Interfering With Play 15/01/08
Posted by Dan Bolas in Interfering With Play on Tue 15 Jan 2008
Welcome to this week’s Interfering With Play. Over the past few weeks, I have been receiving hundreds of e-mails dedicated to the subject of the Seabass letter, and the improvement ideas for PES2009. This week sees the start of six sections which will cover the majority of suitable points raised by you, the PESGaming.com public, and act as a way of people either agreeing or disagreeing with their relevance towards making PES2009 the best football game ever made. Could I firstly point out that I have not forgot to mention the licensing issue, as it seems to be high on the top of nearly ever message I have received. This point will be included in the final letter, however, to stop the barrage of comments about why it hasn’t been included in this article, I am addressing it now. So lets get started.
Seabass Letter: Presentation
This week’s topic for the Seabass letter is regards the presentation of PES2008 in game, and possible ways it could be improved for 2009. Here, feel free to read the ideas, and comment on their importance to you as a PES gamer, along with developing any that may sound like a good idea. These are the collective views of many gamers, along with my own personal views and those of my PES playing mates.
The presentation element of the game is not directly related to the games graphics, and therefore can not be treated as how realistic Frank Lampard looks, or why the strips can’t be edited. Here we are discussing the parts of the game that are seen and used by every gamer, and have always been slightly overlooked in relation to other aspects of the PES and ISS series. With FIFA allowing gamers to practise their skills as Ronaldinho whilst waiting for the game to load, surely the avenue of an interactive loading screen is one that needs to be looked at. Mini games have been used since the late 80s as a way of keeping gamers entertained while the title loads. Space Invaders was the most popular one of these, and although loading times were longer than the modern day, the fact that we are still waiting 30 seconds to a minute whilst starring at a blank screen should be something worth sorting. Assassin’s Creed allows you to familiarise yourself with the controls of the main character, with more and more ‘next generation’ titles following suit. Something as simple as allowing you to practise passing with two or three players (similar to a pre game warm up) or work on time headers would be perfect mini games that would break up the sitting and waiting mode that bores many gamers. The other alternative is to follow Call Of Duty 4: Modern Warfare, and use Cut scenes as a way of masking loading times. The pre game shot of the players coming out the tunnel may be skipped by most gamers after the first few matches, but it would surely be better than watching a static loading screen.
Cut Scenes themselves are a very tricky business. The lag on these in PES2008 is totally unacceptable, and must be on the top of Konami’s to do list for the next version. However, in every other game genre, cut scenes are seen as the plague and developers are frantically trying new techniques in order to make action move along at a quicker pace, with more user involvement. This is in the form of interactive cut scenes, whereby gamers press a button in order to move the action along, and was implemented well in games such as Heavenly Sword. Again though, this feature is something, which may not work with football games, and needs to be looked at by Seabass and his team. Of course, TV matches will show players celebrating after scoring a goal, or holding their heads after a missed chance, and this does need to be reflected in the game. Perhaps more details, including the players age or how many shots they have had throughout the match (a feature that has been present in previous PES) should pop up below the featured player. This could be followed up further by more intense celebrations for last minute goals or even big scuffles involving fighting players in a particularly feisty game. The option to have your players get involved, and risk having players sent off, could be left at your disposal with a simple button choice, however, with the dive feature causing so much uproar, the less glamorous sides of football seem to be vilified even more in gaming form, and this would be no exception. The other side of cut scenes would be in the form of interviews, TV Studio based highlights and other small scenes to help create a more realistic match environment and bulk up the basics from this years master league. Whilst personally this would be a dream, I could see many players skipping these, making the development of them not as important as other aspects.
The menu system itself in PES2008 had a very arcade feel, and having all players’ names in capital letters, and the way the kits were displayed on the Kit Selection screen backed this up. PES and ISS have always opted for less menu-based interfaces than other games, preferring to keep menus to one or two screens rather than numerous tabs and lists. In order to compete with the competition, this may need to be changed, allowing more to be sorted out for each and ever game. The option to not be able to switch shorts and shirts is one that needs to be brought back in from PES5. More than ever, Premier League sides are having to change their shorts due to colour clashes, and Konami need to follow suit, bringing this feature back. This is only second to the missing option of being able to select your kit for the season and master league games. Having recently completed an English League season with Chelsea, I was shocked to be playing against sides like Reading and Wigan and still be wearing Blue. What was crazier was the fact the shirts were changed to the yellow alterative for my trip to Villa Park. These basics are crucial for many gamers enjoyment, and more so, are fundamental features that make the game easier to play.
