Interfering With Play 04/09/07
Posted by Dan Bolas in Interfering With Play on Tue 04 Sep
I have been away on holiday for the past week or so, and therefore haven’t had access to a PC to write my column. However, I am back now, and having read through the various articles on PESGaming.com, and the surrounding websites, I feel there are more than enough talking points, so am jumping straight in.
Feedback
I don’t want to dwell on this point too much, as it made up the bulk of my previous article, but I’d like to start off by taking the views of John4 on board, with regards to the Sven reign at Man City, and the way the British press treat England players. I agree that the press do make England seem a better side than they really are at times, and give certain players more credit than they maybe deserve. But I also believe that footballers have a right to earn their money. At the top it is maybe a 10-year career, and if you can make extra money by doing sponsorship deals or advertising campaigns, do them while you can because no one will be interested when they are 50 year olds! I think the underlying fact is, because we (well England Fans) really crave that major tournament win, we get so frustrated when we keep getting so close. In other sports, namely Rugby and Cricket, the England team have had major triumphs in recent memory, where as it’s been over 40 years since the football team have lifted some notable silver wear. And we can blame the advertising, or the boss, or the style of football, but if we played like Bolton and won the World Cup, I believe it would satisfy an urge among many generations of begrudged England supporters.
The Clock Is Ticking
At the time of writing this article, its just under two months to the eagerly anticipated release of PES 2008, and having read the articles and comments on this site there seems to be a lot of mixed opinions about the standard of the game. The obvious comparisons to Fifa will be made, and I will address those in a minute, but I would first like to get a few points off my chest about Konami’s new release. Having played the next-gen version of PES 6 on X Box 360, I found it a solid game, but lacking in the lifespan of the PS2 counterpart, especially in the editing department. Of course, anyone who has played the X-Box 360 version knows this, but as has been written, the new version of PES will have full editing on the next gen modes.
So what is all the panic about?! Yes, some of the screenshots seem to lack a HD / Next Gen feel, but the majority of in game videos are images taken on camera phones or shaky hand held camcorders. Whilst there is no doubt the PS2 and other older consoles may have a bit of a bum deal graphically, the next gen consoles will get a better graphical experience than the previous years game. That is progress. The option of putting your own face or digital scans in the game is a massive bonus to many people, who see editing Pro Evo as normal as playing a Master League. This again is progress. The addition of new commentators, granted who will be relying on a half decent script in order to save another collection of one line links, is Konami addressing a need that the precious duo were both out of date and not good enough. Again, this is progress. My point is that the game is already the premier football game on the market, and is making small steps forward. If it tried to make a giant leap, it might end up falling flat on its face, and I would rather have a quality football game that runs on a tried and trusted graphics engine than gamble on a whole knew one, especially when the PS3 is so new on the market, and developers are still learning the full extent of its power.
So Close, Yet So Far
I was delighted to read that there was a 59-track soundtrack to the new PES game, believing that finally you could import your own music to replays, or as background sound when doing the tedious editing jobs. But from reading comments and articles, it seems that this is a bog standard 59 generic music track play list that cannot be edited. I wrote an article on the PESGAMING.com message board following PES3, saying this would be a welcome addition to the PC version of the game, but it fell upon many peoples opinion that you just have the radio or iPod on and turn the sound off the game. I would appreciate peoples input on the subject as to whether or not this is as desired by other people as it is by myself.
The Big Two
Man United vs. Arsenal, Tyson vs. Holyfield, England vs. Australia, The Rock vs. Stonecold Steve Austin (got to get a WWE reference in!) All legendary battles, things people look forward to. Each side is equally supported by people who can give you 100 reasons why theirs in superior to their counterpart. And of course, the big one in the gaming world, Fifa vs. Pro Evo.
