PES is dead. Long live Fifa.

[r9maradona]

Admit it guys, this series is dead. If you think about it the series has been bad as long as it was good. It's been 6 years now, an entire console era of mediocrity. It's only going to get worse in the coming years as Konami make less and less profit from each game, which means they will get less funding every year to make PES. It's a vicious circle.

So I have bought Fifa and I am really enjoying it so far, the game-play is solid and not frustrating like PES. Playing against the AI offline on Fifa is much more of a challenge that it is on PES, and online is brilliant, unlike on PES which is unplayable online. There is very little lag on Fifa and it has fantastic game-modes like Ultimate Team which is something unique and I am loving so far.

I think it's time for some people to open there minds and objectively compare the games, ignore the 'titles' of PES and Fifa and compare what each game has to offer. After years of playing PES and then suddenly switch to Fifa you realize just how much more there is to offer on Fifa.

The way I see it, the only thing that PES has over Fifa now is the Champions League and Copa Libertodres licenses. But correct me if I'm wrong, Konami's contract with the Champions League ends in 2015. I can see EA outbidding Konami for that licence in 2015, just like they have done already with numerous teams, leagues and stadiums. If I was running EA that would be exactly what I would do, not only would it add yet more features to EA and making their career mode complete, I believe that it would be last nail in the coffin for the PES series. Fifa would then have a monopoly on football games.

But if this happens don't blame EA, because they have ambition and are trying to improve every year, in every facet of gameplay and presentation. Konami have no ambition and are happy to rob their customers, so I say screw them. Unless they make a complete U-turn and make a great game in the coming years I will never buy off them again.

 

[russeribery]

hey man,

just registered to respond your topic..
im playing footballgames since fifa 1998, all the years and every year i bought a new fifa until now. I tried pes several times in the younger ages but no way to quit fifa for pes.
If you are new to fifa you will enjoy it for a long time, so have fun with it.
I just want to give you some words on the way for your trip.

If youre online gamer as i am ( won league title severeal times in fifa ) you will hate the momentum. When ive been younger , i dont know , somehow i didnt noticed it that hard. but since fifa 13 and now 14 ( where its just crazy ) this game can destroy your whole day.

You will feel what it is , first time it is against you. The PES heart system is NOTHING in comparison with Momentum.

Ive bought FIFA 14 this year , played it for 2 weeks. Gone to league 1 in Ultimate team. nearly every match you will get moments that will cause you a near heart death because you will feel with every part of your body how much scripting and unfairnes this game has.
For sure you will have games where it is the other way around where you will feel your opponents bad luck because of the momentum. Therefore you will also have less fun gaming ( you feel how the game makes it hard and easy for you )

There is nearly no game without this.

After this 2 weeks i said to myself its enough and bought pes 14. my first pes since.. i dont now what it was ( maybe on ps2)

In the beginning the gameplay felt very strange. The cursor switch in comparison to fifa is a complete desaster its just slow and feels strange. In fifa you tap the switch button every 2 seconds.
Everything felt strange, shooting, crossing, freekick ( point line WTF ? ) goalies.

Only one thing is great, passing! especially the LB? I switch Controller settings to fifa so it is rt on my controller.
The game build up is just so much better then fifa, you can hold the ball, switch sides , take speed out and look for a good positioned guy. All that you also can do in FIFA, but there is one slightly difference.

It just doesnt feel that good as it feels here in pes.


So try FIFA , maybe you will come back here in the forum one day and tell me im a complete idiot and dont know what im talking about.
But maybe you will come back and tell everyone what things you found under FIFAS surface as i did after playing fifa for 15 years.

I will give you a little example how it works in every EA game ( and many other things they script ).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TClJMeFr94

you will never see it in full speed ( its really brilliant done )


cheers mate,

im now happy with PES and really enjoy it now after about 50 - 60 games

 

[7oy]

As long as there is a hardcore loyal fanbas Pes will live on. What people quickly forget is that 14 is just the beginning of the game on the new engine a engine intended more for next gen than current hence why the consoles are too weak and can't even handle it at times.

