Interfering With Play 19/02/08
Posted by Dan Bolas in Interfering With Play on Tue 19 Feb 2008
In this week’s Interfering With Play, I will be concentrating on the last part of the Seabass letter, the features and game modes available in PES. The letter is now starting to take a decent shape, and we hopefully be almost complete by the time I write next weeks Interfering With Play. Of course, there will be people who feel their views or opinions haven’t been taken into account, but I have read every e-mail and comment, and found these points to be the most frequent, along with the most likely to be featured. As always, there seems to have been a number of major talking points in the gaming world, and indeed the football world these past 7 days, if you have anything you wish to stress your views on, you can do so on here via the comments feature, or by e-mailing me directly, my address is at the bottom.
Seabass Letter: Features
This week’s topic for the Seabass letter is regards the features and game modes of PES2008, and possible ways it could be improved for 2009. Here, feel free to read the ideas, and comment on their importance to you as a PES gamer, along with developing any that may sound like a good idea. These are the collective views of many gamers, along with my own personal views and those of my PES playing mates.
When it comes to game modes, PES has always been very unique. For the past 7 years or so, it has featured updates and improvements in both graphics and controls, but has kept basically the same set game modes all the way through. Any other games series would be slaughtered for the lack on originality, yet PES seems to get away without anyone noticing. Imagine a FPS that had the same maps and weapons, and yet was released 7 consecutively years featuring a handful of new characters, or a driving game that stuck to meagre Time Trials and regular track racing. There is no denying that the features included are all pretty much standard, and to most extents, work very well, however, here we are to look at what could be added, and how existing modes could be improved.
We start with a huge missing feature from the next generation version PES, and that is the shop mode. There is no way this feature should have been taken out. PES points achieved by playing friendly matches or winning tournaments meant you could unlock the players and teams you personally wanted at the time you wanted them, and not have to do an entire tournament just to unlock one player you would like to sign in Master League. The idea of having further unlock able content, such as celebrations, or even the option to play matches using old time commentators and black and white style footage would be welcomed, along with silly features like the ability to design ad boards or corner flags. The bottom line is for as long as I can remember, PES has enjoyed relative success with the shop mode, so much so that EA Sports have since implemented it into FIFA, and it is a travesty that it was removed from this PES.
One mode that a lot of people have called for is a Referee mode, whereby you actually control the ref, and make decisions on the pitch, acquiring rating points for successful games or fairly officiated contests. Whilst this does seem like a good novelty idea on my part, I could see it getting boring quite quickly. At the end of the day, when you go out to play football with your mates, no one dreams of being the ref, and whilst the feature would be good fun in a 3 player environment, it would more than likely result in bias decisions, and I would personally prefer the time to be spent making a better online experience as opposed to bringing in a more novelty game type.
Another hugely popular mode, and something that I could defiantly get on board with, is the Indoor mode, or a 5/7 a side version of the game. It is brought in a lot in basketball games, whereby you can form a small-sided team in a one off match against another group of players. The players do not need to be of the same nationality, nor play for the same club, and it would offer a quick fire alternative to the 11 on 11 games. I am not suggesting it is made OTT, like FIFA Street, but instead using the same game engine as that used in PES 2008. The option of playing 5 a side on a smaller, indoor pitch, with smaller goals would not only provide a different game mode, it would also improve gamers short passing play, which would in turn add them in crowded penalty areas. A 7 a side mode would act as a go between, and could even be played on a more bouncy, Astroturf like surface that would give a different feel to the matches. Both types of game would be played on smaller pitches, obviously the 5 a side pitch being smaller than the 7 a side one, and the goals would be as appropriate, long and low 5 a side goals, and hockey style goals for the 7 a side. Rules could even be changed to the players will, with head height rules, kick ins, slide tackling or even the area rule all being open for interpretation by the gamer. I really feel this mode would work well, and Seabass could do a lot worse than bring it into PES 2009.