Since the introduction of Pro Evolution Soccer in 2001 (changing from ISS Pro Evolution Soccer 2 on PSONE), the Konami brand has been released annually, several weeks after EA Sports brings out its yearly Fifa offering. There is no denying, up until the ISS series; Fifa was the supreme footballing game. On both mega drive and PC, it offered a more realistic soccer experience, with features such as being able to block down goalkeepers kicks and even running away from the referee to avoid a yellow yard! But then, it fell on hard times, and as the Konami series progressed, Fifa concentrated more on fads such as Classic teams, First Touch, and big name sponsorship deals to shift their games. Over the past two or three years, people have started to say the gap between the two games has shrunk, and Fifa is now almost as good as PES.
In my personal opinion, this is far from the truth. I am a huge football fan, and own EVERY Fifa game since its introduction in 1994, with the exception of the European Champions and World Cup ‘updates’. Whilst Fifa has some excellent concepts, the game play and indeed the in game animation is far behind PES. The cut scenes are beautifully rendered, the menus are crisp and as mentioned above, the customable music tracks feature some of the worlds most hotly anticipated acts. But when you pick up the controller to play a match, all of that doesn’t matter. I started a league on Fifa 2007 for Pc only last weekend. Ten games into the season I find it both tedious and unrealistic. As Aston Villa, the only game I have lost in to Gillingham in the League Cup, and Watford currently sit top of the premier league having toppled Chelsea 4-0 at the Bridge. (Please note that this is on the middle difficulty setting) The games feel like a predetermined series of events that no matter how hard you try, you must follow. It doesn’t feel like a football game.
Which got me thinking. I have asked around a collection of mates, and found the following discovery. The majority of people who say Fifa is better than Pro use the timely reason, “It hasn’t got real names and kits”. These are merely cosmetic things that are easily changed with an option file. Technically, whilst many of my Pro playing mates could find many faults with Fifa, the Fifa players struggled to do so with Pro Evo. Yes graphically Fifa can show off its shine, but great graphics don’t necessarily make a great game, as many retro gaming fans will agree with!
I have got a bit carried away with my Fifa vs. Pro rant there, and have failed to touch on several other points of the week. However, I am sure I will find plenty of time to discuss these in future articles. My final word will be though, don’t panic about graphics, just wait for the game to be in your console, and see if you will moaning when your first 25-yard screamer flies in!
As always, comments or discussion topics are welcome. Either catch me on here or hit me on my e-mail address, danbolas@hotmail.com
Thanks For Reading
Dan Bolas I love you…petey take a lesson,positive thinkin what i like to see….
As both a PES and FIFA fan, I think you are downsizing PES problems. Not having liscenses is a big deal: FIFA may not have referees, but PES doesn’t even have the teams. Plus, graphics, like it or not, sells games for new players. Sure, experienced and loyal gamers will knock it off as nothing, but sub-par graphics won’t attract the new market. Another comparison you forgot to mention is the two Manager Modes. While the PES one is okay (no real currency? come on), the FIFA one is very interactive. Lastly, even though PES surely still dominates gameplay, FIFA this year is the one heading towards innovation, introducing its Be a Pro Mode and plans for 10v10 online play by 2009/2010.
Just as a safeguard from flaming, I was just listing PES faults, not FIFAs. So it’s not personal, just constructive criticism.
By the way: PS3 FIFA and PC PES for me :D
Interesting points, ones which i think warrant response. Firstly, the two games audiences will be determined by a number of factors. As with the mjority of EA Sports games, their developed as games first rather than sims. Having played, and thoroghly enjoyed NBA 03 on the PC from EA Sports, i read the reviews expecting it to get raving reports. But basketball fans seemed to be sayin the same things that football fans are sayiny about the Fifa series. It is developed for gamers rather than fans of the sport. This is followed up by games such as the NHL franchise and The Cricket franchise.
As for the mention of manager mode, i did touch upon it, but the Fifa 2007 offering was terrible. Using the PC mouse menu’s were more complicated than they need to be, the features were EXCEPTIONALLY limited and for me, the offer of having a pound sign in front of figures isn;t the be all and end all. Buying and selling players is a huge song and dance around clubs offering £10 below or above the asking price. I thoroughly enjoyed Fifa Manager 2006, but the management mode on Fifa 2007 acts as a taster for you to then go and buy the next instalement of that series. (Fifa Manager 2007) But again, this is another game that relies on flashy graphics, and football fans will be seen reaching for Football Manager or Championship Manager, with causal gamers prefering the shine of the EA title.
