Archive for July, 2009
Posted by dougiedonut in PES 2009 News on Thu 30 Jul 2009
So after another pounding in the comments section to last week’s article, I’ve dressed my wounds, and have come back out for another round. I’ve had comments ranging from being told I’m backtracking, to me talking from out of my arse.
I’ve also had a little support which has softened the abuse, but I’d like to expand a little more on where I’m coming from.
Up until the PES2009 release, we’ve not had any direct input into the series. We’ve always discussed what future installments of the game we would like to include. We’ve moaned about features that we wished were in the game, we’ve been angry about AI, and annoying features which seem to remain in the game each year. But we’ve never fed into the process before. Overall we’ve been pretty much happy to stick with PES regardless of this fact. PES2008 and PES2009 however marked a turning point in what we consider acceptable from the series. The less said about PES2008 the better, and PES2009 felt more like what PES2008 should have been, but was still flawed.
I had a little play on PES2009 the other night and remembered quickly why it’s been so long since I last played it.
Having played the PES2010 demo (albeit with a faint memory of it now), I can safely say that we have moved away from the direction we were under with PES2008/9. Why is it that I think the demo gives me hope for the future?
Up until PES2009, Konami have progressed the series as they saw fit. But they are more than aware that it wasn’t the commercial success that they’ve been accustomed to. They were willing now to listen to us, the real fans of the game, to define the shape of the game. For me, that is a major breakthrough, and in truth, I think it is amazing that this is happening. I am an ordinary bloke, just like most of you, and just want to play the best football game possible. I’m sure many of you will agree with me when I say that this can only truly be possible with Konami.
I laughed at the comment left by someone as “Anonymous” who said that I probably feel like part of the PES team now.
Well for your information mate, I happen to have a PES2009 cardboard cutout of Messi, which Jon Murphy kindly gave me when I visited his office last year! In fact, I’ve had the cutout next to my desk in my office ever since.
Not only that, but one of my mates at work (Respect going out to my main man Dave Pegler! No longer at the company, and sorely missed by me) even printed out a mugshot of myself and placed it over Messi’s head. I wasn’t aware that Konami had a range of goodies including caps and key rings, so thanks for bringing that to my attention.
The underlying argument that this message had was that we’re being taken for fools, and that we’re just another promotional team for Konami. You couldn’t be any more wrong if you tried, though I don’t think it is outside the realms of possibility that you would challenge that.
The way I see it, as of the inception of PES2010 production, we are being listened to. It would be unbelievable if 100% of what we are asking for is implemented first time. That is just not going to happen, take it from me.
BUT if we see enough from Konami which shows that they have well and truly moved away from the PES production direction prior to our intervention, and are now developing the series more in line with what we want, THEN we need to be more supportive whilst this transition takes place.
As Dan has gone to great lengths to stress regularly, we only deal in facts, not gossip. I am not going to try to pull the wool over your eyes in any shape or form. To even suggest that we are trying to dress up PES2010 is ludicrous.
For the people that believe that we are doing that – ask yourselves this:
How long could we possibly get away with telling you guys porky pies? As soon as PES2010 is formally released, the game would be up for PESGaming.com. We could never recover from the lack of misplaced faith IF we did such a thing.
Some of you are asking why it is that FIFA is able to go from 8 way last year to 360 control for FIFA ‘10, and why PES isn’t doing the same. Well they’re two different games, made by different people with different focuses.
I believe PES2010 is going to give us a new direction. We have already seen some evidence of Konami catering to our needs. The demo was evidence of that (granted we need to see the next build to be more confident of this), and the last batch of screenshots for the Master League changes again demonstrates this. There are more news articles being lined up to further surprise us (I don’t have details of these yet).
As you guys will have seen, Jon Murphy has in fact felt it necessary to issue a statement on this site to try to reach out to us. This is evidence of Konami listening. We’ve been crying out for them to do just that for years, and now that they are – why are we so negative?
Yes I know there are underlying faults with the game, but they’re being addressed. The list of four items that I gave last week which are my mark of “success” for PES2010 for me is a minimum requirement. I’m not saying that is all that they have to do, but it will be a great start.
passthedutchie was having a go at me too. I hear what you are saying mate, but you would have to agree that there are plenty of horror stories of people changing how they work too. I bet you can’t claim to have a 100% effective working system now that you’ve changed either! Plus I’m talking about business culture change, not the cultural change of working from a single national to a multi-national development team, which is what you’re talking about.
Dave O asked me to confirm whether: “3) a return to the control system of PES6 which allows you to use the right analog stick to perform tricks”
As far as i can recall, it had the same control system as PES 09 for tricks BUT that doesn’t mean it still is present now. There will be a play test again soon, and then I will provide a fully comprehensive list of features, with respect to the NDA applied. Fingers crossed on the control system being changed!
So in summary, I’m a huge fan of PES. The fact that I write for PESGaming.com in my own time, especially given a currently very hectic period in my personal life (all good stuff!), is evident of that. If I was stranded on a small island and had access to only one game to play (don’t ask how this scenario could ever actually happen), then it would be PES (hopefully a perfect PES2010 edition). No other game is capable of giving the innate satisfaction that this series brings. If there is any way for me to try to help it improve, then I’m willing to go the extra mile to help.
I know many of you are like me, and have been brilliant with your comments and feedback. I don’t just mean with the positive messages, but also with the respectful negative comments too. We are being heard by Konami and we’re making a difference. For those of you who don’t believe that, and think PES2010 is a failure, even before it has been developed fully, then good luck to you.
I have been harsh with comments about PES in the past. I need only remind people of my overview of PES2009/FIFA2009 which resulted in people baying for my blood to prove that. But everything I do, I do because I want to see PES improved. PES has to get back to where it belongs, and I personally believe that a solid two year period (for which I define the PES2010 final release being the end of year one) will be required to get PES back on top. The alternative is too painful to contemplate.
FIFA has been terrible for years, and yet their loyal fans stuck by them year in, year out hoping for a better game. Crazy, but loyal.
