Fix The GK's

[Dundon's]

If there's only one post you pay attention to in this entire section then it should be this one.

The goalkeepers in PES are a complete joke and are a shadow of the goalkeepers I remember in the earlier games where it was nearly impossible to just tap the button and finish.

In fact I can remember the whole thing about the older titles was the persons ability to finish from insane positions. That one thing alone inevitably lead to folks needing to be more creative in their attacks instead of this tapping shoot at the goal "FIFA" rubbish with you've d-evolved into. Make it harder to score and then it's always more rewarding when the deadlock gets broken.

I have the feeling you've done this in general in order to make it more appealing to less talented gamers of this world (Fifa heads) but the truth of the matter is you've sold us loyal fans down the river and we've really just about given up all hope on the good old days ever returning.

I could now move onto how the rest of the game sucks too but I haven't the energy or any faith that you'll even read or take any of these suggestions into account, but believe me, release another shit title again and you're finished.

P.S. I've lost nearly 3 years of playing this game because you messed it up so bad. :)

[shaun7]

^I don't want superhuman goalkeepers though. I want more realistic goalkeeping but not have the keepers save more. They alreadysave enough but in some situations they don't act realistic. Ok maybe make shooting more accurate or make it more possible to shoot in the top corner and then make keeprs save a bit more. But not superhumans.

[Dundon's]

I'm not asking for much fella, just like they used to be. Bloody hell I remember even saving loads of quality stops right up as far as PES6, then it went tits up, one was Pele V Banks. Now days they just stand there and watch the ball go past them, along with that the spillage is way too much.

Old skool keepers, like the rare auld times. :)

[shaun7]

^Pes 5 and 6 had the best goalkeepers true. In 6 they sometimes exagerated but they were still beter than in 09.

[dan80]

i jsut hate the stupid mistakes they cant catch a ball they dive for it and it lands at the strikers feet or they dont strech for saves yeah we dont want superhuman but they need to be imporved a lot also why cant u slide with keepers u come out the box and he wont attempt to slide tackle only try and kick it but really poorly

[liverpoolsco]

I would be careful what you say here.... The title isn't gonna make anyone sit up and take notice and the rules of the forum do say to keep things even and not just start swearing and badmouthing everything. Also you look at the amount of times keepers are rooted to the spot back in older versions of PES and you will see that the keepers are better. Not perfect by any means but better. If your moaning about scoaring I don't think its totally down to the keepers though there are things which could be improved like there catching of the ball or parrying or coming to collect loose balls on the ground or from the air. Though I do think that on the whole they have got better... So just be careful before you start ranting.

[Dundon's]

I would be careful what you say here.... The title isn't gonna make anyone sit up and take notice and the rules of the forum do say to keep things even and not just start swearing and badmouthing everything. Also you look at the amount of times keepers are rooted to the spot back in older versions of PES and you will see that the keepers are better. Not perfect by any means but better. If your moaning about scoaring I don't think its totally down to the keepers though there are things which could be improved like there catching of the ball or parrying or coming to collect loose balls on the ground or from the air. Though I do think that on the whole they have got better... So just be careful before you start ranting.

Jog on junior. ;)

[shaun7]

i jsut hate the stupid mistakes they cant catch a ball they dive for it and it lands at the strikers feet or they dont strech for saves yeah we dont want superhuman but they need to be imporved a lot also why cant u slide with keepers u come out the box and he wont attempt to slide tackle only try and kick it but really poorly

True. That's why I said, they need toact more realistic.

[liverpoolsco]

Jog on junior. ;)

Not funny. Don't start making it personal. Fine you disagree thats fine. I never said that the keepers were perfect. I think that there is a lot that they can't do which real keepers do in real life but I don't think that there as terrible as you make out. They can be really good if you have a good keeper in the game. There have been a good few occasions where a good keeper has kept me from a humbling when my defence is being torn apart... I just think you have to be a bit more balanced and not just like this :realmad: thats all. You did read the forum rules for this section right?:unsure:
Oh and quoting Hot Fuzz... very clever...
"Nicholas Angel: Well, there was the part that you missed where I distracted him with the cuddle monkey then i said play times over and I hit him in the head with the peace lily.
Danny Butterman: You're off the ****in' chain!"