One feature that was touched upon earlier, and would work would be a multi ball system during matches. Having ball boys situated around the pitch, they could quickly retrieve the ball or have one close to where they are located in order to throw the ball to the set piece taker. This would be welcomed in order to increase continuation throughout the matches, but also be practical as, whilst there are so few stadiums on PES, this mode would also be realistic, with most big clubs opting to employ this system.
The master league is arguably the best game mode in any sports series, offing you to take the hold of a lower league club, with a playing staff of no namers, and turn them into a world-class footballing outfit fronted by big name superstars. This mode has gradually been updated each year, with realistic player aging, progression and contracts. However, it is now more than ready for a bit of an overhaul. Gamers have requested things such as the ability to switch between clubs, a feature, which would make the game slightly more management like, and the ability to include custom teams as competition, a feature that would potentially allow for a Championship and League 1 section of the league. Two of the best suggestions though, are ones that Konami should really find easy implementing. Firstly, the introduction of currency, be in € or £, in order to bring realism to the transfer dealings. This seems such a simple thing to bring in, and I am pretty sure it is down to the fact they can’t be bothered to convert the game from Yen to Pounds to Dollars, as the game is released over different locations. Slack and lazy, but more than likely one of the many corners cut in order to ensure the release is as close to EA Sports’ title as possible. The other feature, which again would be more of a novelty, would be the ability to customise the starting 22 players you have, by both appearance and name only. Players like Castello, Miranda and Espinas have all been legendary for me over the years, but the option to replace these with my mates would be too good to miss. Having a team that looks like your school team, or Sunday league mates would make the Master League that little more personal, and make it so much harder when you finally sold yourself in order to bring in Cristiano Ronaldo.
The league and cup game modes have always been pretty solid in PES, and this year was no exception. On this front, and with many others such as the Exhibition mode, I would not change a thing. One thing I find exceptionally strange though, is that game modes are constantly removed from PES. No longer can you have a Penalty Shoot out with your mates, choose the referee or play a Random Selection match. The fact that these things are not massive loses means that people don’t tend to moan about them as much, however many gamers will tell you they were welcome things, and should be brought back in as soon as possible. The analogy best suited would be that of making a new car. Features like Sat Nav are very popular and more than welcome but are no good if something like electric windows don’t feature. If something is working well, it should still be part of the end product, no matter how small it may seem.
That is the main points I have received on the audio front in the e-mails and comments. Any build up on this or possible ideas related to these can be sent to me via e-mail or left as comments at the bottom of this article.
That is it for the Seabass Letter now. Any comments about anything read over the past few weeks need to reach me by the weekend, as I will be putting together a finished text in order to send next week.
Eat My Goal
One of the craziest features is the current debarkle regarding the GOTM competition run on this site, in association with Console Goals. I personally have nothing to do with the organising and deciding which goals feature, and am more than happy to vote for the goal which I feel is the best goal. The fact is, the prize of a free game makes the competition more than worth entering, and as soon as it is easier to upload my PS3 scored goals online, I will be myself taking part in events. Some people need to just chill out and face facts though, that the goal which won did so on public votes, and was not chosen by a panel of experts or even Alan Hansen. You don’t like the goal, that’s fine, don’t vote for it, but when a goal wins so convincingly in a public domain vote, then that means the majority of people liked it the best. Fact. I think it’s pretty sad the people can’t be gracious enough to accept a good goal, even if it is scored against them.
It’s A Kind Of Magic
Love it or hate it, there is no denying there is a certain something about the FA Cup. This year more than most, it has seen many Premier League sides face off against lower league opposition, and huge scalps been taken as a result. Nowadays, it seems un-cool to want to win the FA Cup, and with so much money being thrown at the Premier and Champions League winners, it is understandable that managers may be tempted to field a weaker team. However, it’s the same Liverpool fans that are saying there not bothered as the ones who were celebrating when Michael Owen scored 2 late goals against Arsenal to help them lift the trophy. Try telling Barnsley, Cardiff or even Preston, who were crushed in the last minute, that the competition means nothing. In a day and age where English football seems to be losing its traditions and heritage on a weekly basis, its nice to have something still running that has been both successful and sought after by many professionals and clubs. I end with the statement that the only time a manager ‘doesn’t care about the cup’ is when their side are no longer in it!