They’ve pretty much had a 15 year wait for a half decent game. I’m not saying to accept a poor game this year, but to accept a game which is changing for the better, and which will contain many changes we want to see introduced. Obviously there will be aspects which we may be dissappointed with, but is waiting another year to see them addressed really asking for too much? If Konami are changing and we see in PES2010 enough evidence to prove it, surely we can work with them even harder for PES2011 to be exactly what we want?
My only request to people when the leave comments on this site for any article published, is that they are left respectfully. Some people have had perfectly good arguments removed because of the additional abuse they put in their posts. I’ve occasionally left a couple of abusive posts in, since I agreed with their underlying message, but for future reference – if you choose to swear and be abusive, then you leave me no choice but to remove comments.
I’d like to remind you all that we have a very exciting 3 month period (roughly) up to the release of PES2010. The time is going to be one hell of a roller coaster ride, and there’s going to be lots of information being thrown your way, so get ready for a historic release.
Finally I’d like to leave you with with this thought:
The difference between an optimist and pessimist is simple. The eventuality is the same, but the journey is so very different.
Thanks for reading.
Dougiedonut
(dougiedonut@pesgaming.com)
Posted by dougiedonut in PES 2009 News on Tue 28 Jul 2009
PES Gaming members have probably been the most hard to convince that WEP are changing and are really making every effort to make improvements that the fans want. That’s not a criticism. I totally understand those feelings. But despite the scepticism, you’ve given the team some great food for thought, so a really big thank you from me for that. I’m now looking forward to reading reactions over the next few weeks to our announcements. I’m really confident we’ll be able to prove WEP has taken you fans seriously and is doing everything to come up with the game you’re asking for. Please keep the comments, suggestions and complaints coming. Your input is essential for now and the future.
Posted by Dan Bolas in Interfering With Play on Tue 28 Jul 2009
IWP League Champion 2009: Ivan Kostic (Internacional)
Welcome to this week’s Interfering With Play. Quite a bit of work done this week towards the new look site, but the next few weeks will see these changes become implemented. I know I might sound a little like a broken record, but I am genuinely looking forward to the end product, and hope you guys appreciate it too! Seeing as this is a site which is based strongly upon its community aspect, I will be more than willing to listen to suggestions or ideas for new features which may be included on the new look PESGaming.com. I am planning to compile a mini survey to ensure the site offers all of your PES needs, along with a few added bonuses on top, so if you would like to add your two cents to what this site should include, feel free to get in contact either via the comments, or the usual e-mail address. With that said, lets crack on with this week’s Interfering With Play.
“Nobody Said It Was Easy”
I start this week following up Double D’s article announcing the latest news regarding the ‘revamped’ Master League. Before I go any further, may I once again reiterate my love of the Master League game mode. I truly believe it is the elite mode in any sports gaming franchise over the past ten years, and feel that Konami struck gold at the perfect time with it. It was a huge gamble to invest a huge chunk of a then Playstation One’s game memory in a fictional game mode, and it is something that could have ruined the games reputation, but as it happens it was the first real game mode to offer longevity to sports titles, and for that should always hold a special place in any football gaming fan’s heart.
With that said, it is obvious, and has been obvious for quite a while that the game mode needs to be brought up to date and modernised for the current gaming market. Following the report from Double D, there are certain aspects that have been changed, the currency being the most sought after. I feel this will bring Master League into a more realistic game environment and hopefully make player values and acquiring new signings slightly more true to life. The youth system is also something which I am very interested in. For many years on PES, I have signed young players who have gone on to win me all the Master League has to offer. Benzema a couple of years ago, and this year has been the turn of Dembele and Witsel fro Belgium. Hopefully, the youth team mode will allow a new batch of players to develop quickly and gain the kind of stats which will make them valuable squad members within weeks rather than seasons.
I am sure Konami will have hidden a few more features within the game mode, and I for one am always up for surprises when playing any new game. However, the one issue that seems to trouble me slightly is the way the menu screen is presented. A couple of weeks ago, I made a big song and dance about how I believed that PES menus in general were out of date. Konami have responded to this (although more than likely off their own back as opposed to anything written here) by changing the way the Master League menu looks, although whether this will be a positive change remains to be seen. What I will say about it is that giving a menu some fresh headers and a different layout doesn’t equate to adding new features (Champions League or Multi Club Management) and therefore I hope Konami sees that these are implemented correctly in time for the games EU release, and that they are complemented and not hindered by the new menu system.
I am always sceptical about reading anything to do with Master League because I feel it is a game mode that needs to be experienced as opposed to being observed or read about. Player development, tactical changes and crucial matches all become part of a Master League campaign, something which can not be emulated nor truly appreciated via screenshots and articles. I look forward to experiencing it this autumn.
“Down Boy”
Little point now regarding all the ‘negativity’ seemingly expressed upon this site. I have been writing this column for almost 2 years now and have experienced a wide variety of opinions. Around 18 months ago, Double D used to be a regular contributor to the Interfering With Play comments section, and in this time, he expressed a similar style of writing and similar views to those which he posts today. I am not agreeing with his comments, nor am I rubbishing them, but several people have claimed Double D to be overly critical in his views of the game. This is just his style of writing; a factor that I personally believe makes PESGaming.com unique.
We have a couple of columnists who write their opinions on the football gaming world in an honest an individual fashion. We stick to the facts, but at the same time express our opinions as just those, be they popular, or in some cases, not so popular. I am proud of being involved with a site such as this, and wouldn’t want it to change. Whether you agree with my views, Double D’s opinions or neither, whilst we are here PESGaming.com will be a place where you vent your honest opinions and discuss your views about Pro Evolution Soccer in a ‘free speech’ environment.
“Say You Will, Say You Won’t”
Just out of interest, does anyone think that Konami will provide a transfer window update for the end of August? This question acts as a discussion point ahead of a yes or no answer, but the facts remain that in order to play PES 2009 up to date online (if anyone still is) an official update will be required including the latest summer transfers. Manchester City fans wouldn’t be happy playing online without Tevez, Barry and co; whereas I know it would be frustrating for Ronaldo to score against Real Madrid as opposed to for them. I know these changes can be made easily for offline play, but with aftercare service seemingly part of the Konami mantra, this final token update might just be enough to prove to their fans they are serious about competing within an online environment.
