we couldve conceded even less goals this season in my opinion. up front we havent scored enough goals and van nistelrooy can change all that next season, but not on his own. he needs someone to create chances for him, which we dont have and ballack i think would do that/.

[Phatmann]

http://www.manutd.com/news/fullstory.sps?iNewsid=155315&itype=466&icategoryid=119

Man U alerts straight to your desktop. Could be handy after the season has finished.

[Pablo Diablo]

we need a goallie though theres talk of casllias

[Papa Lazarou]

well a poor performance tonite against Chelsea. i thought that Scholsey and Keane (as much as i think theyre great players) werent really there at all. i thought we looked stale and maybe we need some new signings to get us up an runnin again

[Gary G]

well a poor performance tonite against Chelsea. i thought that Scholsey and Keane (as much as i think theyre great players) werent really there at all. i thought we looked stale and maybe we need some new signings to get us up an runnin again

How did you feel Van Nistelooy played? I know he scored but he seemed quiet. He is also the type of player that relies on service, and he didn't get much of that tonight.

[Papa Lazarou]

How did you feel Van Nistelooy played? I know he scored but he seemed quiet. He is also the type of player that relies on service, and he didn't get much of that tonight.


I agree that he was quiet and i do think it was down to the service that he was (or wasnt) getting

[Phatmann]

How did you feel Van Nistelooy played? I know he scored but he seemed quiet. He is also the type of player that relies on service, and he didn't get much of that tonight.
Yep, wasn't seen for much of the match due to lack of good service, but mainly because Chelsea threw everything behind the ball and blocked any way of getting through, then hit us on the counter. Very disappointing overall performance though, Wes Brown cannot play centre back, keep him as a right back cover.

[Singh]

A match full of mistakes by Man utd-:

Maybe the keeper to blame for the 1st. G neville got caught sleeping and Eidur scored good goal. Brown gave the ball away for the third goal

Overall chelsea played well and deserved the victory however man utd did play well in 1st half but didnt look up to it in the 2nd half sad to see the stadium nearly empty considering the last home match.

To the fa cup final...

[marcrulz]

poor stuff, I didnt think chelsea were excellent, I think we were quite bad, though I still hope we can win the fa cup, come on united!!

[Harry-Kewell]

Man Utd were bloody awful yesterday, credit to the Chelsea reserves for making them look that bad. I thoroughly enjoyed the game and it was surprisingly one of the best performances I've seen from Chelsea this season.

[Singh]

Chelsea reserves?

makelele, lampard, johnson, gudjohnsen, carvalho, cole?.

[razor]

i heard someone say chelsea reserves too, how on earth was it? if its because terry was missing, we had heinze missing, gudjohnsen is their best striker so you cant say drogba was missing. duff was missing and so was giggs. robben hasnt played most of the season so you cant count him.

i blame carrol for the loss, i put all the blame on him and no-one else, well maybe chelseas luck that they have been gettin all season. the amount of matches theyve one by a deflected goal. yesterday a keeper mistake and an offside goal won it them.
lucky to get away witht the foul on valdes in the champions league. saying that thoiugh i still believe they were the best team in the premiership over the course of the season.

as much as i hate to admit it though i think arsenal have the best tema in thte premiership, chelsea the best manager, united have a manager who is passed it, no creativity in the team, no set piece takers, rubish keepers (although they arent helped by fergie swapping them everytime one makes a mistake, bringing their confidence down even more.), no transfer monety to sort the situation out, LOOKS LIKE WE WONT BE WINNING THE LEAGUE FOR A WHILE!!! MAYBE A LONG WHILE!!!!


the situation can only get worse as long as fergie is there. i wish we lose to arsenal and southampton so maybe fergie could possibly get sacked

[Phatmann]

Yep, our 2 main problems I think are: 1) Our keeper situation and 2) No creativity. It shows how much selling Beckham hurt us, it has done huge damage, and if he was still here, we might not have had such a bad financial year as we have. When we got a free kick when we had Beckham, I felt that we could get a goal out of it or at least a good chance, but nowadays I'd rather we didn't get any free kicks cos we never create anything with it, just lose possession or play it back to the defence.

With regards to keepers, I agree that both Carroll and Howard have suffered (confidence-wise) due to constant changing, and I seriously hope Carroll doesn't sign a new contract, and we try as hard as possible to get a new keeper.

I also agree that Fergie is past his prime but I feel maybe he should resign rather than the baord sacking him, and I think next season should be his last, if we don't start playing to our potential or don;t get anyone new in.

[ChelseaDave]

Chelsea reserves, We're having a laugh! Chelsea reserves, We're having a laugh!

How can you blame Roy Carrol? I doubt even some of the best keepers could have got to Tiago's shot. Personally, i think Tiago deserves more credit, as all of the attention was diverted to Roy Carrol not diving.

Terry, Duff, Robben, Cech, Drogba, Kezman, Ferreira, Bridge and Parker all out.
Plus we had Gallas (legend) playing out of position, and Geremi actually starting.

Utd had only Heinze and Giggs out, barring them two, it was their best team out last night.

If that's not losing to a weakened Chelsea team, i don't know what is.

Oh, and Christiano Ronaldo is a prick. I salute you Robert Huth, for crunching that bastard.