Enjoy spending all your money in EA's over glomerised card game and cash cow.

Vive la Pes.

 

[damion]

I think some people are missing the big PES picture here; sure, the new version has it's problems, but potentially (as in next year with polish added) it could be a superb football game (I'm talking about on the pitch which is all that matters to me) that will blow Fifa away.

I'm a long time PES player who has also given most Fifa games a try out and I have to say that even the poorer versions of PES are generally, still, considerably better than any Fifa I've played as I need more than just a license, pretty crowds and good commentary to enjoy a football game.

 

[Ali]

I think some people are missing the big PES picture here; sure, the new version has it's problems, but potentially (as in next year with polish added) it could be a superb football game (I'm talking about on the pitch which is all that matters to me) that will blow Fifa away.

People don't want to pay £40 for a game that can potentially be half decent next season. There is no "big picture". We're not paying for a "big picture". It's not like investing in a TV show that's a bit slow at the beginning, but develops into something amazing once you invest in the characters.

Also, haven't we been saying the same thing for the past 3 years? "Oh, this year has problems, but next year they will iron these out and it will be amazing, the king will be back."..... and then it ends up being worse than the season before?

 

[damion]

People don't want to pay £40 for a game that can potentially be half decent next season. There is no "big picture". We're not paying for a "big picture". It's not like investing in a TV show that's a bit slow at the beginning, but develops into something amazing once you invest in the characters.

Also, haven't we been saying the same thing for the past 3 years? "Oh, this year has problems, but next year they will iron these out and it will be amazing, the king will be back."..... and then it ends up being worse than the season before?

Then if I were those people I'd stop gaming as this is pretty much the industry now, unless ofc you want to play rehash after rehash of games like Fifa and COD, where no work is required apart from a new skin, and yet you still get charged extortionate prices for. You take any game that uses a new engine and you WILL encounter problems, and you WILL be paying for a game that isn't finished yet. It is the nature of the beast, like it or not.

Reality check - I can't believe people honestly believed that this version was going to be the finished, polished version. Rightly or wrongly that was never going to happen and to think so is extremely naive, especially in the current gaming climate where EA hold all the cards and all the money. You can't honestly expect other companies to compete with them (EA) with a quarter of the budget (was it even that?), yet people still want to contribute to this shitty company and shoot down anybody else who is trying to be innovative when they run into problems.

So, you can either contribute to the company and next installment by buying it, or contribute to those uninnovative, shitty rehashes that EA churn out year after year, and that isn't the gaming world I want to live in. What gaming world do you want to live in?

This is the "big picture" you, and many others are failing to see.

Even though I've raged and moaned about this version it still has massive potential, and I've contributed to that massive potential with my wallet, because to see Konami and PES go under, only to be left with that shitty Fifa game would be an absolute travesty, and the end of mine, and many others football gaming.

Also, let's wait and see how Konami patch up this version, though I'm waiting for it with my eyes wide open as should everybody else.

 

[Ali]

[MENTION=167169]damion[/MENTION]

You're very narrow-minded in all this. REALITY CHECK?? Do you mean to say that people are unreasonable in expecting a finished product when they pay £40 for it? I know there can be a few minor niggles here and there, but judging by what people have said, this year is beyond saving. Konami should not have released the game in the state it is in now.
Konami has always had a smaller budget to EA, but they've been able to make amazing PES games in the past. Why can't they do it now? You're making it out like Konami are some little indie games company struggling to make ends meat. They're not. They're a multi-million dollar company, producing AAA titles such as Metal Gear Solid.
I really don't see how they're trying to be "innovative". This is a football game, not much room for innovation.

Imagine if another company released a game in the same state. Say if Naughty Dog release Uncharted 4 with missing lines of dialogue, and missing levels, and don't patch it for months. Would you excuse them for that?