“I’m So Excited”
Last point this week. I make no excuses for my recently shortened columns. There is a lot of work, within my free time, going towards PESGaming at the moment, and therefore I can only dedicate an hour or two to IWP to comply with my current work schedule.
With Double D opening up his list of further questions to Konami, and with the next Play test potentially on the horizon, the question I am opening up to the PESGaming.com community is a simple one, which game feature, mode or improvement is the one that you are personally most looking forward to? It is no secret that PES has made a name for itself based upon the tiny changes year in, year out, and that EA Sports is producing a game that will battle with PES for the ultimate football game title once again, but my question is based upon what you have read, heard or seen, which aspect of PES 2010 are you most looking forward to? Feel free to e-mail me on the usual address, or for a more public discussion, leave a comment in the section below.
That’s your lot for this week. As always my inbox is open to the wide range of e-mails o receive on a weekly basis, some of which are even about PES! If you have any topics or issues you would like to discuss within IWP, or any ideas you would like to see implemented into the new look PESGaming.com, interferingwithplay@hotmail.co.uk is the place to send them to. As always, public comments are always welcomed as well.
Thanks for Reading
Posted by francis in PES 2009 News on Sun 26 Jul 2009
Weekly Blog!
Hey everyone. I apologise for the sporadic blogging. I have been travelling around Europe recently (mainly France and Germany) which would explain my lack of writing on the front page. I fully intend to blog my heart out every Saturday night for the next few months, bringing you the latest opinions on my fellow bloggers’ blogs and news, a few awful lookalikes, occasionally a big question, and – oh, maybe a little news on Pes 2010! I’d like to quickly thank all of our regulars who have been visiting the site over the last 6-8 months, participating in the competitions and of course commenting in the famous Pesgaming forums!
With regard to the new edition of Pes and how it seems to be shaping up, I have to say I am both encouraged and worried! Encouraged by the screenshots and Dougie’s comments on having played a 50% completed build of the game, yet worried that with no mention of any improvement on online play that the PES franchise may be swallowed up by Fifa’s domination of the online scene.
Having your Donut and eating it.
I consider Dougie to be the blogger in closest contact with me – and I’d just like to reiterate my complete backing of him. A few months ago Dougie wrote an article comparing Fifa and Pes in a completely neutral fashion – and to be honest, it was a well-written, fair, and unbiased comprehensive review of two rival games. A huge amount of people called for him to be ‘sacked’ and to leave this website. Since then, he has been in contact with a Konami representative, has been invited to a playtest of Pes 2010, set up competitions and given out incredible prizes to winners of Pesgaming.com competitions, and has had unparalleled access to seeing behind the scenes at Konami.
Give him a little credit, won’t you?
Beat The Blogger
Having played 15 matches against 5 different opponents (and lost only three!), I can now reveal the winner of Pesgaming.com’s ‘Beat The Blogger 2009’! The Wii version of PES 2009 will be winging its way to ‘OfficerFrontBum’ (yes, inappropriate as his gamertag may be, he was the one to beat me 3-1!) – so well done!
I’m sure that next year we’ll have another Beat The Blogger – although this depends very much on the 2010’s online play! If the online play of Pes ’10 is as good as Fifa ’09, then I’m sure there will be leagues and competitions galore, set up between Dan and I. Yet Konami would seem to be shooting themselves in the foot if they failed to improve on this year’s edition’s online mode.
Lookalike
Thanks a lot to Jun Huipeng who sent in this week’s football lookalike!
If you’ve got a good lookalike then please email me on the following address:
francis_newall@hotmail.co.uk
As always, comments on your preferences to what I talk about, whether you liked it, or just general comments on the article, are all very welcome.
Thanks,
-Francis
Posted by dougiedonut in PES 2009 News on Thu 23 Jul 2009
What can I say about the range of comments left to the playtest last week? One thing is for certain: Konami seem to be damned if they do, and damned if they don’t. Had Konami not held this early playtest for the likes of us, then we would not have known how the game was progressing, and more importantly, we would not have been able to feed back into the development process. What many people need to understand is that up until the tail end of last year, we haven’t had avenues for communicating with Konami. We have had frustrations with the series for years, but have never really been able to get this across to Konami formally, and know that it has been taken into consideration by the people who count there.
Konami have acknowledged that we have a stake in the game, and that our voices need to be heard for the series to advance. I still maintain that we need to give them a 2 year period to be able to judge them fully. We need to be patient with the efforts that are being made. Writing Konami off this early won’t help anyone. The game that will be released in October will be very different from the last two years – mark my words. It may not be as advanced as many of us would like, but there will be enough in the game to keep us very involved.
I know the game will be fun to play, and have that ‘just one more game’ feel to it that it is famed for.
The people leaving comments about this being the same old story from Konami need to understand that it isn’t easy to go from a culture of working in an insular fashion, to opening the process out to include groups such as us. Any one of you try to change how you work and see how you get on.
I know I have expressed dissapointment at some old bugbears still being present, but crucially there is still time for some of them to be fixed. What I would like you guys to do is to keep faith. I have no problems standing up for Konami right now. We are an independent site, and yes we now have formal affiliations with Konami, but I strongly feel that by forming strong bonds with them, PES can go from strength to strength. A couple of weeks ago I said the following list will be the litmus test for whether PES2010 is a success in my eyes:
1) a game engine that is a simulation of the sport, which allows us to tailor it to our own style.
2) increased and improved player animations for dribbling, performing tricks and shooting
3) a return to the control system of PES6 which allows you to use the right analog stick to perform tricks
4) fully functional online play, with no more lag issues for ANYONE! Online play is a massive feature for many of us, and if this feature fails, then Konami are as good as advertising FIFA ‘10 for EA.
I stand by this list. If Konami hadn’t opened up it’s doors to fans, then I would be more apprehensive about the next game. But since that isn’t the case,
I think we have room for genuine optimism. We need only look at the new changes for the Master League which we put up on the site yesterday to show further evidence of Konami listening to what you want.