That’s your lot for this week. As always all comments are welcome. If you have a great deal to say, I recommend you do so by e-mail, but short public comments are probably better on the comments section of the site. danbolas@hotmail.com is where your mails can be sent.
Thanks for Reading
The letter is looking good and am praying Komami will read it and use it to create a better game this year. When it comes to features i enjoy having friends over and playing cups it just annoys me that the asian cup only has 5 teams rather then 16 and the winner of the actual tornament iraq not even being featured in the game. The best feature for me for them to add would be an ‘add team’ button where we could just add teams and make them ourselves. but im guessing thats only a dream due to licensing and everything. anyway, keep up the good work with the letter and cant wait to see it completed
Game modes which I think would be cool to have:
1) scenarios - like the old games used to have. at least 10 challenges for matches, where for example you’ve been reduced to 10 men, and have to score an away goal to go through in a competition, or score a hat-trick with a certain player in the second half of a match, etc.
2) training - i liked the old training modes of shooting, passing, dribbling round bollards
3) classic teams - i’d like to see the return of unlockable classic teams, and not just the bog standard 6 national sides of england, brazil, italy etc. some classic club sides would be really good - ac milan of the 90s (van basten, gullet et al), liverpool of the 80s, and many other top sides.
there’s no reason why these teams can’t be made available as downloadable content in the future too.
4) classic players - having a library of potentially hundreds of the world’s best players available would be fantastic - weah, pele, maradona, batistuta, hagi…
5) custom teams - once you have a lot of the classic players available, it would be great to be able to create teams for a classic league (potentially even a complete classic master league mode) with classic players only. that would be fantastic for nostalgia.
6) custom competitions - being able to create a league/cup competition with your own format should be a given. we shouldn’t need to ask for it!
7) 7 a side sounds like a good idea
8) goal saves - we should have unlimited goal saves, limited only by your hdd capacity. we should be able to upload them to official/non-official pes goal sites too - like consolegoals.
9) shop mode - as you’ve pointed out - these small modes should not be removed once introduced. konami have been shafting us with shoddy production for too long
When playing a league with a friend we have to choose every team in that league, since human players cant take control of the opposing team!?! You guys know what I mean and it´s probably the biggest disgrace about PES 2008! Why did Konami remove that?
as a massive liverpool fan i think thats wrong saying that we dont care about the fa cup,i personally would like us to win everything and the team we played against barnsley should beat any championship team.only little armchair supporters who know nothing and dont go to games will say they dont want to win the fa cup,obviously with playing inter last night rafa wouldnt risk stevie an torres incase they got injured for a bigger game and to be honest last night was 1 of the best games ive been in a long time and was a great performance so he was right to have not played them.
anyway id love to see indoor added into pes 2009,i loved it on fifa 1998 and have always wanted it on pes,also the shop mode is definately needed and the edit mode needs bringing back for better prem kits.
other bads things of pes 2008 which need bringing back is the option to select kits in master league,i wanted a better challenge than going liverpool so i went tottenham and when you play juventus, both teams are in the home kits which is ridiculous.random selection also needs to return,i had so much fun and had a great laugh playing mates with a team of legends and current world class players,i cant believe konami took that option away
p.s i also think the game should have a few extra diffficulty levels because there is no way tottenham would beat inter or ac milan an the likes of them teams 6-0 on top level,that is so unrealistic
Waiting for the whistle on free kicks,corners, goal-kicks, penalties and throw-ins is infuriating and completely unecessary. I still hit start 2 or 3 times when a corner is coming up trying to skip the wait.
