PES 2013 Demo 2: Feedback, Impressions, Discussions etc.
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myzer2005
Registered User
Oh god yeah, that's one thing I have hated most about Fifa games, other than the obvious, the CPU just doesn't like shooting from outside of the box. They try to play like Arsenal and walk it into the goal - Which makes sense if you are playing against Arsenal... But not any other team lol.
This year's Fifa has shown that a few players do like to take a shot from range, but not as much as I would like them to.
This year's Fifa has shown that a few players do like to take a shot from range, but not as much as I would like them to.
tremolo arm
Registered User
Games change, innovations are implemented, improvements take place, but every year there is one constant - the good old PES-FIFA debate flares up in all its glory. Love it.
And it's funny how different people find the same exact feature to be "great" or "game breaking" depending on who it is that plays the games.
A particular game will never be perfect for everyone. Everyone will find something that appeals or irritates. In some cases it is the very same feature that causes contention.
In my opinion both games have improved this year, but PES has improved more than FIFA has. It's difficult to make a parallel comparison, because I find each game to have strengths in different areas and again, that is just a personal opinion.
For example, some people have said that FIFA looks amazing visually. Whilst this may be true compared to FIFA 12, I still believe PES looks much better, in terms of colour representation, shadows and overall crispness. FIFA looks kind of blurry and the colours are well over saturated *hence the arcade feel that some have commented on". For example the grass looks unrelaistic in FIFA compared to PES and this contributes to the opinion of those people who say taht "players float" in FIFA. This is especially evident during penalty shootouts.
However, my opinion is based on a snapshot of the field, not so much on the animation, where I think FIFA has the upper hand in terms of fluidity.
Controls.
FIFA feels more responsive but this level of responsiveness is at the expense of a realistic feel. Granted that it's played with default sliders, it feels almost too easy to zip a pass across the pitch. PES Is more of a struggle, but somehow there is a weight to actions and movement. It may feel a bit cumbersome, but for me personally it feels closer to reality.
Gameplay wise, it's more difficult to draw a parallel. I find that both games have their faults and strengths. FIFA has a tendency to stretch the mifield and cluster the action just outside the penalty area. PES has a more organic / balanced feel, but then again it feels a bit weird changing teh action from wing to wing, something FIFA does better and more realistically IMO.
The one aspect where I feel very strongly though is the sense of achievement, the sense of WOW, the sense of unpredictability and excitement. This is where PES has teh upper hand IMO. I'm not saying that FIFA is weak, but even great chances feel a bit... lukewarm - both to the eye and in terms of control. With PES, I absolutely love the sense of scoring a goal. It's the same sensation I get when I score in real life (a goal that is - no sexual reference here...
Scoring a goal in FIFA is cool, but I don't get any urge to watch the replay.
And I think I have localised part of the reason for this. And it's a very stupid / simple thing, but personally I find it adds a lot to the atmosphere. The goals in FIFA are messed up. They are too small in relation to both stadium and players. They lack any definition in terms of net and post/bar shadows and they just look plain odd. Putting the "cat in the sack" does not feel rewarding somehow and I think some of this is a direct result of what I just described.
Scoring a goal in PES is a visual feast. It just looks and feels beautiful to let rip and see the net bulge. The attention to detail is fantastic.
There are so many aspects of the game to discuss, but for me the above are the most important - what make me come back to a particular game more than another.
If I could design my perfect game it would be a mish mash of features combined from two games, based on:
FIFA - passing, fluidity of movement, player runs, first touch control, tackles
PES - graphics / colours / shadows, sense of weight, excitement of scoring.
And it's funny how different people find the same exact feature to be "great" or "game breaking" depending on who it is that plays the games.
A particular game will never be perfect for everyone. Everyone will find something that appeals or irritates. In some cases it is the very same feature that causes contention.
In my opinion both games have improved this year, but PES has improved more than FIFA has. It's difficult to make a parallel comparison, because I find each game to have strengths in different areas and again, that is just a personal opinion.
For example, some people have said that FIFA looks amazing visually. Whilst this may be true compared to FIFA 12, I still believe PES looks much better, in terms of colour representation, shadows and overall crispness. FIFA looks kind of blurry and the colours are well over saturated *hence the arcade feel that some have commented on". For example the grass looks unrelaistic in FIFA compared to PES and this contributes to the opinion of those people who say taht "players float" in FIFA. This is especially evident during penalty shootouts.
However, my opinion is based on a snapshot of the field, not so much on the animation, where I think FIFA has the upper hand in terms of fluidity.
Controls.
FIFA feels more responsive but this level of responsiveness is at the expense of a realistic feel. Granted that it's played with default sliders, it feels almost too easy to zip a pass across the pitch. PES Is more of a struggle, but somehow there is a weight to actions and movement. It may feel a bit cumbersome, but for me personally it feels closer to reality.