Fifa is not this shitty horrible game that people like you deem it to be. You're treating it as if it's the enemy. It isn't.

I'll give you an analogy. Fifa vs PES is like Man Utd vs Arsenal (let's just excuse the start of this season in this analogy). There is no right or wrong team to support. Utd have the larger fan base, but Arsenal are a very respected side in the game. Man Utd used to be king. Slowly but surely Arsenal came into the picture, and for a few seasons they were a much better side than Utd. But then Arsenal got lazy, and stingy with it's budget. Utd rose above Arsenal and never looked back. Each year Arsenal fans believe they'll improve, but each year they fail.

 

[chimaira67]

it kills me to say it but if you love football you got to get fifa as there is no alternative, pes is failing more and more each year. and although i believe the actual gameplay is the best out there in pes2014, there are to many faults preventing gamers from actually playing
online lag then, or lack of people on servers, or the 11v11 beta where there is never more than 2 people online, or the bad shooting, or the way defenders sprint 3 times faster than a striker with the ball, or the corners where defenders are just taking the ball from the corner spot, or the dreadful goalkeeping, or the even more dreadful player resemblances, or the fact there are no camera options online, or how konami have let the whole community down. the game is good but with so many faults and problems the game is becoming more unplayable by the day.
yes games have faults when first released but as the game came out sept. november is way to long to wait for rectification. so if pes is dead Konami only have themselves to blame

so will be getting next gen fifa 14, something i would not have done if konami had produced the goods.

 

[damion]

[MENTION=167169]damion[/MENTION]

You're very narrow-minded in all this. REALITY CHECK?? Do you mean to say that people are unreasonable in expecting a finished product when they pay £40 for it? I know there can be a few minor niggles here and there, but judging by what people have said, this year is beyond saving. Konami should not have released the game in the state it is in now.
Konami has always had a smaller budget to EA, but they've been able to make amazing PES games in the past. Why can't they do it now? You're making it out like Konami are some little indie games company struggling to make ends meat. They're not. They're a multi-million dollar company, producing AAA titles such as Metal Gear Solid.
I really don't see how they're trying to be "innovative". This is a football game, not much room for innovation.

Imagine if another company released a game in the same state. Say if Naughty Dog release Uncharted 4 with missing lines of dialogue, and missing levels, and don't patch it for months. Would you excuse them for that?

Fifa is not this shitty horrible game that people like you deem it to be. You're treating it as if it's the enemy. It isn't.

I'll give you an analogy. Fifa vs PES is like Man Utd vs Arsenal (let's just excuse the start of this season in this analogy). There is no right or wrong team to support. Utd have the larger fan base, but Arsenal are a very respected side in the game. Man Utd used to be king. Slowly but surely Arsenal came into the picture, and for a few seasons they were a much better side than Utd. But then Arsenal got lazy, and stingy with it's budget. Utd rose above Arsenal and never looked back. Each year Arsenal fans believe they'll improve, but each year they fail.

How can a mostly objective post be narrow minded? Please explain. The only subjective things I've mentioned is my dislike for Fifa and wondering how people can be so naive in the face of cold, hard facts. I'd actually go as far to say your subjective and slightly egotistical follow up post was pretty narrow minded, as you've completely failed to grasp any point I was trying to make.

A) I never said people were unreasonable, I said that's the way it is in gaming, like it or lump it, so people shouldn't be naive. Please don't put words into my mouth.

B) It seems you have completely missed my point about a brand new engine which answers your question as to why they haven't released another good game on a low budget. It also seems you've missed all my points about what happens when dev's create new engines for new games, and that includes EA who release a high amount of fails on a massive budget.

C) I guess you didn't hear about Konami nearly folding and struggling to stay afloat as a company, partly because of the EA juggernaut?

D) Failing to see how how a football game can be innovative, and then claiming Konami aren't trying to be with this new engine is just...I don't even... That is such a silly thing to say it makes me wonder if this isn't just your ego talking.