I have never once said Fifa is a poor game, and i know i will end up purchasing a copy of it in 2008, but the game is littered with equally as many faults as Pro, and unless a miricle occurs, it won’t have picked up on the majoirty of them.
Good points thought, much food for thought! And its not personal, its opinion, and thats the whole point!
Good article Dan,
The gamers that knock PES for not having a fully licensed EPL are pretty shallow - as Dan said, Option files & patches easily clear this up.
Even if we did have a fully licesnsed EPL - 8 out of 10 online-noobs would still play as Barcelona/Inter/Brazil so it does not make any bloody difference IMO.
People this foolish and petty who want style over substance can glady bugger off to their preschool FIFA games.
Some great observations Dan. I have played virtually every football game there has been on whatever console you care to mention. I was a massive sensible soccer fan and got well into dino dini`s GOAL. Then, fifa came along on the megadrive and for a shortish time took my life over. Its isometric view of the pitch and shiny graphics captured my imagination. Tell you what though, after a while, i dived back into sensi, little sprites or not, sensi gave me the the feeling that when playing, i had to make FOOTBALL decisions, fifa didnt do that at all. As the years have gone by i got into PS1 and bought the initial batch of fifas, i thought the best one was fifa rtwc98, i always got a tad bored with fifas after i felt i had done everything and scored the same goals over and over. Then ISS came along, that was it!!!…a game that had the feel of real football, tell you what, ISS and the pro evo series are the only games that make me physically, on occasion, stick a foot out or stretch a leg to block a shot or make a pass, fifa has never had that effect on me.
Last year i gave FIFA 07 a go for the few weeks before pro evo 6 came out, i confess i quite enjoyed the change, but, as fifas of the past, i got fed up with it and couldnt wait to play pro evo. This year ive pre ordered both games for my PS3, judging by the reports, FIFA will be a vast improvement, it may well be that i will dip back and forth between the two, i supect though that after a week of fifa, i will be dying for my pro evo fix, we will see. For all its spanky shinyness, FIFA doesnt have the flexibility that pro evo has, i LOVE the exitement of the editing suite, looking for the latest option files, making teams and emblems, looks like this pro evo will be fantastic for that, i cant wait. Ive seen the screenshots of FIFA and its same old same old, fifa looking like the belle of the ball, but, pick up the pad, slip your copy of pro evo 2008 into your PS3 or your 360 and pick up your controller, sit back and SMELL THE GRASS!!!!
i agree with every single point you made here..fifa might look great but for true football fans is most important the game play and controls and thats where fifa is nowhere near pes.
Great article Dan!
Firstly Dan, may I point out that I actually support Gillingham and so naturally would say that I expected you to get beaten by them!!! (To all you Chelsea fans out there - There are only one mighty blues!!)
I am a pro evo fan. Always have been and always will be, however, last year I must admit I wavered to the ‘dark side’ if just for a brief moment and here are the reasons why, and why I can see why people think the gap was closing:
I had a Xbox 360 and so playing Pro Evo 6 on it was like trying to wade through porridge! It seemed laborius, rigid and unfinished (which it was) compared to the old PS2 versions I had owned. By contrast Fifa 07 was smoother and felt a lot more fluid. I liked the fact you could send team mates on sensible runs compared to the ‘on the rail’ runs in Pro Evo. I liked the fact that it had proper teams and players (No option files for the 360 version of pro evo at the time - is there now??) I also liked the fact that I could play as lower league teams, like the one and only Gillingham (Bless!) and I also liked the fact that the whole set of menu screens didn’t look as if they had been designed by my four year old nephew!
However, after a month I had enough of playing fifa. Sure it was great scoring goals all the time but 7-0 most matches, with Gillingham(!), on the hardest settings wasn’t doing it for me. So what did I do you might ask!?!