[Dundon's]

Not funny. Don't start making it personal. Fine you disagree thats fine. I never said that the keepers were perfect. I think that there is a lot that they can't do which real keepers do in real life but I don't think that there as terrible as you make out. They can be really good if you have a good keeper in the game. There have been a good few occasions where a good keeper has kept me from a humbling when my defence is being torn apart... I just think you have to be a bit more balanced and not just like this :realmad: thats all. You did read the forum rules for this section right?:unsure:
Oh and quoting Hot Fuzz... very clever...
"Nicholas Angel: Well, there was the part that you missed where I distracted him with the cuddle monkey then i said play times over and I hit him in the head with the peace lily.
Danny Butterman: You're off the ****in' chain!"

Hot Fuzz? I haven't a clue what you're talking about fella but rep for you for the rant. :laugh:

[FutebolArte]

why they got rid of manual keeper is beyond me...

[CryingGallas]

In the game the goalkeeprs and the refs need the total overhauls!

[Du 1337]

I agree w/ Dundon's. The goalkeepers really need to be fixed.

Some examples why they are a joke:

*When u make the GK come out, they just walk forward instead of going in the direction of the player having the ball. Even when the player with the ball comes from the side...

*When u make the GK come out and the ball bounces in the direction of the keeper, he just slides right over/under it, wich 99% results in a goal.

*When u pass back to the keeper and u try to fill the keeper's kickbar, he just slides to the ball instead of giving a powerfull kick. He acts just like a striker, trying to hit the ball with his toe...

*The keeper stomps the ball away too many times when there aren't even players around him. He is too afraid to hold the ball... He also always does it when u hold the Y button...

All these GK disabillities are really crucial and when the keeper has a role in the end result of the game, it usually comes to these points written above...

Make the goalies more powerfull and smarter... Pretty please with sugar on top, served on a golden plate.

NOTE: Just don't post angry messages. It really does not encourage KONAMI to change anything about the game...

[mufcsean]

3.) Goalkeepers

I don't know which person from the Konami team thought it would be funny to make the goalkeepers the way they are but my god he/she isn't as funny as what they think they are.

Numerous times i have watched the opposition get into the box and shoot only for my keeper to done one of the following;

Dive the wrong way
Dive backwards
Stand still despite the ball being hit within inches of reach
Dive on the floor before a shot is even took
save the first shot and drop it straight to another attacker who can't miss

Frankly the keepers are horrible and whoever was in charge of programming them should be sacked.

That is what i said in my post here (http://www.pesgaming.com/showthread.php?t=71132)

[shaun7]

^The above, does happen in rwal life but not like in pes 09. So yeah it needs fixing.

[Dundon's]

That is what i said in my post here (http://www.pesgaming.com/showthread.php?t=71132)

Yes, that is exactly what I'm talking about and regards saying it politely?

Just look where that has gotten us, the game is a shambles. :)

[SuperSwede]

I have not read the whole thread. But one thing that I realy hate is when you pass the ball back to your goalkeeper and instead of kick it away he attempt to make a sliding tackle. It looks very stupid and often they opponent scores. Please do something!

[fred741]

What I think needs fixing most urgently is the way that, if a shot is hit from anywhere within about 12 yards of the goal, without necessarily being hit especially hard, and almost straight at the goalkeeper, they will frequently fail to save it, making either an inappropriate reaction (including the one-arm-lunge thing - what's that about? No keeper would ever do that in real life) or reacting far, far too slowly. It really detracts from the realism of the game.

[What Lad]

do any of you use manual goalkeeper cursor? makes goalkeepers vastly improved and if you have someone like buffon vs adriano, you can be confident in most 1-1 situations

they removed this feature from 2009 though (WHY KONAMI WHAT IN GOD'S NAME, IF IT AIN'T BROKE, DON'T REMOVE IT ENTIRELY)

[liverpoolsco]

What I think needs fixing most urgently is the way that, if a shot is hit from anywhere within about 12 yards of the goal, without necessarily being hit especially hard, and almost straight at the goalkeeper, they will frequently fail to save it, making either an inappropriate reaction (including the one-arm-lunge thing - what's that about? No keeper would ever do that in real life) or reacting far, far too slowly. It really detracts from the realism of the game.