Actually mate, I think the currency issue is because the game calculates the ponts value of a player based on age,skills and future development curve. Therefore, once Kanami have set the formula (points + or - based on each stat), they apply it to all the players. If they were to attempt what you suggest (which I think is a good idea)they’d have to assign a real world Pound, Dollar or Yen value to EVERY player in the game, and then create a new formula for it to work out the player’s increse/decrease in value. Hope the letter goes well, here’s hoping PES 2009 is fantastic.
the sound needs to be sorted out that includes crowd, commentry, players kicking the ball, on pitch sounds etc…also the fact when you either score consaltaion goals or a late winner the crowd would either go crazy or jus stay quite n the celebration 4rm the players would be different whether it will be a difference 4rm winning or losing etc. the sound needs to be improved alot to be a much better game n also in comparison to fifa at the moment
The Official Nintendo Mag have just reviewed PES on Wii and given it 90% However, they failed to mention anything with regards to editing facilities, teams, rosters etc so I asked them about it in their forum and this is what they had to say!!!
http://www.officialnintendomagazine.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=5566
Sorry guys, all your hard work editing and being able to edit isn’t important apparently.
uhhhhh……..just a query guys…..has anyone ever missed a penalty on ps3 version of pes08, by putting it down the middle along the floor?? ive played about 10 seasons in master league on top player and always put my pens down the middle and the keeper has NEVER saved any….EVER!! surely this is a game fault….tho i dont complain when i get a pen in the 89th minute when its 0-0!!! goaaaaal time!
New option file out now for pes08 on ps3!!!
heres the link >>>> http://www.neoseeker.com/forums/36342/t1099477-neoseeker-option-file-ii/1.htm
1) scenarios - like the old games used to have. at least 10 challenges for matches, where for example you’ve been reduced to 10 men, and have to score an away goal to go through in a competition, or score a hat-trick with a certain player in the second half of a match, etc.
i’m with you there dodgydoughnut, the scenarios was brilliant alternative to playing matches, i loved it. gutted that it’s gone.
i also enjoyed the training challenge mode, that was wicked, gone again.
a short sided game would also be good fun. i remeber when you could pick 7-11 players per team, the 7 aside games were always entertaining.
right - master league. it is good but can be improved so much. need currency, need multiplayer options, so you could have 2 or more human players at different clubs ala football manager. and the ability to move clubs once you’ve taken a team as far as you can. there needs to be a higher difficulty level as well, i find that after 2-3 seasons of building up a brilliant squad, there is no stopping me and no challenge left.
yeah the waiting for a whistle is an absolute bastard but i actually think the currencyis better i hate fifa an the pounds especially as it can only go 2 a certain amount but if it can go to however much u want then i wouldnt mind tha
In regards to Liverpool and the FA Cup. I think Liverpool care more about the cup than other ‘top’ teams such as Arsenal and Man Utd. They play each other and field what you can definately call ‘weakened’ teams. However with modern football revolving around money, its no surprise that teams would rather win the Champions League than the FA Cup. That is not the clubs fault, or the players - its just how it is now adays. Liverpool were gutted to be knocked out by Barnsley, but to loose to Inter would have been a disaster.
who knows the list of the free master league players??
another great mode i forgot about was the career mode where you took one player and tried to make it through training, getting into the team and going to see some crazy gypsy who would tell your future, if your team mates didn’t like you, they would put pins in your boots and your silly girlfriend would bring your clogs to training by accident. that was mental but funny
Just a rumour, but, PES has been dropped for 2008 release. The next PES game will not release until late 2009 due to development issues. Rumour has it that Seabass is on his way out of Konami and there is a real possibility that PES2009 will be the last game in the series for the foreseable future.
@franny
Are you actualy able to string a concise sentence together?
I’ve always wished they would include some players in the original ML team who actually do have some interesting potential. It’d be great to start with 17 y/o youngsters who are just as bad as Huylens but who can get to be quite good, if not superstars. I’m not asking that they’re good when you start the game -actually, they should be crappier than your crap players- but that they have the potential (80-85 average) to become great players in a few years. It’s quite a let down to get a couple of 17-18 y/o, look at their stats and realize they won’t even get to be like Castolo.
Oh, and also, being able to train players so that they acquire stars (you know, special abilities) would be great. I’ve missed it since PES 3. Or was it 4?