The big debate in the comments section was about the fact that we still have 8 way control. For many people this was very dissappointing, myself included. But now that that fact is out, I think we should focus on the positives. We have played with 8 way control for years – have the games with this control system not given us immense pleasure? I know we need to progress from this system, but it’s clearly not going to make PES2010. So I think we should get over it, and push further emphasis on a full set of player animations which will provide seamless control when performing moves. The recent motion capture sessions are an indication that this will be provided for us. But it goes for without saying that moving on from 8 way control will be pretty much top of the fans’ agenda for PES2011.
Part of the problem I guess for 8 way control is the fact that so many players prefer the D pad for control. I think Konami perhaps need to poll people to see if they are willing to move on to analogue stick control only for player movements. This will aid the transition to full 360 control which is what we would really prefer.
Finally I will be submitting a further list of questions which were raised in last week’s comments section, and hopefully a cross-section of them will get formal replies from Konami. I won’t say which questions so that we don’t get people dissappointed if their questions didn’t make the list. So do tune in next week, when hopefully we will have answers for you.
Thanks for reading.
Dougiedonut
(dougiedonut@pesgaming.com)
Posted by dougiedonut in PES 2009 News on Wed 22 Jul 2009
Konami reveals expanded managerial elements, including new fiscal, sponsorship, and youth team elements
Konami Digital Entertainment GmbH has outlined significant advances to the Master League section of its forthcoming PES 2010 title.
Master League has proven one of the key attributes to the PES series’ longevity, and PES 2010 will introduce a number of new elements that will contribute to the overall realism and lasting appeal of the new game.
On selecting the Master League option, players are now presented with a menu split into three areas: ‘Club House’, ‘Stadium Walk’, and ‘Office’. Each of these is an umbrella for different parts of a manager’s role, with ‘Club House’ used for tactical and match day options, ‘Stadium Walk’ for main game settings, and ‘Office’ for scouting and player acquisition dealings.
The in-game menus are now much simpler to navigate, and players can jump between the three areas with ease. The Club House element has also seen the creation of an all-new Youth Team section, which works alongside the first team squad. As the game progresses, the player can opt to invest in talented members of their youth team to fast-track their development. This burgeoning talent can then be introduced into the first team, as with so many real-life ‘academies.’
The Office area is where all transfer and financial dealings take place. Real currency is now used in PES 2010, and additional monetary routes are also available. Sponsorships can now be negotiated, with player securing big money deals with companies that can be used to invest in the team and youth set-up. Results on field affect the direct value of the club tio interested parties, and fan clubs are also used as a barometer of the club’s success.
Posted by Dan Bolas in Interfering With Play on Tue 21 Jul 2009
IWP League Champion 2009: Ivan Kostic (Internacional)
Welcome to this week’s Interfering With Play. The dust is slowly settling on the first batch of Pro Evolution Soccer news, and the aftermath is as mixed as I expected. It is no secret that a lot of people who visit this site, or would consider themselves PES fans in general have felt let down or discouraged by previous instalments of the next generation title, whereas others look upon this release as the game to bring back the glory days of Pro Evolution Soccer, and allow Konami to take its place on top of the pile. I think either way, it is important to express your views but more importantly your concerns regarding what you have seen or read so far, as with Konami still in the development stage; scope for change is still very much on the cards. My views on what I have seen (which is the same as you guys so far) on the way in this article. So let’s get moving with this week’s Interfering With Play.
“Stop Playing Your Silly Games”
First port of call this week is to echo the sentiments of my previous posts and thank everyone for taking part in the PRO-ve Your Skills competition. Craig has successfully got in touch over the past couple of days, and his signed Messi poster will be in the post by the middle of next week! The topic I would quickly like to discuss and remind people about is the fact that whilst this is a Pro Evolution Soccer news site, it also doubles up as a community, a place for fans of the game to talk and express their views with likeminded people. Therefore, as a community based site, we try and run a number of competitions and events throughout the year to get everyone involved. Over the past year, these have included some successful competitions, for example the Interfering With Play League and Double D’s Poster competition, and less successful ones, namely Beat The Bloggers and the IWP World Cup.
If you are interested in being involved in these competitions in future, make sure you make contact with the relevant organiser. We have been in talks with a number of different PES sites regarding a cross-site competition, something that may be on the cards for PES 2010, and are always on the look out for new ideas. At the same time, if you’re not interested in these competitions or events and don’t wish to take part, that’s perfectly fine to, and I hope there is enough on the new look site to keep your entertained and occupied for multiple visits. One advantage of the ‘partnership’ this site is forming with Konami is the PR attire we will no doubt receive. This could include the option of winning free copies of PES 2010 or money can’t buy items, so keep your eyes peeled for the latest, as PESGaming.com looks to bring more competitions and events your way in late 2009 and early 2010.
“You’re Unbelievable”
The gift of hindsight may be a wonderful thing, but there is an issue that has plagued me throughout the past 9 months or so, and that is how unrealistically good Newcastle United have been on previous versions of PES, no more so that on PES2009. It is well documented that Konami are sometimes slightly off the mark with their stats, Adriano and Harry Kewell being too of the most overrated players in PES history. However, like Newcastle, both had a spell where they would be considered of the highest quality.
Working with team ability is a tricky task, and as I am sure to find out with my beloved Wolves, the teams that get promoted on PES always have slightly weaker stats that the existing sides, but the established Premier League sides should be reviewed yearly and given appropriate stats. Newcastle have been an average Premier League side for a number of seasons now, and up until recently, were a safe bet for a top ten finish. Compare them with sides such as Everton or Aston Villa on PES though, and they are head and shoulders above them. Style of play or ability of players aside, they are unrealistically balanced and something which has frustrated me in many a friendly or Master League match.
Taking this one stage further, I don’t think anyone predicted both Newcastle and Middlesbrough to be relegated at the start of the season, and I think Konami were right to make Hull and Stoke weaker sides on PES, and they were unaware of how the teams were going to fair in their first season. However, upon that transfer window update, which saw Hull flying high, and Newcastle struggling, how difficult would it have been for Konami to alter the stats of these sides within the update to provide a more realistic experience? In the world of downloadable content and after game service, I personally want and expect my yearly update to remain reasonably accurate throughout the year of its release, especially if come to following October I am expected to shell out another £40.