E) ALL companies release buggy games, especially with a low budget and creating brand a new engine (EA have released there fair share with huge budgets and massive teams, which should put things into a bit more perspective as to what I've been trying to say). Name me a game that hasn't had a patch, after release, in the last five years and I'll show you an unfinished game that has no support and shitty devs.

F) Weather you or me think Fifa is a shitty horrible game is purely subjective, but as I said before: give me a game that isn't a shitty rehash of a five year old game, and one that attempts to be innovative any day. And for the record, a lot of people do feel the same way about Fifa as me, so without contributing to the next installment of PES by paying for this one, then that's what we will be left with. Also, it's EA and people that contribute to shitty rehashes who are the real problem here, not Fifa, unless ofc you're happy with stagnant games, which I'm not and never will be.

F) Again, you have completely missed everything I've been trying to say. This isn't about Fifa vs PES, this is about accepting the reality, getting on board and not allowing innovation to go under because of a juggernaut company who are trying to assimilate everything else so we're not even left with a choice anymore.

 

[r9maradona]

yet people still want to contribute to this shitty company and shoot down anybody else who is trying to be innovative when they run into problems.

So, you can either contribute to the company and next installment by buying it, or contribute to those uninnovative, shitty rehashes that EA churn out year after year

I have to laugh at this, sorry but you are acting like PES has been bad for only 1 or 2 years. When in fact it has been a flawed/broken mediocore game for 6 years and it shows no signs of improving. Why should I waste £40 every year for 6 years + until Konami get it right? 3 years ago when PES 2011 was released people were saying the same things you are now, that PES 2011 was the blueprint that would be improved on in the coming years and in the end Konami would make a great football game by merely fixing the faults with that game. When in reality with every PES that Konami makes, there is as many regressions in the game as there are improvements. Every single year they take stuff out the game that makes it worse, for example this year they took out 20 La Liga stadiums as well as the ability to switch between players effectively when out of possession and manually move a teammate when you are in possession. This is just two examples of the top of my head.

Fifa isn't perfect but the gameplay is good, when playing the AI it is more challening that it is on PES. Somebody above said it is just about scripting, but it's certainly not just because of that, when playing Fifa the opposition will actually try to keep possession against me and make it hard for me to win the ball back. On PES the oppositoin AI is programmed to attack at every opportunity which is unrealistic and easy for experienced gamer to counter. But I prefer to play football games against humans anyway, and Fifa's online shits all over PES's online from a great height. Like I said, there is very little lag and if you don't want to play somebody with a stacked Ultimate Team or Barcelona, then fine, you can set up games so you face mid-range/lower teams any time you want. You can connect with somebody in 20 seconds and have a lag-free game, on PES it takes too long and half the time the game is a lag-fest.

Also the soundtrack on PES sucks, seriously, Konami don't put in any effort.

 

[Anysecondnow]

People don't want to pay £40 for a game that can potentially be half decent next season. There is no "big picture". We're not paying for a "big picture". It's not like investing in a TV show that's a bit slow at the beginning, but develops into something amazing once you invest in the characters.

Also, haven't we been saying the same thing for the past 3 years? "Oh, this year has problems, but next year they will iron these out and it will be amazing, the king will be back."..... and then it ends up being worse than the season before?

Here! Here!

 

[Ali]

[MENTION=167169]damion[/MENTION]

You seem to be defending the indefensible, simply because of your love of PES/Konami.

A) You did suggest that people should just accept that Konami would release a half finished game. Yes, I'm aware that (and this relates to some of your other points too) games need patching and fixing, but that doesn't mean they're unfinished, just broken in places. This year's PES is unfinished. Look at the faces for example (eg Kolo Toure). Ok, so they haven't got his real face in... no biggie. But for crying out loud, they could at least TRY to make him look remotely like his real life counterpart. It's just lazy, plain and simple. Transfers should be updated as soon as the game comes out, or not long after. It shouldn't take weeks/months. Again - lazy. If one patch maker can do it in a matter of days, why can't Konami? Beggars belief.