One of the parts which has been picked upon by some gamers is the lack of trophies when winning major competitions, and being unable to view them in the records room, as in previous generations of PES. The new Track Record feature is a good thing in the fact it gives you more stats bout your personal game, but this could be followed further by giving us a Trophy cabinet, and showing maybe a photo of the winning side (a simple screen shot taken at the end the season). Once again, this is a feature that will be really appreciated by football fans, but will probably be seen as less important by game developers.
The appearance of stadiums and pitch designs in PES2008 was met with a mixed response. Yes, it was great to see the most realistic stadiums in PES history, but why so few, and even fewer that played without the dreaded lag. Whilst things such as a Stadium editor or even the option to play at a choice of hundreds of real life grounds is on some peoples wish list, most gamers would settle for the same gaming experience at each environment, and not be praying that you aren’t playing Barcelona at the Nou Camp due to the lag being unbearable. Of course, variable pitches would be welcomed, but not that affect the speed the game itself runs. I couple this with the fact that managers are now featured on the sidelines, greeting substituted players with a pat on the back or even a hug. This is very similar to real life, and back in the days of sensible soccer, there was an option to customise your manager’s appearance, and give him a name. Surely, this simple option of adding one more aspect to a side would give the game a very realistic feel, and even to have the camera cut to him celebrating a goal, something which worked very well on Codemaster’s Club Football series of 2004-2005.
The final point about presentation, and the one, which has drummed up a lot of interest, is the seamless links from throw ins and quick free kicks. Whilst it does fall under a game play, I am going to quickly address the presentation side of this now. The PS2 version always had a black screen that was used to link the time the ball going out of play and the appropriate set piece being taken. Yes, this was always annoying, especially when your side was a goal down late in the game but was never really a major problem in my eyes. The next generation version of the game now sees a logo wipe across the screen linking the two actions together, which is more realistic, but still means that players will return to their normal positions, especially annoying when counterattacking. I personally feel that nowadays the system has the power to run continuously without the need for mini black screen breaks, and as a result the game should adapt as such, be it a multi-ball format or u having to wait for the ball to be retrieved, in the form of ball boys or fans throwing the ball down from the stands. This would mean kicking the ball further out of play would give an advantage to the defending team to regroup, just like real matches.
That is the main points I have received on the presentation front in the e-mails and comments. Any build up on this or possible ideas related to these can be sent to me via e-mail or left as comments at the bottom of this article.
A Sheer Disgrace
The fact that the letter section has taken such a great deal of this weeks article means I am going to keep it very short, with only one other point for this weeks Interfering With Play. Depending on the size of the other letter sections, I will fill out my column with other points as is appropriate. I was foolish enough to try and give PES2008 another try in an online game over the weekend, using the logic that after 3 months, maybe problems with servers or early niggles have been ironed out. To be honest, it’s embarrassing for Konami and Seabass how poor the online mode is. I will bring up the points in the letter in due course, but for any gamers thinking to get this game or even setting up an online account I urge you not to waste the time. The lag is completely unacceptable, one minute my Goalkeeper had the ball, the next it was at the feet of the opposition, and the art of block tackling does not exist. On no more than 4 occasions the ball crossed a touchline just to be retrieved, and I am talking a long way out, once to the expense of a goal for me. However, the biggest injustice I feel is the abysmal turning speed and changing direction, a skill that means a speedy opposition player has scored as soon as they receive the ball. Whether some online gamers are now used to it is beside the point, the game is not an online game and I am so very disappointed that in market of next generation consoles providing some top quality online action, PES is once again left bottom of the pile.
That’s your lot for this week. Please be in touch with responses to the aforementioned points, and don’t be too worried if your topic isn’t covered at the moment, there are still five other sections to write under. I apologise I am unable to give names and credit to those ideas that have been used in this article. To be honest, many people came up with very similar ideas, and as a result listing names would have made the reading slightly more tedious. E-mails can be sent directly to me, danbolas@hotmail.com, or leave your views in the comments at the bottom of the article. Please check out the poll over the next few days as it is being edited to coincide with the Seabass letter.
Thanks For Reading
Hi, anybody know of any good links to websites or forums that show you how to fix appearances of players on the PS3 version of PES08 so that they look more realistic?. Cheers…..
Nice read danbolas.
Also, it annoys me to see injured players on the sidelines sitting with there legs folded as if in meditation.
Konami have added a little screen showing the player run onto the pitch for PES 2008. Why not completely remove the meditating player and show the player getting treatment on the small screen or being directed by the coach as to what to do. It may not even be noticed but it’s a hell of alot better than meditating.
Good points, I also think they should bring back the option of moving the camera angle when playing on the wide camera mode as this made the whole screen open up and helped with making plays better and more fluid.
