[TACTICS] The Real-Life Tactic Creation Thread

[Chilli81]

nice thread, mate! this will be very useful

one question, how do you justify your dortmund settings?
i have seen every single game the past three years and there is no other team that plays that aggressive and highly-frequented pressing like dortmund. i sadly not found a video analysis on youtube, here is some match analysis

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/201...nal/index.html

http://www.zonalmarking.net/2011/01/...tmund-tactics/

http://www.zonalmarking.net/2011/02/...tmund-tactics/

for pes 2012 i have used

Player Support: 15
Support Range: 5
Position Switch:13
Attacking Style: 8
Pressing: 17
Defensive Line: 13
Compactiveness: 6

as standard tactics. It seems to be quite realistic. The goal has to be a well balanced tactic between tici-taca-possession game and quick counters. Quick Switches between defense and offense, as soon as the opponent gets the ball the whole team has to move back to the own half rapidly combined with aggressive pressing. maybe there is a better setting than mine but im quite happy with it.

additional quick counter with deep defensive line (same formation), all-out-attack with 4-3-3 (gündogan and götze as AMF) and Long Ball with HUMMELS as additional Attacker in opponents Box, replaced by Gündogan as DMF standing deep providing long balls.

[klashman]

Originally Posted by divadinho

Great work Klash!

However, as a test I set up the tactics for Barca and Stoke and watched a match between the two. Super Star difficulty, 15 minute match time, random form. And at the end of the match, despite Barca winning 3-1, they only had 49% of the possession. Is there a way that we can get Barca to just keep the ball in PES this year?

Stoke played as you'd sort of expect, throwing long balls up towards Crouch and Walters, but maybe they also threw them a bit too much. Stoke in recent times have begun actually playing it on the floor a bit more and Bolton have took over as the leading long ball team haha.

Despite these few observations, I feel you are contributing a great deal to making ML in PES 2012 the most enjoyable experience yet! Oh and don't take these as negative comments, I'm just posting my observations so that you can perhaps tweak them? Just constructive criticism.

Keep up the good work!

Hi, errm, it might be that your tested them both on 0 speed setting or even -1. I did my tests on -2, so players like Xavi especially never rush on the ball. On faster speeds there isn't any reason to be paitent.

Thing is you could have been using -2 so i'm not sure.

You want to essential see barca play lots of small passes, find it hard to make attacks since they pressure you so much and at the end of each have have them say on average 54-60 of the possesion in a 15 mintue game.

In longer matches they will keep the ball more. In 15 mintues they should keep the ball but not take say 3 minutes to create a chance etc..

As for Stoke. They do use their wingers more these days, they have imporved a bit, hmm thing is i think i watched them vs Besiktas and it seemed they went back to the old days off hoof and bully. Don't take the tactics too literally. change them to the styles you want to see.

also can you do some teams?

Originally Posted by goalgerd

klash il have my optionfile ready by monday and am then passing it on to chimps,would you have a look at it and set those up when he is finished with it cheers

yeah, ok

[klashman]

Originally Posted by Chilli81

nice thread, mate! this will be very useful

one question, how do you justify your dortmund settings?
i have seen every single game the past three years and there is no other team that plays that aggressive and highly-frequented pressing like dortmund. i sadly not found a video analysis on youtube, here is some match analysis

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/201...nal/index.html

http://www.zonalmarking.net/2011/01/...tmund-tactics/

http://www.zonalmarking.net/2011/02/...tmund-tactics/

for pes 2012 i have used

Player Support: 15
Support Range: 5
Position Switch:13
Attacking Style: 8
Pressing: 17
Defensive Line: 13
Compactiveness: 6

as standard tactics. It seems to be quite realistic. The goal has to be a well balanced tactic between tici-taca-possession game and quick counters. Quick Switches between defense and offense, as soon as the opponent gets the ball the whole team has to move back to the own half rapidly combined with aggressive pressing. maybe there is a better setting than mine but im quite happy with it.

additional quick counter with deep defensive line (same formation), all-out-attack with 4-3-3 (gündogan and götze as AMF) and Long Ball with HUMMELS as additional Attacker in opponents Box, replaced by Gündogan as DMF standing deep providing long balls.

This is the issue i'm having, i'm not an expert on all the teams but many have expected me to get every team dead on right.

I saw loads of dortmund last year and this year. they play nice football,very nice, their centerbacks sit quite deep however and having pressure over 13 means they will push up all over the place and move out of position. Also they do love to counter once they are leading and in general like countering so i gave them similar settings to what i did in PES 2011 which worked scarily well. they played almost identicly like they did in real life.

how player support works is really the 'speed' of the attack rather than how they move in the attack. So by default they like to dominate possesion and play nice passing football in groups. At the back they keep the ball, play it around then once Kagawa gets it, he will work in little passges with Gundogan, Gotze tends to start out wide but drift in and out, they all link u well, they swap postiioins a lot and are really quite dynamic, which is why i gave them these settings.

if your settings work then fine, but wouldn't they be attacking really quickly all the time with 15 as player support?

[divadinho]

Don't get me wrong I'm not expecting you to get every team spot on. I'm trying to chip in with a few pointers here and there. You were right btw, I need to drop my game speed down to -2... Silly me haha. I understand about not taking them too literally as well.

Sorry about this but I also doubt I'll be able to create any tactics. Don't have the time. Sorry...

[Boca Junior]

Awesome thread!!

Im bad with coping real tactics into the game.so im am gonne use this.
helps a lot making the game more real.

Can someone help making west ham united?

[klashman]

Originally Posted by divadinho

Don't get me wrong I'm not expecting you to get every team spot on. I'm trying to chip in with a few pointers here and there. You were right btw, I need to drop my game speed down to -2... Silly me haha. I understand about not taking them too literally as well.

