My problem with some of the requests is that they're not specific enough for anyone to act on them...or they're asking for things that are already implemented, perhaps in a different way than they're asking.
Maybe Konami could add in what they're asking, but is the request really a "game-changer?" Or would development and testing time be best spent making a real difference to the gameplay, or online code?
Just quoting a few.
Already in PES10. Players stop with sole, bad dribblers/massive deceleration occurs with sole, Torres did a lil sidestep sol dribble on mine the other day
Sounds like a good idea, I think I do this anyway when I play, please be much more specific
I never really play with/against any of these players save Messi @ Barca, but he certainly is a tenacious booger in real life, so think its fair if his feet just wanna keep dribbling. CR9 and Kaka though, I think not.
Cards already incorporate almost everything you asked for e.g. tracking back, tackling ability (and likelihood)
Attack and defense stats incorporate how likely a player is to be up or down a pitch. Can you provide a specific example of a player who can not be described by the current system?
Ok, again you're right, but there is a line between what you as the person controlling wants to do, and what the player (that you're controlling) in real life would do. From my understanding the current system rewards those players who would in real life make awesome runs.
As you dribble with your player in PES, the body shape of the dribble dictates to a decent team-member the run that is expected, just as in real life
What exactly do you mean? I regularly play 20 min each half games, and enjoy them immensely. Please, not knocking you, but for me this is a football simulation, I love football, therefore I don't get bored after 20-30 min.
And I think they are. Have you tried goalkeeping in real life? It's VERY hard. What exactly would you like to see improved?
Euphoria engine would look awesome. Might take longer than a yr to implement though.
With PES you already have like 5 different dribbling speeds per player. Perhaps learn how to use these as opposed to asking for a new mode?
First touch in PES - there's basically 3 options, and could def be improved, but I think itt covers most situations. There's trap without turning, there's begin dribble at moderate speed, and there's push the ball further and attempt to chase it. As in real life, if you're slower/weaker than the defender, only the first 2 are useful unless you play it in the perfect direction.
What do you MEAN by this? You mean you don't like the R3 button? It's not THAT difficult...? What about the 50% of ppl who like how it is? Do you want the added option? Specifics...
Again, specifics! I love the 360 as it is. What do you want to see different? If *you* can't describe it, how is Konami gonna read your mind and please you with the next release?
TBH if I'm tryna score a goal I don't stop and think about how smoothly Torres is running, but a valid request.
And again - don't think it changes the gameplay, but yep, valid
Specifics? I like how it is. What would you change?
Specifics again? Although I do prefer the 09 crossing, haven't perfected 10 yet, but my quick analysis is that better passing stats means better manual crosses. Body angle/shape affects it a LOT as well, which I like as its realistic.
What kind of AI improvements?
Touched on this already - specifics!
If it makes you happy, as valid as any other. Twould actually be nice if:
-you got to save in replays the skill level and situation that a goal was scored (e.g. "Top Player, quarter final replay, went on to 4-2 victory/was the winner")
-And at the end of the match, if you accidently exit to the home screen, all the data for the match disappears - surely this could be saved too!
-You can replay something up until the point that the succeeding throw/goal kick begins. Then the replay magically disappears from the computers memory. Wtf? Surely just implement "replay the last 1 minute" as standard, so if you don't hit start on time, you can still see the replay! Even better, the system of FIFA 09 (PC) where you could replay the WHOLE giddarned MATCH!!
Good point. Current animations/engine shows that strong players (Drogba, Ibrahimovic) rarely properly stumble whereas weak players (Benayoun) get shoved off all the time. Some room for improvement
Fair point, can't say I've noticed but I haven't been looking/hasn't annoyed me yet. Then again you're almost always slower when doing anything but the fastest dribble.