Gameplay wise, it's more difficult to draw a parallel. I find that both games have their faults and strengths. FIFA has a tendency to stretch the mifield and cluster the action just outside the penalty area. PES has a more organic / balanced feel, but then again it feels a bit weird changing teh action from wing to wing, something FIFA does better and more realistically IMO.
The one aspect where I feel very strongly though is the sense of achievement, the sense of WOW, the sense of unpredictability and excitement. This is where PES has teh upper hand IMO. I'm not saying that FIFA is weak, but even great chances feel a bit... lukewarm - both to the eye and in terms of control. With PES, I absolutely love the sense of scoring a goal. It's the same sensation I get when I score in real life (a goal that is - no sexual reference here...
Scoring a goal in FIFA is cool, but I don't get any urge to watch the replay.
And I think I have localised part of the reason for this. And it's a very stupid / simple thing, but personally I find it adds a lot to the atmosphere. The goals in FIFA are messed up. They are too small in relation to both stadium and players. They lack any definition in terms of net and post/bar shadows and they just look plain odd. Putting the "cat in the sack" does not feel rewarding somehow and I think some of this is a direct result of what I just described.
Scoring a goal in PES is a visual feast. It just looks and feels beautiful to let rip and see the net bulge. The attention to detail is fantastic.
There are so many aspects of the game to discuss, but for me the above are the most important - what make me come back to a particular game more than another.
If I could design my perfect game it would be a mish mash of features combined from two games, based on:
FIFA - passing, fluidity of movement, player runs, first touch control, tackles
PES - graphics / colours / shadows, sense of weight, excitement of scoring.
IronCity
Banned
^yeah, Pes demo was vastly improved from 2012, but almost had only one direction to go..up. FIFA seemed to not try and gain that much space from last year but rather refine something.
If I could only buy one it would be a very hard choice because of the trade-offs between the two.
I'm with you, more outside shots by the CPU please. and the shots they do take seem to be obligatory because they are always 15 feet above the bar.
If I could only buy one it would be a very hard choice because of the trade-offs between the two.
I'm with you, more outside shots by the CPU please. and the shots they do take seem to be obligatory because they are always 15 feet above the bar.
Hmmm:naughty: World class ...you did say world class......right?
What ...
hmy:You just said you played it on World class and scored 90% of the time...are you insane?
Maybe you are trying too hard to make Fifa look bad bro.....
Next time get your fictitious stories str8 ....you must realize there is a "paper trail" of what you posted...right? :unsure:
PWNED again :facepalm:
Sup Shaun:argue:
Do you play on consoles or PC ....i find that lot of fans are playing both PES and Fifa on PCs. If you are ...are the games different in terms of packaging and content?
...and least I forget, make sure you list the Positive stuff for Fifa 13 first and put them in Caps with Bold font ...the negatives can be footnotes ...OK? :angry:
Peace
I would love to argue your points but you always make sense and always remain neutral.....where both games are compared.
I have played both demos and I think that they are both good ....the preference really lies with the taste of each individual.
I like the fact that for the first time in many moons...PES has generated some positive feedback. However, the scars on my wallet reminds me to wait until the full release before I even consider purchase.
Fifa on the other hand is my preferred game ....everyone i know along with their parents and kids play Fifa....so I will purchase it. As a matter of fact, EA is offering 24 gold packs for UT13 if the game is preordered.
That alone has me sold.
Peace
harmonyvid35
Registered User
No matter how much grief PES keepers get, I still prefer some of their saving aspects over fifa keepers.
When fifa keepers make a diving save, and get their hands to the ball it's always a save. I don't think I've ever seen the ball go in after they touch (with their hands). Hasn't changed from what I've seen in 13 demo.
I like the fact that even when u see a PES goalie get to the ball, it isn't an auto save. I've had some great moments were keepers can't get enough on the ball to stop it rolling slowly over the line/pushed into the corner, goal line clearances etc. Had a cracker yesterday were Valdes half saved my shot, it rolled so slowly to the line but he was able to turn, dive and grab it.
Can't get these moments on fifa.
myzer2005
Registered User
OCKRASS:
I said I could beat the CPU 4-0 on World Class yes, however I did not say the video I recorded was recorded on World Class... So no you didn't own anything other than the tile of idiot. Learn to read and make sure posts are in context before you try putting other people down for having an opinion of their own.
I don't give two fucks if you like Fifa or Dislike PES... All I care about is playing a game I enjoy and give my own opinions on both demos. I also gave praise to Fifa, however you fail to look for that and only take into account the negatives cause you are so far on EA's cock to notice.
I said I could beat the CPU 4-0 on World Class yes, however I did not say the video I recorded was recorded on World Class... So no you didn't own anything other than the tile of idiot. Learn to read and make sure posts are in context before you try putting other people down for having an opinion of their own.