This is not a shot at Newcastle as a side, but instead more of using them as a header for the much greater topic of realism within games. I have no problem when Ronaldo or Messi destroy my full backs, but when Martins does it every time, or when Alan Smith scores a Hat Trick, something needs to be done. In the argument about arcade gaming versus a simulation experience, the topic of realistic ability for the teams in relation to their real life counter parts is a massive issue, and one that needs to be addressed. Your views, as always, greatly appreciated.
“I Think In Decimals And Dollars”
Moving on to the views expressed by Double D in the PES 2010 play test special. For a number of reasons, I was not at the play test for the game, and therefore am not really of an opinion to offer my views on the build or game play aspects. Instead, I will simply look at the facts. No matter where you have read the latest news about PES, I am pretty sure it is all saying a similar thing, albeit in different ways. Issues such as online as been kept quite quiet, whereas graphics have been tipped to the best ever, couple with reports of more realistic and fluid on screen movement. Also, the lack of 360 control has angered many, although I am remaining sceptical on the whole subject, and look forward to see how EA Sports implement the control in their latest offering before deciding whether it would be as good as everyone seems to think.
Reading the boards, it seems that a lot of the ideas hat have been suggested by people have not been listened to, but at the same time, the assurance of a 50% completion leads to a lot more improvements to be made. I know that this play test took place a round a month ago, and therefore is no where near the stage where Konami are currently at. People who are refusing to accept the facts that this review was based on a 50% build need to understand a little more about gaming development. I am not suggesting for one second that massive changes will occur, but instead am saying that when Double D played the game, it was around half completed. Fact. It is usually the case that development companies use in house testing or external testers bound by secrecy when testing games up to the 70% stage, as a way of both ironing out bugs and receiving constant reviews of ways to improve the gaming experience. It is this process which helps turns good games into great ones, and can not be undervalued. This year, Konami have made this process much more public as a way of ‘listening to the fans’ in an attempt to win back the title of football fan’s football game. Whether the process is successful or not remains to be seen, but the topic of build state is one that cannot be realistically debated.
As for my views, I may seem like I am sitting on the fence, but those who know my style of reviewing or have read IWP for a while now will expect nothing less. Without playing a full build of the final retail game, any kind of review would not be just or fair to the end product. A game can be ruined by a review at 90% when, in fact the 100% title is a polished article and worth a whole lot more. At the same time, features such as online play and downloadable additions can make a game fall flat on its face weeks after release, especially if lag or bugs are present. Based on recent years, the demo of PES normally finds its way to the internet in mid September, with the consoles receiving it on their various online stores a while later. Until that point, the only thing I will comment on is the features included in the game, be they good or bad, and not the game as a whole. Expect PESGaming.com to be the place to go for all the reviews and news when the game is released!
That’s your lot for this week. A few points for you guys to have a read over. I make no excuse for a few smaller articles over the past few weeks. With a number of side projects related to this site in the pipeline, my articles are being fitted in around other tasks. As always, feel free to leave comments, or if you have topic you wish to discuss on a world wide stage, drop me an e-mail on interferingwithplay@hotmail.co.uk.
Thanks for Reading
Posted by Dan Bolas in Site Updates on Sun 19 Jul 2009
The first PRO-ve Your Skills competition has no completed its run. After six different champions over a 2 month period, it was Craig Grant who managed to set the unanswered challenge of winning the Dutch Division with a bottom half side, losing the last game of the season in the process. I would like to take this opportunity to thank all those people who got involved in the event, both those who were crowned champion, and those who were just a little too slow. If Craig would like to drop me an e-mail, a hand signed Lionel Messi poster will be sent his way! interferingwithplay@hotmail.co.uk is the place to direct your message to.
Following the news regarding the PES2010 playtest, be sure to check out this week’s Interfering With Play, and sit tight for a new look PESGaming.com in a few weeks time.
Posted by dougiedonut in PES 2009 News on Wed 15 Jul 2009
PES2010 The playtest.
Now that the NDA agreement date has been respected, I am very pleased to tell you that I was invited by Konami to a behind closed doors look at PES2010. I was not able to talk about the fact that I had been to see the game. Rather than tell people that I had been and not say anything about the event would have been extra frustrating for you guys (I know – I’ve been there!).
So to begin with here’s a small library of PES2010 screenshot, so let’s get them out of the way now.
Older PES2010 screenshots
Latest screenshots
Cards and Tactics System
Development Shots
In-game
Player Likenesses
This was the first time a representative from PESGaming.com has been invited to such an event, and it was an honour for me to attend. As I become more savvy with how these events are carried out, our relationship with Konami will improve, and hopefully we will get more reps for future events going more regularly.
The actual event itself was held in a private room in a hotel in the West End. There were several test rigs set up all on Software Development Kits, so we were seeing the generic product prior to them cutting code for specific machines. Having signed the NDA eagerly, I was immediately seated at a rig and the play testing began.
The game itself has a new front end which shows the game modes, of which only the option to play a friendly match was available, as was expected. The teams enabled were Liverpool and Barcelona.
So I started the game, and the first thing I had to say was “wow” at the look and feel of the game. Don’t get me wrong, I value substance over style, but you can’t help but marvel at how good the game looks.
First Impressions
I’d like to make it clear that this is the first time I have been to an event of this nature, and so had mixed expectations from Konami. The scene was set prior to playing the game – I was told that the game was only around 50% complete. What we were witnessing was more a statement of intent, rather than the finished game. Having spoken to a few other guys present from other PES fan sites, it was made clear to me that the game will come on leaps and bounds from what we were currently seeing. The game would almost be unrecognisable from the one that we were playing now. So this is a very important statement I’d like you guys to note now.
I am a cautious person by nature. One of my mottos in life is to expect the worst, but hope for the best. It’s a mechanism to try and keep my emotions in check for everything in life. So please bear this in mind with what I have to say about PES2010.
So having got over the graphics of the game, I can tell you that the game still has the same camera modes we’re all used to – nothing new to surprise us, which was a little disappointing. I’ve always wanted a fully customisable camera view where you customise the pitch angle and zoom, but that’s just me.
I’d like to begin by listing some bullet points on what I thought was good and bad about the game, and then talk about them within the context of a game that is still in development – I cannot emphasize this point enough – so please remember this!