Some very dodgy animations of shooting, especially if attempting certain awkward shots. If you attempt a more normal shot then R2 it, looks decent. Basically if you press R2 late, the player has to do some weird adjustments to carry out your instructions, hence looks ridiculous. Press R2 earlier, not only will you get a better shot, but you won't see the ridiculous animation. The 2 or 3 that still remain...well hopefully Konami will iron them out
So true, then again haven't had a decent keeper who does this...if you bring your keeper out too far they will perform this erroneous nonsense. Use keeper cursor/improve your skill at using through ball button to have keeper run out
Sooooo important. The amount of times I've wanted to just slide to block a pass but the CPU forces my player to do that silly "standing and stick out a knee" animation. Then again its taught me to stay on my feet which is how I play in real life.
Perhaps we need an option for assisted defending on or off
lol posted somewhere on this, perhaps add ref strictness as an option for matches/ML?
User super cancel and make the player do what you want.
Touched on before
Dunno about most out there, but I mean, REALLY? Would you stop playing a footy game because once you score the net expands??!?
Don't play FIFA so can't fully comment, but in PES X does 2 things...it tracks a player closely if held, and if the defender is near a dribbler, it attempts a tackle. Like in real life, the dribbler has to show you the ball (i.e not be shielding it), time it right, and you win it 90% of the time. Like in real life. I'm a defender by trade so maybe it comes instinctively..but that's how you do. Plus in real matches, there's probably only a fair ball winning challenge for every 5-10 passes, so it's unrealistic to expect to tackle every time the opponent touches the ball.
Definitely needs to be improved
True, but hand/mouth thing has little to do with skill as a ref in my mind. Now if you'd been specific, and talked about the advantage rule, and offsides, etc....
I do like how the ref doesn't bully players or block the ball like in old PES though!
Already covered those 2
MASSIVE deficiency in PES. What sensible defending team has a 3 man wall 40 yards from goal? GRRRRRRR!
Use a player with better dribbling
The PES09 penalties were laughable, at least in 10 you get an easily understandable explanation that works. And not every player can hit a perfect penalty, top class strikers still miss as do Penalty kings like Gerrard and Lampard.
Team style settings - play with them
True, but that's good play in real life
Both great points, pet hates of mine. They've got it half right in PES10. A late challenge won't usually stop play. But then the late challenge has no consequence! GRRRRR. Funnily enough in the PES10 demo, they went the other way, which was a touch better: a late challenge was immediately penalised which at least meant the defending team couldn't break up the attack with vicious hacks.
My OTHER main gripe with PES10 is the cancel
A GREAT introduction is holding X to cancel a pass as your player shapes up for it. This has really helped me keep possession when I do that "mind body disconnect" thing and place a pass before thinking about who it's going to.
My problem with it is first time passes.
Occasionally I'll press for a first time pass but the defender will close up the space. If I'm lucky I can use supercancel to move my player and he will "forget" about the 1st time pass, but more often than not, its pot luck.
REALLY annoying if, for example you press pass a cpl times to make a challenge, the ball falls to your CF in acres of space, who then proceeds to play the ball into touch.
OR you make an awesome challenge at the back, stay on your feet, but then boot it out because you pressed shoot or pass at some moment of desperation.
SURELY here it would make so much sense just to allow super cancel or R2 or L3 or SOMETHING to just 'cancel' whatever you were doing, and start over.
THAT, plus the advantage rule (above), and players in the wall (above) and I'll be a grinning 10 y.o. again playing ISS or FIFA 96
Hmmm, perhaps add in cancel for goal keeper's throws/kicks, and freekicks - when you realise your opponent has moved his player in front of who you wanna pass to.
Lastly - offsides. (ties in with the point on referees above)
Either make them respect FIFA's rules to the letter, or allow us to choose between/have different leniences of refs who will allow more benefit of doubt to attackers, etc.
No offense taken, but rest assured -eventually- you will get a proper response.
But for now, I must say that you talk about PES10 like if it was enough of an improvement when it is not; as simple as.