I played online the other day and had about an 80% lag free game - it almost felt like I was playing someone on the same machine. It made it so much more enjoyable, I just look forward to the day (which should really be today) that this can happen with every game as this could be a superb online game.
Very good points.
My biggest gripe is that I can no longer get a mate to join in a league match and take the reins of my computer opponent. For some reason you can’t move the controller cursor accross the player select screen! Why did they take that ability out. Madness.
a multi player master league should be made available. At the moment, me and a friend play together as a club which is good fun, but a multi player format would be great, along similar lines to champ man/football manager.
i also play online, not a great deal because of the lag and the amount of complete arses who refuse to be any team other than the bih few. i have actually had a few good games with minimal (and sometimes..no!!) lag. I have even played some games that have been brilliant until i have taken the lead and mysteriously really bad lag appears!! I am also very disappointed that you couldn’t have more than one person playing as a team against another multi online team, it would be great to have 4v4 online!
seabass can you please put in the trining that you can make it go back you might do a mistake on training and you can do it back it was on pes6 this but you got it off on pes2008 can you put it on the new one
thanks :-)
Richard, that too is my biggest groan. It’s been present for this many years - then they take it out because of the bloody ‘achievements’ on the XBox 360 (I presume). It HAS to come back.
Hi Dan,
Once again a very good article. Good to read some of the suggestions that I absolutely didn’t think about, but that definitely would be great additions on future PES releases.
Although I (obviously) sincerely hope that most of these suggestions will be included in PES 2009, I am just not sure whether it’s realistic to expect this. It wouldn’t surprise me if the features supported in PES 2009 have already more or less decided upon by Konami/Seabass and that it would be too late from a development perspective to address any of the proposed enhancements for this release.
Let’s hope that I am very wrong about this though…
Thanks
Jasperinho
pleas eplease please put it in 1080p - the gfx look SHIT enough to start with plus then the fact a smaller image is essentially being stretched out to a much bigger res. it looks even worse 1080p!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Presentation Schmesentaion.
Who cares about half of that stuff…..its the games AI that is somehow essentailly at a standstill yet being broken further and further with each PES release.
Out of 6 people I know that normally would be statutory PES gamers, Only 2 people have bought the game and actually play it. (I took my copy back after 1 week). The rest are either playing FIFA or not bothering with a footie game at all. There complaints is nothing to do with presentation or online play as my mates only ever play offline multiplayer. Nope, the big problem they have is the games wonky AI ranging from the keepers spilling everything, the wonky ball physics, and the fact that a good player has a 3/1 chance of scoring right from kick off by just going on a big long 90 yard dribbling mazy.
Some great, and more importantly (i feel) relatively simple ideas to implement, Danbolas. The thing that worries me is that Seabass and Konami should have already addressed half, if not all of the points covered in the above postings before the game was even released.
A few ideas/gripes ….
Why did they have to change the editor?, its not as if the extra memory that it would have taken up is being put to good use elsewhere in the game!There is absolutely no excuse for a next gen game having any lag issues at all, let alone in the offline mode!! Why cant they bring back the all star games? an interactive loading screen wouldn’t go amiss either (anything to get rid of those bloody bubbles!!!!)
Bored now! Just scrap the bloody game and hope another software developer makes a decent football game, PES2008 is an unrealistic arcade paced old gen game at best, just let it go!
im very dissapointed in this game, alot of aspects are good…the fact it turns on, but online is unplayable, and offline is still shit, players cant turn quick enough etc
Been playing for more than a decade really enjoy the game but i feel the transfers, contracts and wages system in the master league need a thorough overhaul. Also the fee for non contracted players,the double appearance of players in the game are both issues that konami should rectify .. that said kudos to seabass and his crew. d
i have 2 say im v dissapointed
there r loads of people cheating online and its doing ma tits in . not 2 mention LAG
i get cheated by freeze play
its only loosing u money konami coz every 1 is buying fifa
if sum 1 cheats me i want 2 kick fuck out him
ne way im away 2 buy fifa 4 the first time in 8 years
fuck u konami and ur pals
In relation to player 2 joining your league match, it has something to do with achievements now, however, on Winning Eleven 10 I think(jap version) on the PS2 you could only have 1 player leagues only aswell, i remember me and my mate gettin severly pissed about it. So don’t blame the xbox360, Konami could easily have made it so the achievements don’t unlock when in 2 player mode same as in 2 player exhibition.
fifa is the better game this year. aint played pes in months. in one of your articles you remembered when you used to run home from school or work just to play your master league. those where the days, but sadly i feel they have gone. if only seabass could see the game as the fans do.
i am just wondering why i have scored about 10 free kicks online in a ranked match that wnt straight in the net and it hasnt unlocked it on my track record????? help