B) I know it's a new engine... but so what? They've had enough time to work on it. Haven't they been working on this engine for 2 years? A new engine (on to point D now) is not innovative.... it's just a new engine. The gameplay is pretty much the same. Why would it be my ego talking? The only innovative feature in PES games is the Master League, which they've managed to ruin. PES 2012 was bad enough, I struggle to think how bad it must be now.

C) Konami fail to release a decent football game for the past 3 seasons and you blame EA? :unsure:

D) See B.

E) See A

F) It's 'whether', not 'weather' - something else which Konami have failed with this season. Something really basic that should be in any modern sports game.
With regards to innovation again, Fifa has found a winning formula, and innovation with the likes of Clubs mode etc, they're obviously gonna stick to that winning formula. Konami had a winning formula in the past, and completely fucked it up.

G) (You've put F twice, so I'm gonna call this G). I've not missed your point. People won't want to continue getting on board, many will have lost faith with Konami and switched to Fifa. They haven't gone to Fifa because EA have swooped them up with their big juggernaut grasp, they've switched to Fifa because quite simply, Konami have let them down one time too many. Whose fault is that?

 

[damion]

Sometimes it's just like banging my head against a brick wall.

The only thing we will agree on is that Konami released an unfinished game, which doesn't really have much bearing on the point I've been trying to make as that was never in question. Other than that I can see that people are still failing to see the 'big picture' and no amount of common sense or logic will help them see it.

And EA win again.

Oh and Ali, you being facetious doesn't help or get you extra points. I'd expect a little better from a mod.

 

[Ali]

Ladies and gentlemen, I have now seen the light, and I finally get THE BIG PICTURE.

Excuse me while I go out and buy PES 2014 for £40 because PES 2020 will be amazing.

 

[Gato]

Ladies and gentlemen, I have now seen the light, and I finally get THE BIG PICTURE.

Excuse me while I go out and buy PES 2014 for £40 because PES 2020 will be amazing.

Extremely well put!

 

[damion]

From facetiousness to sarcasm, and you know what they say about sarcasm being the lowest form of wit. Having said that, after your last two posts, I expect no less.

 

[Ali]

From facetiousness to sarcasm, and you know what they say about sarcasm being the lowest form of wit. Having said that, after your last two posts, I expect no less.

I think you'll find that sarcasm is the highest form of intelligence. Please proceed with banging your head against the wall, because judging by your last two posts, you clearly need some sense knocking into you.

 

[Gaher911]

Today was my last time playing PES 2014...
I feel a really deep sadness...


I have tried and tried ... But I cannot do it anymore PES will not be even remotely close to FIFA " period "

 

[r9maradona]

Ladies and gentlemen, I have now seen the light, and I finally get THE BIG PICTURE.

Excuse me while I go out and buy PES 2014 for £40 because PES 2020 will be amazing.

:laugh:

PES is like Liverpool. They both used to be great but now they are rather shit, and their fan-base always say that next year is their year.

 

[OCKRASS]

[MENTION=167169]damion[/MENTION]

You seem to be defending the indefensible, simply because of your love of PES/Konami.

A) You did suggest that people should just accept that Konami would release a half finished game. Yes, I'm aware that (and this relates to some of your other points too) games need patching and fixing, but that doesn't mean they're unfinished, just broken in places. This year's PES is unfinished. Look at the faces for example (eg Kolo Toure). Ok, so they haven't got his real face in... no biggie. But for crying out loud, they could at least TRY to make him look remotely like his real life counterpart. It's just lazy, plain and simple. Transfers should be updated as soon as the game comes out, or not long after. It shouldn't take weeks/months. Again - lazy. If one patch maker can do it in a matter of days, why can't Konami? Beggars belief.