Yeah I agree that can be annoying and unrealistic. Some of the saves are great first time shot saves but let themselves down by letting the ball go loose. Now most keepers are either able to hold onto the ball firmly or palm it safe past his post or far enough away from the goal that its not a direct threat. Or punch it into the ground and from there can catch it! I certainly think that there could be improvements on this!
Have a look at these real keepers:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0JvrzoYj2g Reina
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFwPqE7_S5M Cesar
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbbdbRKocWc Carasso
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aescClERG_U Wiese
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZvfSLiT4g8k Buffon
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4YFmdDJERlc James
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRqhNNvcmxU Robinson


do any of you use manual goalkeeper cursor? makes goalkeepers vastly improved and if you have someone like buffon vs adriano, you can be confident in most 1-1 situations

they removed this feature from 2009 though (WHY KONAMI WHAT IN GOD'S NAME, IF IT AIN'T BROKE, DON'T REMOVE IT ENTIRELY)

Yeah I did used to use manual keeper and to be honest it was good and bad. It all depended on how good the keeper was! Over the years the keepers did evolve and improve so it was a really useful tool to have. I agree that I was sad to see it go. I think that having control over all players including the keeper is necessary. A system of manual keeper and semi-fixed control over the players. Come on keep the language clean man! We all can tell by now you don't like Konami but just keep it respectful!

[liverpoolsco]

Yes, that is exactly what I'm talking about and regards saying it politely?

Just look where that has gotten us, the game is a shambles. :)

Look I don't think the game is a shambles. I mean PES 2008 wasn't as great as it could have been but I think that PES 2009 was a good game. I mean older PES games were nowhere neer perfect! There were certainly a lot of problems with them but I do feel that PES 2009 was an improvement on them. Its not perfect by any means but its still a great improvement. I am not saying there aren't things they need to work on and improve and fix but I am saying that its nothing huge at one go so you don't go man this so different from the last game... but look back a few titles and see the difference.
As for being polite getting anywhere? I think this forum is proof that if you keep getting onto Konami and keep it polite that you will get your voice heard! Persistance and being strong with your points but not being insulting!

[shaun7]

^pes 2009 wasn't a bad game, but everyone expected more because it's next gen time not ps2 anymore.

[What Lad]

that's where you're wrong. it WAS a bad game. i still play 2008 on the PS2, because its still fun. i still play pro 6 on xbox live, because its still fun.

my xbox 2008 and 2009 games only have dust for comfort

[Dundon's]

As for being polite getting anywhere? I think this forum is proof that if you keep getting onto Konami and keep it polite that you will get your voice heard! Persistance and being strong with your points but not being insulting!



So lets get this right here, we go out and get stung for over 100 bucks on 2 incomplete titles and we're not supposed to get fired up when we're giving feedback?

Gimme a break... we're doing them a favor here, they're the ones trying to make a killing off selling us muck for the last couple of years and are blessed that we're still even sticking around for this 2010 version which has the tell tales signs of failure all over it already only because it still looks like an improved version of 2009 and not a complete revamp which was badly needed.

Anyways all these comments are falling of def ears otherwise they'd of removed those ridiculous and gigantic shorts which are just pure :facepalm:.

[liverpoolsco]

Now, you say that they shouldn't release a game every year, well thats up to Konami what they do, no one is forcing you to buy the game every year! If you don't like it don't buy it! Wait to real some reviews of the game or play the demo so you can see what its like! No one is forcing anyone to go out and buy the game, you always have the choice to say no! So on that point your argument doesn't hold up.

Like I say its up to you to shell out the money for the game. If you don't like the game don't buy it! Simple as! There are plenty of games I don't buy and I am sure that the Developers aren't bothered at all about me not buying there games! Now if everyone agreed with you then the sales of PES would have dropped. Actually the opposite is true. I have looked through Konami's figures and the sales of PES have grown year on year so they must doing something right. Maybe you don't agree thats fine but the facts speak for themselves and like I said no one is putting a gun to your head to buy the game? Ok?