[razor]

Terry, Duff, Robben, Cech, Drogba, Kezman, Ferreira, Bridge and Parker all out.
Plus we had Gallas (legend) playing out of position, and Geremi actually starting.


apart from the first three, for which i have already given explanations, if hte others played then i would ccall it a chelseas reserve team. since when have kezman, parker and bridge (if he was that good you wouldnt want a new left back) first team players. ferraira is one i missed but i thinkn most ppeople admit he isnt the best of players. he doesnt have an impact. and even if tyou say he was missing, 1 player missing doesnt mean its your reserve team. stop oerhyping your victory. you didnt deserve to win 3-1!

[codename 47]

The news most manchester united fans didn't want to hear as its been revelaved that malcom glazer has made an official bid of £790 million for manchester united
many analyst are saying he's very near to a take over after he brought the irish duo's share, JP McManus and John Magnier's 28.7 percent stake.

Glazer is the majority shareholder at United after buying Irish racing tycoons JP McManus and John Magnier's 28.7 percent stake.
The owner of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers NFL team now owns 56.8 percent of The Red Devils after adding to his existing 28.1 percent share in the club.
It is bad news for the supporters who have strongly opposed the takeover and threatened to boycott matches and sponsors associated with the club in protest.
Glazer had been given until May 17 to 'put up or shut up' but his ability to persuade McManus and Magnier to sell their stake has completely altered the picture regarding ownership of the club.
With that obstacle out of the way, the path seems clear for the American businessman to take over the Old Trafford outfit.

[Jonny2J]

its all the so called 'fans' deserve after the disgraceful staying for the othernights lap of honour

[Jonny2J]

the thing with this is as the bloke on Sky Sports has just said, he's jacking his season ticket in, it's the real supporters who will suffer, like the one's who stayed behind for the lap of honour and not the plastic one's who just fucked off

[codename 47]

the thing with this is as the bloke on Sky Sports has just said, he's jacking his season ticket in, it's the real supporters who will suffer, like the one's who stayed behind for the lap of honour and not the plastic one's who just fucked off

Yeah i've just been listening to that guy as well,you could tell by his voice how dissapointed and upset he was about the whole thing

[7RONALDO7]

this is a joke, Glazer is just a fat nob who doesnt know anything about football, he hasn't ever been over in Engalnd in his life!

[Singh]

Looking bad...

If he gets 75% plus one share, United could be delisted from the stock exchange and Mr Glazer could transfer his debt onto the club.

If he can get 90% plus one share, he can make a compulsory purchase and scoop up the other 10% of the club's shares.

United's shares rose 34.25p, or 12.9%, to 299.25p shortly after the announcement.

[Akineye]

its all the so called 'fans' deserve after the disgraceful staying for the othernights lap of honour

That is a much better way of making a statement than a boycott of the match would have been.

[Darth Daft]

its all over bar the shouting, by tomorrow he'll be in complete control.

a dark day for english football this is.

well f*cked off to say the least. Uncertain times ahead. :unsure:

[codename 47]

I still don't quite understand what glazer has to gain from this takeover deal
many analysts have said there's no business sense in the package he's put together
and its very unlikely fergie will be given any funds come the summer

[Papa Lazarou]

It's truly a dark day for this club it has sunk to the level of Chelsea. It has ceased to be a club and is now officially a Business

[razor]

I think its the nail in the coffin for manchester united. we were going downhill and glazer has just is about to push us to the bottom even quicker.

i can seriously see him selling the stadium and that will get rid of our biggest means of making money.

[codename 47]

People are suggesting he'll sell the lease of the staduim to pay for the debts or something like that
even sir alex's future has been cast into huge doubt

[razor]

even sir alex's future has been cast into huge doubt

I dont really mind that to be honest.

[codename 47]

I dont really mind that to be honest.

:laugh:

are you one of those people that believe he should never have changed his mind over his retirement ?

[razor]

:laugh:

are you one of those people that believe he should never have changed his mind over his retirement ?


I sure am. i think since then the club has only got worse and hasn't improved in the slightest.

[codename 47]

I sure am. i think since then the club has only got worse and hasn't improved in the slightest.

I think you could be right in a way
i think it was the sun newspaper that had some stats on Man utd what they won before his retirment date and what they've won after it don't make for good reading for man utd fans

Also points out fergies transfer deals since,players like djemba-djemba,kleberson and bellion :rolleyes:
i don't think they're of the man utd quiality

[marcrulz]

he hasnt got us yet, we will fight him to HIS death, fuck off u yankee bastard (sorry to american ppl)

[razor]

he is 78, hes going to die in a couple of years anyway.

i heard he bought the club because his sons watch the premiership. if they actually have an interest in the sport and united, maybe when malcolm dies they could do a better job.


by the way im just trying to be optimistic here.

[pokey]

how crap will man utds stats be on pro evo in a few years? lol
just a thought

[razor]

how crap will man utds stats be on pro evo in a few years? lol
just a thought


they are already really underrated.

[pokey]

thats what my mate says...
mere excuses for getting beat...
3 of my mates are man utd fans... wonder who they'll support next week

[neo1983]

All the best players gone now!

Rio, Rooney and more!