This article is all about my own personal impressions of the game, and what I took away from the event.
On this basis, my main focus was to see what issues which are in PES2009 are still present, and what improvements from the list submitted (last year in conjunction with PESGaming regulars) have been implemented. So here goes:
Minus points:
- Invisible barriers still in place which is very disappointing for throw ins.
- 8 way control hasn’t been advanced upon. This will be a major sore point for many gamers. Will need the player animation ranges to be near perfect to appease fans.
- Keepers still pass to the nearest player with short goal kicks.
- Keeper actions still very limited. Keepers should come off their line more, reading danger and running out of their area to cut out dangers when they see them.
- Can’t chip a ball ahead of player to cross or volley.
- Chipping the keeper is poor. Can’t chip him when running with the ball. Attempting to chip the keeper would result in the ball ending up in the keeper’s hands at chest height every time.
- No trick stick return. Same crappy random skill moves using left stick.
- Not able to perform many special skills when I choose to do them. They are very random. The trick stick would remove this major irritation.
- Grass texture needs some work. They look very flat in wide view in particular – they could be improved.
Plus points:
- Graphics are stunning.
- Slower game pace gives the game play a more simulation feel.
- Player animation is much improved. Still some work to be done, but it’s good to see it taking place.
- New slider system is brilliant. It is immediately obvious what strategies are being deployed when you choose them.
- Putting players out of position results in player stat degradation which is brilliant. This stops people from playing players out of position.
- Can’t run the length of the pitch with a single player and beat the whole team.
- Can’t perform 90 degree turns when dribbling at speed any more. The player slows down and turns 45 degree which is very good.
- Ball pace is good. Perhaps more tweaking is required, but so far so good.
- Set piece takers do not freeze immediately after playing the ball any more.
- New revamped penalty system with pressure sensitive shooting is a very welcome improvement.
- Referees appeared not to be brandishing red cards as regularly as in PES2009.
Improvement Suggestions:
(this is a list of improvements, most of which may be quick fixes which can fit in the timescales left for PES2010 development hopefully)
- Remove the invisible barriers for throw ins in particular
- Goalkeeper should use a power bar to throw out. They should be able to choose whether to throw underarm or overarm.
- Allow keepers to take goal kicks and play the ball short to any of the defenders at the back, not just the nearest one. Letting the keepers use a power bar to kick/throw the ball would be brilliant. Keepers like Reina should be more effective at turning defence in to attack. This is not possible right now.
- Remove chants in-game. Use forums to provide downloadable team chants. This way the dev team can concentrate on capturing crowd atmosphere which is very important.
- Crosses from wide positions should use player crossing attributes to be more realistic.
At the moment all players pretty much have the same crossing ability. We should see a visible difference when crossing with good players and bad crossers.
- Trick stick needs to return. Why not give players a choice of which mode to play with? Either allow us to use the classic control method of using the trick stick, or the current implementation of special moves using the left stick.
- Passing should be power sensitive. A power bar or the length of time the button is pressed should vary the strength of the pass. This should also apply to shots. If you can afford to keep the button pressed for longer before getting shut down by defenders, then you should be able to get more powerful shots on goal.
- 16 way movement must be in place for pes2011. (probably too late to try to implement for PES2010)
- Downloadable foreign language commentary. (something FIFA have already implemented) why not allow us to download commentary packs with Japanese commentary, or other Asian languages, or South American languages?
- If all club teams are region specific, why not allow us to download each other’s leagues? As a PAL region gamer, why can’t I download the J-League teams, or Brazilian League for my game?
- Different types of pitches having an effect on your game would be great.
- Online play – we need more assurances that it has been addressed and will be perfect for launch. Beta testing of online play would help to ensure that it is working properly.
I don’t know what you guys will be thinking having just read the lists above. For those of you who are despairing at now knowing that we still have 8 way control, and that FIFA’s 360 control hasn’t been matched for example, I would like to say to hold fire on any frustrations you may be feeling. This demo of the game served several purposes. Konami wanted to demonstrate that they are listening to what we want from the game. They wanted to show that they are putting the game back on the map, hence giving representatives from key PES sites early visibility to gauge our impressions of it.
New stuff
I’d like to discuss several new concepts which have been introduced to PES2010 now, and hopefully shed some light on the motivation behind them.
Firstly the new card system (see the thumbnails above for a refresher)
Basically the old star ratings for players have been revamped for PES2010. They have now been replaced with cards. Every player has a number of cards (depending on how good the players are) which may be viewed as RPG style special skills which can be switched on and off as a new tactical system measure.
We had the concept explained to us, but it was still a little confusing to be honest. My interpretation of it was that the system is in place to allow you to customise how and when a player uses their cards (star abilities) in games.
To give you a full example of a card – Messi has a card for mazy dribbling which you can switch on or off.
This confused the hell out of me, because why on earth would I want to switch off a special skill, especially one as rare as mazy dribbling? I disabled the card and played with Messi only to find that he was still capable of mazy runs, since he was in my control. But the system became more clearer to me when other cards were seen. For example the two cards shown above P12 and P01 show the skills Incisive Run and Overlapping Run respectively. These are more strategic cards which control off the ball movement. So switching these on or off will make a tactical difference. For example if you are Stoke City (no disrespect intended Stoke fans!) who are 1-0 up against Manchester United at Old Trafford, you would want a real back to the walls performance to protect your hard earned lead. So therefore you would want to curb attacking instincts of players, and have them sit back and fight hard. By switching off these two cards for example, you wouldn’t have to worry about players suddenly deciding to leave their position to go and attack, leaving the team vulnerable.
When you think of the card system like that, then you appreciate the improved strategic thinking that you can add to your game.
The other two screen shots from the Card and Tactics System again show the level of strategic tinkering you can do with your team to have them play the way you want them to. It has given us a much larger element of control of how we deploy our teams in matches. You get an almost limitless number of combinations of tactics and team structures to use and perfect.