For me it´s fun, but it´s fun as in Dragon Ball Z Tenkaichi fun... it haves more or less the same exact depth that it had since PES5, and everything is so familiar and easily predictable.
PES10 and FIFA10 are not accurate ''simulations'' of the real game -both- are very arcade-like and offer little depth.
I do admit however, that PES10 has some nice touches, for one thing I loved how you can now choose which type of dribbles each individual can use, you can even choose between different types of roulettes, etc, etc.
So that's that... perhaps I was expecting too much. Although truth is, that regardless of my expectations; I simply find PES10 and FIFA10 dull and one-dimensional, more of the same.
The off-the-ball play needs a massive improvement, the old ''pass and tap R2'' gives the game a very arcade-like feel. And the robotic animations, which are truly disappointing and at times painful to watch; only enhance the game's arcade-like approach.
What has happened is simple, it's happening right now all over the world; technology continues to evolve, but our way of thinking remains the same.
Therefore, Konami and EA keep holding on to an outdated concept, they keep adding new graphics, new animations, new game modes -but- they keep the old core gameplay mechanics untouched. Obviously, they are fully aware of the fact that we will buy the games, year after year... So it is a well-rounded business.
Other than that, Pro Evolution 2010 needs to evolve in every possible way:
- Completely new concept for off-the-ball play
- New and more specific stats to further define tactical and technical differences between individuals.
- New and more specific animations to open-up the game.
- New ''Chess-like'' dribbling concept to open-up the game.
- More depth to passing.
I think that in order to evolve or improve properly, Konami needs to set some priorities; a simulation game can only be so realistic. We all know this, although many of us decide to ask only for minor improvements.
But regardless, something that is more obvious than ever, at least in my opinion, is that the off-the-ball concept needs to change. And in a game that is all about Time and Space, off-the-ball movement is essential.
Now the problem that arises when talking about off-the-ball movement is, how to achieve a balance between what we control and what the COM controls.
This is a problem that has affected PES for many years now, because the off-the-ball movement in PES is (understandably) ''automatic''. This is one of the key limiting factors.
Now there are many ways of successfully developing a better and more realistic concept for off-the-ball play.
Out of all the possible ideas, I do not like the idea of manually controlling the off-the-ball movement of any player -BECAUSE- tactical ability is something that I feel should always be respected by any realistic simulation.
For me, the idea of ''manually'' controlling the off-the-ball movement of any player... it sounds very arcade-like, which is something that PES10 clearly doesn't lacks; would be yet another one-dimensional feature.
So what I would do, is develop a system for the ''tactical tendency or approach'' of each individual. Two key factors standout: how he would move in each different situation, and how good he actually is at moving in these situations.
For example, if you have Riquelme on your team, he would have a particular style of moving off-the-ball, that movement-style cannot be switched off, like the cards. We could force Riquelme into covering more of the pitch, but he will still move like Riquelme.
In the same way, Steven Gerrard would never move like Riquelme, because he haves a different set of abilities and his tactical-style is designed to make the best of those abilities.
Therefore such an ''automatic'' system would require new and very specific Stats for tactical ability and tactical approach.
This off-the-ball concept would (in my opinion) be a realistic adaptation, because unlike the current system; it would effectively force each team to function differently, each team would be conditioned by both the tactical approach and tactical ability of their players.
Yes you would tweak with the cards like you currently can, and tweak tactics; but how each individual would automatically decide to move in each situation (and position) and how good that individual is at moving off-the-ball... would be determined by stats/maths.
This automatic off-the-ball concept would be flexible enough to complement with different ''manual'' alternatives; like the old ''pass and tap-R2'' and also with the FIFA-R1 which works without passing.
Like I said a while ago, a simulation can only be so realistic... Therefore because this particular off-the-ball concept would be automatic, it still is one-dimensional.
Therefore in order to truly progress, it would be necessary to have new tactical-controls to complement with the new and more specific tactical-stats.