B) I know it's a new engine... but so what? They've had enough time to work on it. Haven't they been working on this engine for 2 years? A new engine (on to point D now) is not innovative.... it's just a new engine. The gameplay is pretty much the same. Why would it be my ego talking? The only innovative feature in PES games is the Master League, which they've managed to ruin. PES 2012 was bad enough, I struggle to think how bad it must be now.

C) Konami fail to release a decent football game for the past 3 seasons and you blame EA? :unsure:

D) See B.

E) See A

F) It's 'whether', not 'weather' - something else which Konami have failed with this season. Something really basic that should be in any modern sports game.
With regards to innovation again, Fifa has found a winning formula, and innovation with the likes of Clubs mode etc, they're obviously gonna stick to that winning formula. Konami had a winning formula in the past, and completely fucked it up.

G) (You've put F twice, so I'm gonna call this G). I've not missed your point. People won't want to continue getting on board, many will have lost faith with Konami and switched to Fifa. They haven't gone to Fifa because EA have swooped them up with their big juggernaut grasp, they've switched to Fifa because quite simply, Konami have let them down one time too many. Whose fault is that?

Brilliantly put!

I can definitely relate to this topic because i am a fan of the PES series who has chosen to play Fifa over PES for the past few years.

I agree with you on the lackluster, neglectful and unprofessional way that Konami's development team approaches each year's release of PES.

But there is a reason why PES suffers ......PES is really Konami's second most popular title. Does anyone one know what title is their #1 title...the one that get the most funding?

Well the answer is METAL GEAR SOLID.

So it should come as no surprise to know that the new "Fox Engine" was actually made solely for that title years ago? YEP for MGS....not PES.

So in Konami's search for a new engine for PES they decided to use one that their own team had developed instead of using an outside source. Why spend when we can use an engine from another game...right?

Because the engine was made for a less demanding title animation wise, they have found it is more difficult to code PES onto it. Therefore, they will need 3 years to bring it to next gen. They have decided to bring PES to next gen next year instead of now.

Kojima Productions developed the Fox Engine and is using it as the technology behind two next-generation Metal Gear Solid titles: Metal Gear Solid 5: The Phantom Pain and its prequel, Metal Gear Solid 5: Ground Zeroes. Yet the Fox Engine is making its debut in a game that has nothing to do with cybernetically enhanced super-soldiers, paramilitary corporations or the future of warfare.

Instead, the first game to feature the Fox Engine is a sports title: Pro Evolution Soccer 2014, which launches today on PlayStation 3 and Xbox 360

"It may seem strange that the Fox Engine isn't debuting in a Metal Gear Solid title, or even a game developed by Kojima Productions. But according to Blair, the decision to integrate the technology into the Pro Evolution Soccer series is logical in a couple of ways.

"For us, it makes sense as a business, as a company, to be using assets that we're producing in other franchises," said Blair. The engine had a learning curve for the developers, he added. But now that they have a year of experience with it, they're much better prepared to bring Konami's soccer franchise to next-generation consoles, presumably in 2014."

http://www.polygon.com/2013/9/24/47...-soccer-2014-fox-engine-next-gen-ps4-xbox-one

So PES 2014 was their BETA series .....which they sold.

This also means that we can expect another "work in progress" title next year on next gen. Why not test it on next gen this year and work out the kinks for next year? That would make more sense to me.

They have also said that after 15 years of focusing on the European market....they have switched to the south American market. They have acquired licenses in the Chilean, Argentine and Brazilian markets.
They have also acquired 3 commentators from that region.
Sounds good right? After all, they outsell Fifa in that market. :w00t

Well Fifa ...for the first time....has also acquired licenses in the Argentinian and Brazilian markets this year. hmy:

I am happy with Fifa ...I can see faults and niggles in the game, but none that causes outbursts of rage. I play the game all year round.

russeribery seems not to like Fifa anymore ....but for him to reach Division 1 in Ultimate Team in 2 weeks ....means that he is either:-

1) An awesome Fifa player with master skills, who knows the game really well and have outplayed hundreds of teams ... or

2) Lying ..


peace