[Dundon's]

Like I say its up to you to shell out the money for the game. If you don't like the game don't buy it! Simple as! There are plenty of games I don't buy and I am sure that the Developers aren't bothered at all about me not buying there games! Now if everyone agreed with you then the sales of PES would have dropped. Actually the opposite is true. I have looked through Konami's figures and the sales of PES have grown year on year so they must doing something right. Maybe you don't agree thats fine but the facts speak for themselves and like I said no one is putting a gun to your head to buy the game? Ok?

But what if the game played a big part in your life like I know it did mine when it was in it's prime? (Don't take that literally now)

You also fail to address the fact that PES was the only playable Football game knocking about for years and now that it's lost it's magic we're left with a big empty void, the majority been major Football fans and all that....

[liverpoolsco]

But what if the game played a big part in your life like I know it did mine when it was in it's prime? (Don't take that literally now)

You also fail to address the fact that PES was the only playable Football game knocking about for years and now that it's lost it's magic we're left with a big empty void, the majority been major Football fans and all that....

Yeah I can understand your frustration. I mean its your own opinion that older games were PES' prime. To be honest I found earlier versions like PES 3 and PES 4 hugely frustrating at times but it didn't stop me playing them as I wanted to work round the faults and enjoy the game. Now I wouldn't agree that the latest 2 games were "unplayable" there certainly not what you might have expected but I think mistakes were made with 2008 and in 2009 they did actually go a long way to fix a lot of them. Not perfectly but it was an improvement. Now, looking back to older versions of PES it did take then a long while to get a good game. Like I said I found 3 and 4 difficult before 5 came out which was much better in my view and then 6. I remember reading an interview with Seabass on the Konami website saying that he hadn't know how good PES6 had been and how much work that they had put into it with all the refinements over the years until they came to rebuild it for PES 2008. Now I am not saying that got it all right in 2008 or 2009 but I do think that 2009 is a good game on its own and comparing it to older incarnations is not a fair comparison. Though the lesson of them improving the game each year does still hold true in my view. Your entitled to your own and I think that should be the end of this.... anyway this was set up to talk about goalkeepers and fixing them!!

[Dundon's]

Yeah I can understand your frustration. I mean its your own opinion that older games were PES' prime. To be honest I found earlier versions like PES 3 and PES 4 hugely frustrating at times but it didn't stop me playing them as I wanted to work round the faults and enjoy the game. Now I wouldn't agree that the latest 2 games were "unplayable" there certainly not what you might have expected but I think mistakes were made with 2008 and in 2009 they did actually go a long way to fix a lot of them. Not perfectly but it was an improvement. Now, looking back to older versions of PES it did take then a long while to get a good game. Like I said I found 3 and 4 difficult before 5 came out which was much better in my view and then 6. I remember reading an interview with Seabass on the Konami website saying that he hadn't know how good PES6 had been and how much work that they had put into it with all the refinements over the years until they came to rebuild it for PES 2008. Now I am not saying that got it all right in 2008 or 2009 but I do think that 2009 is a good game on its own and comparing it to older incarnations is not a fair comparison. Though the lesson of them improving the game each year does still hold true in my view. Your entitled to your own and I think that should be the end of this.... anyway this was set up to talk about goalkeepers and fixing them!!

All fair points mate, I just want to see the game get justice to it's legacy, that is all.

Just for the record let it be known that I'm one of the good guys here, not some undercover Fifa fan boy getting in some cheap kicks while the game is down. ;)

[liverpoolsco]

All fair points mate, I just want to see the game get justice to it's legacy, that is all.

Just for the record let it be known that I'm one of the good guys here, not some undercover Fifa fan boy getting in some cheap kicks while the game is down. ;)

he he glad to hear it! Now yeah going back to your original point I do think that the keepers could be improved. If you have a look I think it is a my thread... if your a fan of PES part 1 then you will see my suggestions for the keepers. I would love to see the keepers in game react just like those which I posted in the videos!

[vdsf1]

^Pes 5 and 6 had the best goalkeepers true. In 6 they sometimes exagerated but they were still beter than in 09.

what about pes 4 if you don't look to the issues
if the goalkeepers have the skills from pes 4 and the ai from iss deluxe
about pes 3 i don't know sure

[vdsf1]

^Pes 5 and 6 had the best goalkeepers true.

pes 4?

[Dragonfly]

I'd like to see goalies spit into their gloves when about the defend a free-kick or penalty.