I sold my Xbox 360 and bought a PS3 with a PS2 version of Pro Evo 6!!! Man the difference between the two versions is like different worlds (even with the PS3s L1 & R2 trigger buttons). If Konami can produce a PS3 version along the same lines as the Pro Evo 6 PS2 version then there shouldn’t be any competition. However, seen as EA seem to steal other peoples ideas, why not steal some of their ideas from Fifa - I would still like to send my players on runs when I want them to run and I think Konami should smarten up the front end even more than some of the new screen shots I’ve seen.
If only they could just match Fifa in the presentation stakes whilst keeping the ultimate level of gameplay maybe we wouldn’t need to keep having this discussing.
im not sure if there are more than one person who writes these columns, however if this is only one person, YOU CHANGE YOUR MIND everytime i read. Only a few weeks ago you were saying that PES looked average and wasn’t much better than last years, even going onto compare it with the ‘polished’ FIFA 08.
Now ive looked iss and pes up and including PES4, but pes 6 on the 360 is pants (graphically, editing and gameplay wasn’t upto much). customers have spent millions buying pes over the years and what do we get in return? a half baked pes 2008. now ill reserve judgement on gameplay which admittedly is the most important, but for it to look like its playing on a PC built in 1999, instead of a state of the art games console (have you guys seen bioshock, gears of war and dare i say it FIFA etc) its a joke!
invest in some graphics and sponsors and bring back pes3 gameplay…..jobs a good one
OK i agree that graphics in FIFA are awesome … stadiums are much better .. but there’s one thing, FIFA is simply for gamers !! the reason is here … whenever u start a season on FIFA and get to manage ur team ” the board” assigns u tasks u have to follow, which makes the game so boring .. i was asked to use sylvinho at Barcelona ( ????) so the fans will be happy ..what in the world is that .. also, as soon as i started the season P. Nedved signed for Inter haha is that what u call real soccer ?????? … this little thing make a BIG difference between 2 games, maybe PES dont have enough teams and graphocs are still retro-like, but the game experience is much different, a weak team will be always a weak team, while in FIFA any spainsh 2nd division team can beat ur powerful Barcelona … FIFA indeed is improving, but will never ever be like PES .. i just started a FIFA season with Catania and i could beat most of my opponents (including Roma and Inter) in the hardest level with scores of 4-0 and higher … i tried the same on PES07 with the same team .. i have tied most of my matches, lost 2 against Milan and Roma, and won only one vs. Siena … this is what i call real soccer !!!
hey, i agree with what alot of you are sayin with fifa bein a really unrealistic, on the 360 i started a season with liverpool, went straight on the transfer list and found rooney, ferdinand and terry on the transfer list!!! now what is that all about i meen come on, is that some kind of joke! so i signed them up and just sold most of my poor players which is so easy to do as soon as ya put them on the transfer list and a game later you find that someone comes in with the price you asked for, so you still have alot of money and you have the worlds greatest team on world class mode unbeatable winning absolutly everything, i wonder where fifa get this crap from. so now on the new one they decide to put the most unrealistic tricks into the the game that looks like somthing out of fifa street?!?! i’m sorry but fifa is the most unrealistic game ever seen the graphics look great and its nice that they get the licences but i cudent care less because pro evo has always been twice the game.
thx for reading
yeah Fifa is so unrealistic i remember watford and sheffield united were coming 2nd and 3rd in my game while chelsea,liverpool and spurs were in the lower half of the table and the season was nearly over..in pes the big teams always do well and the bad teams do bad which is so realistic..also fifa is so easy after about a month your playing on the highest difficulty and it just gets boring pretty fast..
I agree with you in 100%. I`d play every Fifa and every PES and In the beginning its Ok. But leter I notice that I run only PES because FIFA is BORING!! Gameplay is slow and always thesame there is na fun in it… So I every year stop playing FIFA after week:) PES have worst graphic and don`t have teams but gameplay is awesome and for real player this is the most important thing - FUN!!!