@assache
Are you “actualy” able to spell actually?
No one noticed!
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Has the online lag on the 360 version gone yet?
Game modes which I think would be cool 2 have:
1-scenarios-not just some stadiums…all the stadiums from all teams…the grass…ad. placards, the public…and more
2-game play-new moves and tricks new goalkeepers:P the speed of the game…
new balls effects…
3-editing-new players,teams,logos,emblems modification,kit modification…
new boots,kits,balls,rings,glasses,hats,gloves…
4-leagues-new leagues(Bundesliga and Portuguese league)new leagues mode…
5-modes-Be a PRO mode or something like that…
The first thing I thing they need to improve is the Master League.
3 years ago it was the best, but right now it needs a serious upgrade.
I thing that the development of a primavera like team will be great.
So you can have a bunch of new lads like Dos Santos, Bojan, Giovinco,
Messi, Walcott and other come from your young team and hace them like
icons after 10 years with your club.
It also will be nice if you can out loan a player with out the need
of another team to ask it for you. In many cases I thing the big teams
out loan players to let them develop in another teams because the
lack of first team option they have. Players like Giovinco from Juventus.
He is out loaned to Empoli I think so it can play matches in Serie A
and develope himself.
The master league needs more deep in minor details to, like currency (this subject is
alrready mention) if a player is on loan the two teams can reach an agreement like
the payment per year is divides in equal parts, an priority agreement that make the
team that take the player for loan have a preferencial order to buy him at the end
of the year. Thigs like bonus cash for players if they win big tournaments or other
in their contracts and this can make big clubs to fight for a player with best
incentive to lure the player so it can simulate the situation from real life.
Another thing that made me angry is the fact than when you play a CHAMPIONS LEAGUE
match your players dont develop as an League match. C’mon this is pathetic. I think
the develop system must be arrange. A match between Man U and Arsenal must gave the
players more development points than one of Man U vs Sheffield. And a final of the
Champions League even more points!!!!
Another thing that happends in real life and in the Master League it doesnt reach
the level of reality is the problem of the Fifa Fixtures that takes away players
from the squads of the clubs. It is easy to emulate an upcoming Fifa World Cup,
an African Nations Cup, Euro Cup, Olympics and Fifa Fixtures. It would be nice also
that if you have a young talent from Brazil and he is playing at a rating of 6.5 per
match, eventually he can be call up two. But no!!! after 5 years of history the teams
reamins the same, they call the same players for all the Fifa Matches Days and that is
not what happens in real life, the coaches take the better players in the moment.
C’mon lets make a better PES for everybody, more minor leagues and it doesnt matter
if you cant put the real names just let us edit them in the editor and we will change
the names of the lower division teams, we just one more realistic to the game and
you people are letting that Fifa to take the crown of better game just because of
the lack of imagination or even worst just the lack of will to make a better game.
Sorry my english cause I am from Panama.
also materleague becomes very easy after 2-3seasons…they need to make the difficulty much more higher as it is very easy once players have developed to become to easy to play with and also comtinue to win games with high scores
@Panama
I have a friend by the name of Franny that could really do with your help with regard to English lessons.
Great Post.
@assache
Thanks, sometimes my english is better but there was a lot to write and I was at work so I couldn’t stop and check all the grammatic HORRORS that I wrote.
Hehehehe
Is good to know that you like my post.
I hope that they improve the accumilated fatique situation, as players become tired far too quickly.
I find myself having to turn accumilated fatique off otherwise the whole side needs replacing after just one game.
Let’s keep our fingers crossed that the next game will have this minor issue ironed out.
Hey Dan
What will you write about once you’ve finished the letter??
@mn9ajas
That is a very good question!
Easy - the next letter to konami about the shocking state of pes9, and what needs to be done for pes10…
Yeah probably ;) Although (and I know its a big outside chance!) but the Wii version seems to be shaping up to be a completely different type of PES. Fingers crossed that its good.
Reckon I’ll trade in my PS3 verion for either the PSP version this week or Call of Duty 4.