The new slider system for teams is also pretty amazing in my opinion. I tried to set the team formations from one extreme of being very rigid in their formation, with no overlapping or pressing of the ball when not in possession, to the opposite extreme of having a very dynamic team structure, who almost play in a pack (a little like when we first played football as kids in school playgrounds where everyone ran to where the ball was), pressing the play, with overlapping runs, interchanging players and fast breaks. I have to say I was very impressed with the abilities given to us to control. It was amazing to see the team behaving according to how I had programmed them to behave. This means that every team should have their own style of play, with team sliders set to varying degrees, according to their playing style. This really should be evident, and I can’t wait to test that!
The game in action
Ok so now to talk about the actual gameplay itself. The pace of the game has been slowed right down from the comedy pace of play from PES2008 and PES2009. The arcade feel to the game is definitely gone. It felt good stroking the ball around the pitch with either short or long passes. I was personally disappointed that there wasn’t a power bar for short passes, which would open up play a bit more, but for what it is, the PES passing system is back to being more akin to PES6, which is a big bonus in my eyes. I played the game for nearly 4 hours during my time at the session and I have to say that I was more and more impressed with the game as I played. The ball physics were very good, and shooting felt quite good, though to be honest I didn’t spend too much time taking shots.
I was interested in trying to dribble with the ball using a highly skilled player like Gerrard or Messi, taking the ball from the defence and trying to run straight through to goal, but am happy to say that I was unable to do so. I’m a pretty good player of the game, so it’s not like I am unable to do that on PES2009.
I attempted to run full pelt with the ball, and to try to turn 90 degrees as you currently can with no loss of pace. Again I was very pleased to see new animations kick in which made my player turn 45 degrees and to slow down when I tried a 90 degree turn. As I mentioned earlier, the full player animation set hasn’t been totally incorporated yet, so we can expect player abilities on the ball to improve further yet. I can’t imagine all of the motion capture material that Messi carried out recently has made the game yet. Once again I must state that there is scope for improvement with player movement and dribbling – and fingers crossed this is taking place right now. Players still currently run as they do in PES2009, so they have their backs straight and almost have that comical Scooby Doo feel when he runs on the spot before speeding off. But that should have a more realistic feel once the game is complete.
Goalkeepers were apparently not completely finished yet either, so I expect key improvements to be made to their abilities. In their current state they performed quite well for me. The shot stopping was good, with no obvious ball spillages to the feet of waiting attackers in my play time. I can also say that for goalkeeping glove fetishists out there – the gloves no longer look like they have been inflated to cartoon like proportions.
The penalty system has been revamped and is pretty fantastic I have to say. You now have a pressure sensitive shooting mechanism which really makes taking penalties a real hit and miss affair (sorry couldn’t resist the pun there). You now finally have to spend time practicing penalties to be good at them. When have you ever had to do that in a game? Once you suss how to take them, it really does make a difference.
I did see evidence of untucked shirts too – which I know really does it for some guys out there.
The crowds could do with more work. There are still unusual chants in place for teams, but the sound quality is improved, so they don’t sound as nauseating as they currently do in PES2009. I am hoping again that they get rid of chants from the game, and concentrate on the crowds following the action as it ebbs and flows. I think allowing the community to supply chants of their own for teams (with larger capacity than the current system which just loops the chants continuously till you vomit) will be a better compromise and allow us to customise the game to our liking. This will be possible for PC and PS3 versions, but unfortunately Xbox 360 owners will not have this luxury. Microsoft do not allow gamers to customise option files at all, and as a result 360 owners are needlessly penalised in this respect – so don’t blame Konami 360 owners. I have actually bought a PS3 specifically for the editing abilities that are open to the PS3. A decision which I do not regret.
Once we had played the game sufficiently, Jon Murphy recorded mini-interviews on video where he wanted candid, honest thoughts of what we thought of the game. He was keen to share our views at this stage with the dev team in Japan to let them see for themselves what we expect from the game. So I told them how I saw the game, which I will talk about next.
Overall Summary
When I initially played the game, I couldn’t help but feel disappointed with the game engine. If this build was a statement of intent, then it initially felt to me that we were looking at micro steps forward, rather than steps or leaps forward.
I was looking to see which of the problems we wanted addressed have been fixed, and was very disappointed to see that most of the issues were still present. I hope that improvement suggestions I have made will be revisited by the team and addressed. I don’t think that they are particularly hard to fix.
If more resources from the pool available were thrown into fixing these issues right now for PES2010, then it would give a more meaningful statement of intent.
Even with the improvement suggestions addressed in the game, there will still be a fair amount of disappointment that the series hasn’t made more of a forward leap. With our more powerful gaming systems, people expect a lot more than we’re currently seeing.
FIFA have raised the bar with FIFA ’09, and I fear FIFA ’10 may produce a bigger gulf for PES to overcome.
To be fair, whilst people are raving about having 360 control over players, I think there is potential for players going from the fairly rigid control of 8-way controls to having the total freedom of 360 degree movement as too much control too soon. Will this impact playability? I think progressing from 8 way movement to 16 way movement now would have been a smarter move, as we would gain a lot more control of play, and to maintain playability a lot better. We have to realise that as much as we kick and scream for more and more realism from our football games, a balance has to be struck between control, playability and fun.
Yes I am disappointed we still have 8 way control, but if the control is very tight, like PES6 was, and all the new additions made to the game are successful, then we have one hell of a game on our hands.
I was given verbal assurances that the online system will be perfect this time round. The PES6 online system will be the basis for online play, and hopefully it delivers. We have all time and time again made it abundantly clear that the online playability must be problem free this time for PES2010 to have any meaningful credibility. There are no planned online beta tests as far as I know, so we will have to wait and see how the system works.
We can expect the next play test of the game in a few short weeks time to be an almost unrecognisable improvement, going on what the guys who have been to these events had to say. This is very encouraging I have to say. Had this been a 75/80% completed game with a few final tweaks left to make, I’d have been disheartened and probably gone and kicked the nearest cat. There are definite improvements in place, there are still areas which need some serious work, but most importantly there is still time for Konami to get it right.
I am going to be very interested to hear what you guys have to say about this article which I have spent a great deal of time putting together. I’m sure there will be lots of questions too, so please use the comments section to ask questions, and I will look to answer your questions to the best of my ability in a special Q&A this Friday.