Sorry about this but I also doubt I'll be able to create any tactics. Don't have the time. Sorry...

Thanks for your help man.

[goalgerd]

klash my file is ready now,il send it to chimps first for the stat update and then if youve the time il send it on over for you to do your stuff

[divadinho]

Originally Posted by klashman

Thanks for your help man.

Sarcasm?

But yeah, I tried them on -2 game speed this time, and with me as Real Madrid I still managed to have 53% possession. I can't see anything wrong with the tactics though, it must be the AI within the game itself. I think this because just as you think they're gonna pass it backwards they find a pass and spin 180 degrees to play it forwards instead. :/ This results in the AI not keeping possession and they try too many killer passes instead as well as constantly passing forwards.

Hmmm, I might try some tests later and report back my findings here. Hopefully I find a balance that results in the AI keeping possession. :P

Like I said before though, your tactics are great and looking at them again I am almost certain it's the AI within the game. I wonder if lowering the difficulty to professional would produce better results?

[gianpaolo82]

Nice tactics... but I don't really understand how to change between the 4 tactics in game? Can anyone explain me how to do?

[Cristiano92]

Very useful Thread, waited for this a long time!

[IronCity]

this thread makes me realize I only use 25% of the game Konami delivers. I never seem to change between tactics during a match other than auto playing from behind or in front.

How often are you fellas changing between the possibilities in one match?

[mrgametight]

Originally Posted by IronCity

this thread makes me realize I only use 25% of the game Konami delivers. I never seem to change between tactics during a match other than auto playing from behind or in front.

How often are you fellas changing between the possibilities in one match?

my ML team has 4 different setups one one standard, counter attack, all out defense and all out offense. I switch them up pretty often. I think three of the four have different formations with my standard and counter attacking having the same formation. I like playing a 3-5-2(3-2-3-2 as the game calls it) so I obviously need different formations if I am up a goal or need to throw even more numbers into attack.

[Sabatasso]

This thread is so great, big thanks to all contributors!

I think the game got much more depth and realism once I implemented these tactics, and I also tried emulating "the style" onto other teams as well. Not good enough to post here, so I wait in anticipation for more.

The key element seems to be placing the wide players wide enough to make space for the central players to actually move in the correct patterns. This results in a less "empty" midfield, giving the whole game a more realistic touch. If we can only fix the defense line that tracks too far back into the box, everything will be perfect.

Again thank you, two thumbs way up!

[Chilli81]

Originally Posted by klashman

This is the issue i'm having, i'm not an expert on all the teams but many have expected me to get every team dead on right.

I saw loads of dortmund last year and this year. they play nice football,very nice, their centerbacks sit quite deep however and having pressure over 13 means they will push up all over the place and move out of position. Also they do love to counter once they are leading and in general like countering so i gave them similar settings to what i did in PES 2011 which worked scarily well. they played almost identicly like they did in real life.

how player support works is really the 'speed' of the attack rather than how they move in the attack. So by default they like to dominate possesion and play nice passing football in groups. At the back they keep the ball, play it around then once Kagawa gets it, he will work in little passges with Gundogan, Gotze tends to start out wide but drift in and out, they all link u well, they swap postiioins a lot and are really quite dynamic, which is why i gave them these settings.

if your settings work then fine, but wouldn't they be attacking really quickly all the time with 15 as player support?

sure it seems quite impossible to get every single team that "real", and there are few people who have time to watch footie 24/7. Dont feel any pressure to get it perfect, this thread is absolutely great and huge help. my aim was just to get kinda explanation or something, why you have chosen that settings.

i had some try on your tactics, well the results were interesting.

when watching a CPU game, CPU against CPU (superstar difficulty), dortmund played quite realistic, it was suprising how offensive the team played although you give player support and support range such low lewel settings. I always thought the lower you choose your setting the more defensive and careful the team reacts.
so it was nice to watch, offensive football, double-passing, one-touch, they created a good amount of goal shots and ball possession was always between 50 and 60%. I already noticed watching CPU that the defense had some problems nonetheless, the opponents are also creating lots of shots, especially when attacking over the wings.

When i tried it out myself (superstar difficulty)it was interesting to see how the midfield is pushing the attack zone further and further to opponents box, bender and gündogan, supported by the wbs schmelzer and piszczek made it easier to combinate, you always had someone near to pass the ball.
But my defense felt like an open gate, one lost ball, quick counters from 3 to 5 opponents players, only the centerbacks left and there was the mess. i dont lack at pes normally (although the game difficulty seems rather huge due to good AI) but this was quite terrible.

in reality, dortmund is known as the #1 team in bundesliga when it comes to quick switches between defense and offense. Intense "Offensive Pressing", introduced by Barrios and Kagawa and continued by the whole team to make the opponent lose the ball, superquick counters with few ball contacts, one-touch-football, immediate finish. the coach tries to educate players to finish the whole attack within few seconds.
on the other side, after winning championship this year, dortmund seems to get other reactions, the teams they play against seem to act much more defensively, deep defensive line, the whole team in own half so there is a need to act more with ball possession style than with quick counters. what i try to get into pes is mix between these two. a mix between ball possession and superquick counters, disciplined defense by the whole team, intense pressing.

you were right with your state that with pressing setting above 14/15 the centerbacks start to leave their positions and defende on the wing instead of center, that really seems to be quite unrealistic. but also in this case it would be nice to find a balanced setting between high intense-pressing and disciplined centerbacks holding their positions keep it shut in the middle.

Lookin forward to your thoughts, mate. This thread, this source is absolutely awesome, keep it going

[EFC-CPT]

@klashman
Can you make a good Formation for Bologna plz?
Many THX