A player with great tactical ability will move and position automatically, and he will give you more possibilities. On the other hand, a player with poor tactical ability will often give you only one (easy to predict) option.
By the use of some new easy-to-use tactical-controls, we can decide between the different options that the player/com gives us.
For example in a ''one-two'' play, you (in possession of the ball) can decide where you want your team-mate to position himself before receiving the ball. So that if you want your team-mate to receive the ball to your left, the return-pass will go to your right.
So you get to decide such things, instead of the COM randomly deciding things for you.
As a result, it would be necessary to have defensive tactical controls; and this would give way to active midfield (aka tactical) battles, opening-up the game; no longer a straight-forward arcade experience.
Having covered the tactical aspect of the game... it´s only logical to also improve on the technical side of it. The game is 50% tactical and 50% technique.
Example: Riquelme can be "lazy" on the pitch because he haves the technical ability to compensate for whatever flaws he may have off-the-ball.
On the other hand, someone like Steven Gerrard does not have the luxury of being a "lazy" player because he simply does not haves the technical ability required to do so.
Therefore players like Steven Gerrard or Frank Lampard or David beckham have a similar off-the-ball approach... which differs depending on their physical qualities, but pretty much same philosophy in terms of style.
They need to practice a certain distance between themselves and the opponent, they need to think faster, they work harder, they track back; because they don't have the technical ability required to get out of tight situations.
And this conditions how the team functions... For example, Barcelona FC haves Xavi Hernandez, a player who is both a "box to box" midfielder and at the same time a very precise technical player; an exception.
You add Andres Iniesta to the mix, and Barcelona haves a very unique brand of Football; often playing in ridiculously tight spaces.
On the other hand, you look at teams like Liverpool or Chelsea, and their brand of football is very different; vertical and fast.
The tactical and technical abilities determine how the team functions, tactical systems can only make the best out of those abilities.
This is only one straight-forward example out of many: Football is 50% Technical and 50% Tactical.
Therefore if the tactical side of the game improves, it would be fitting and perhaps necessary to also improve on the technical side of it.
The Dribbling/Technical Concept needs to be replaced by one that requires more thinking and more skills from our part. And by ''skills'' I do not mean the arcade-like concept that FIFA still uses to this day.
What I mean by ''skills'' is pretty much; simple controls that differ in function depending on situation or position, simple controls backed by a very deep system.
There would be no automatic trapping of the ball, therefore demanding more skills from our part; thinking and timing skills. How much weight you put on your pass, how you position your player before receiving the pass, and what you do with your first-touch on the ball.
ESSENTIAL things in real-life football: How you position yourself before receiving the pass and what you do with your first-touch -- completely irrelevant in FIFA10, and requiring little to no skill in PES10.
Such a detailed concept would require more Passing dynamics, and certainly more specific Stats for Passing Ability.
Such a dribbling system would also require a considerable variety of first-touch animations, and therefore first-touch controls so that we can consciously decide what to do with our first-touch on the ball; instead of some random concept deciding things for us.
This (in conjunction with the improved tactical play) would open-up the game. Dribbling past a player should be a lot more Chess-like, and a lot less Street-Fighter-like.
Because Chess is quite simple, it´s a play-by-play game... It does not require complicated button combinations, instead, it´s all about compromise, consciously building-up and creating a situation where your opponent is forced into guessing.
When you have good enough substance you don't need over-complicated controls distracting you.
Zidane would be the equivalent of a Queen, on the Football pitch. Whereas on the other hand, someone like Kaka is more of a one-trick pony, like a Rook. These ''simulation'' games need to evolve more on the intellectual side of the game.
So the game needs new things in all areas: new stats, new animations to complement the new and more specific stats, new and improved controls to complement with the new and more specific animations/stats, new off-the-ball concept, etc, etc.
I could be much more specific for you -BUT- in my opinion, the flaws are so obvious and evident that we don't really need to be that specific in the first place.
(impossible 3)