I hope my impressions of the game hasn’t left any of you thinking the worst, and giving up on Konami. I truly believe that they are listening to us, and that we will not be let down come October.
Thanks for reading
Dougiedonut
(dougiedonut@pesgaming.com)
Posted by Dan Bolas in Interfering With Play on Tue 14 Jul 2009
IWP League Champion 2009: Ivan Kostic (Internacional)
Welcome to this week’s Interfering With Play. I would like to start off this week by thanking all those who took time to share their views, opinions and experiences about Pro Evolution Soccer’s and ISS from days gone by. I have said many times that I have been playing the series for as long as I can remember, and its very interesting to hear other peoples views about games I have been playing for so many years. I will be collating these views into some sort of tribute page over the next few weeks, to coincide with the launch of the “History Of PES” website in about a month’s time. This week is the one that many of you have been waiting for. The contract of silence is lifted, and those individuals who have played PES 2010 are allowed to publish their views. I know Double D is looking forward to doing this on PESGaming.com and therefore don’t intend to use IWP to steal his thunder. This means for a second week, IWP will be slightly shorter than the norm. I make no apologies for this though, as I believe the site will be fit to burst with PES information, and will give enough for you guys to read. With that said, lets move on with this week’s Interfering With Play.
“You Can’t Stop Me”
Firstly, a slight apology should go out on behalf of PESGaming. Following the announcement that PES 2010 was getting a Wii Release in Autumn, it was drawn to my attention via the comment section of this site that mn9ajas penned a review of the 2009 game, only to not have it published on the site. I am aware that his copy was won as part of a competition run on this site, and part of the terms of winning was that your opinions on the game were registered. In spite of my own video review, I believe that this review should have been included on PESGaming.com and apologise for its exclusion. It is probably a little to late in the day now to publish the review on the main page, but if mn9ajas wants to send me a copy of the review, I will do my best to incorporate it into some form or website or article in the future.
One of the biggest pleasures of writing these columns is the feedback, both positive and negative, that we receive. If you write something, you do so for it to be read, and therefore I once again offer my apologies for these events.
“Under Pressure”
At the time of writing, it’s around four months until the scheduled release of PES 2010. As with this time of year, the winter gaming line up is also starting to take shape, and this year sees the return of a lot of big name titles after a couple of years absence. Uncharted 2, Assassins Creed 2, Modern Warfare 2 and Gran Turismo have all been promised before the turn of the year, yet for many gamers, especially those on this site, the sole focus is PES.
Believe me when I say I refuse to make an excuse for Konami. There was a time in the late nineties when they would work on a two year development cycle for the ISS series, producing some fantastic results and groundbreaking improvements. The decision to make the PES series a yearly update was one Konami took in order to play with the ‘big boys’ and therefore they have to follow through on this. Where other major gaming franchises get a couple of years to work on new ideas, PES is a annual release, something that is not an excuse for a lack in improvement or quality, but also a much greater burden on the developers.
Being a sports fan, I own many sporting games. Aside from football, the one franchise I have always followed in the Brian Lara’s Cricket series. This works under many different names, dependant on region but in a similar way to Konami, Codemasters offered a fun and realistic alternative to the EA Sports version of Cricket. This year, Codemasters have rebranded the series Ashes2009 to tie in with the current test series between England and Australia, but the game has got to within a month of release slipping through a lot of people’s radar.
This could quite simply be because no one likes Cricket games, or that the people who play them tend to stick with the older version for a couple of years, but it was early 2007 when the last Cricket game was released. This means that for 2 years, people have made do with the Cricket titles on the market with little fuss, and now have a game which features a brand new engine to play with. The news including screenshots and in game footage is at a minimal and overall, there is very little PR about the game, yet its release alone will be enough to bring the Cricket fans in their thousands.
Compare this with PES. 4 months away and we are analysing every move that Konami make, every build of the game is being play tested and debated within a public forum, and games magazines can dedicate entire issues to the information available. Yes, football is a more popular sport than cricket, and yes Konami made the decision to release an annual title, but the pressure being placed upon Konami now is so high, that I am glad I am not involved in the final result. I make no excuses for Konami, but at the same time, I wouldn’t want to be doing what they are either!
“Slam Dunk Da Funk”
So based on initial polls, it was Pro Evolution Soccer 5 that earned the title of best PES Game ever. Of course, this poll has really only just started, as over the next few weeks, there will be a number of different ways to vote for your favourite PES of all time. I will still be looking for PES memories too. The more, the better, as it really gives us the feel of a Pro Evolution Community that actually cares about football games.
As for Pro Evolution Soccer 5, I would find it hard to argue too much with that. I personally found that to be one of my favourites, for the simple fact I was untouchable with Chelsea on the game. That may sound a tiny bit arrogant, but I was beating people 7 or 8 nil for the simple fact that Duff and Robben were unstoppable, It was also the game that brought Henry to the level of PES superstar, as until that point he always handled just a little bit off.
As I said, the next few weeks will be full of little polls and stuff building towards the history of PES. Hopefully, by the end there will be a mini site dedicated for a trip down memory lane, and maybe even a little bit of downloadable content for you guys to get stuck into. I mean, who wouldn’t want Go For The Goal as their ring tone!
“I Don’t Feel Like Dancing”
One final little point, and again, it borders on the petty. It has been brought to my attention that people are multi posting in the comments section. In other words people are writing four or five consecutive comments, which is not only a tiny bit annoyed, but wastes the time and space of other people who wish to get involved. I am therefore politely asking you to try and only send one comment at a time, allowing others to react to your post and keeping the conversations relative. I do have the ability to edit or delete comments I think do not abide by this simple request, and will start grouping large consecutive posts together into one post if I see fit. Writing a structured and well written comment might take a little bit of planning, but it is something that will earn your views the time and respect they deserve.
That’s your lot for this week. There are a number of things within this article for people to get their opinions stuck into, so feel free to comment or e-mail in the usual way. I expect Double D’s posts this week to draw a lot of attention, so an extra thanks to those of your taken the time to get your weekly IWP fix. As always, interferingwithplay@hotmail.co.uk is the place for your e-mail.
Thanks for Reading