I don't give two fucks if you like Fifa or Dislike PES... All I care about is playing a game I enjoy and give my own opinions on both demos. I also gave praise to Fifa, however you fail to look for that and only take into account the negatives cause you are so far on EA's cock to notice.
IronCity
Banned
saw something disturbing on the FIFA demo last night. CPU Keeper punched a standing save out to about 6 yards and my entire team started backing up as if they had lost possession versus attacking the loose ball. On top of it, I lost my highlighted player so couldn't automatically move in for the loose ball. Defense had a few extra beats to get to it and no second opportunity for me.
menaceuk
Registered User
So Just played a few games of the PES demo after days of not playing it (Fifa demo) and it is amazing how different the 2 games are.
Took me a few matches to get back in the swing of PES but once I did I still really enjoyed it.
A quck vid from my session....Nothing fancy. Should state this is demo 1 cause demo 2 is still no where on PC:realmad:
I love the Pirlo shot around the 10 seconds mark too
[youtube]Y7-Ecqt_5IY[/youtube]
Took me a few matches to get back in the swing of PES but once I did I still really enjoyed it.
A quck vid from my session....Nothing fancy. Should state this is demo 1 cause demo 2 is still no where on PC:realmad:
I love the Pirlo shot around the 10 seconds mark too
[youtube]Y7-Ecqt_5IY[/youtube]
harmonyvid35
Registered User
Sure this stuff happens on PES as well, if not more, then more blatant. Just the downside of playing against cpu in my opinion.
The selection problem I've noticed myself, but it happens at the other end of the pitch for me, and only a few times (but then again I haven't played the demo to the same extent as the PES ones). Both games suffer badly from this then. To be honest tho, I don't have much time to make a selection as the majority of the goals I've conceded on the demo are from my keeper palming shots directly to the only other attacker in the box for an easy tap-in. That and shots rebounding off the post back to same player for easy tap-in lol. This hasn't changed at all from fifa12
I tend to get much more random occurrences during these parts of play in PES. I personally like that better.
myzer2005
Registered User
Cannon ball
Registered User
Piss poor defending.
Pirlo the Magnificent
:w00t
Great strike.....
But I think the keeper could have saved it easily if he had tried to stop it with his left hand instead of going across with his right...
Would not have happened in Fifa ..
menaceuk
Registered User
:w00t
Great strike.....
But I think the keeper could have saved it easily if he had tried to stop it with his left hand instead of going across with his right...
Would not have happened in Fifa ..
Keeper has 2 players right in front of him
Plus it does happen on fifa cause I scored exactly the same goal with the same player
MysteryMan
Registered User
The things that most annoy me are
-Catch up bug still present
-Restriction of freedom
-Stamina system completely screwed up as AI can run like crazy even in 119th minute
-They added some GK animations but most old ones are present and they simply are horrible, i mean even the player animations are not good but i can live with that, the GK ones are completely horrible tho
- Higher difficulty means super stats for AI instead of super inteligence and tactics.
But other than that, other things are minor and its decent overall.
-Catch up bug still present
-Restriction of freedom
-Stamina system completely screwed up as AI can run like crazy even in 119th minute
-They added some GK animations but most old ones are present and they simply are horrible, i mean even the player animations are not good but i can live with that, the GK ones are completely horrible tho
- Higher difficulty means super stats for AI instead of super inteligence and tactics.
But other than that, other things are minor and its decent overall.
Amateur
Registered User
I have played a bit more of both offerings (PES13 and FIFA13), and just wanted to write what I think about both games.
PES13
Like it's been the case since PES11, you can see material to make a decent game, but unfortunately, as with PES11 and PES12, that decent material is overshadowed by too many massive flaws.
Off the ball movement is particularly inexcusable: static/nonexistent movement by the forwards in the situations that require more lively off the ball movement, yet at the same time the forwards go one step further in fucking the game up, by moving very quickly and positioning themselves in an off-side position, in the situations in which you expect them to move just as slowly as they move 90% of the time.
Due to the off the ball movement being (by all means) incomprehensible, I feel forced into constantly having to use the right analog stick off the ball gimmick: this effectively injects a bit of life into an otherwise life-less system, yet at the end of the day, fails at what really matters, which is actually adding to the enjoyment value of the game.
Player ID? Same old shit with a different cool-sounding name.
If the game actually offered something worthy of the "Player ID" tag, then the "link feints" system, which is very simplistic, would have preset untouchable settings for each star player, with each star player having unique dribbling animations which are triggered by holding the L1 (cursor change) button + directing the right analog stick.
Unfortunately, that is not the case with PES13. For all the "Player ID" bullshit that Konami has talked about, the "link feints" system is the same identical copy-paste for all the players on the pitch, meaning that the "link feints" of Antonio Cassano, will also be the "link feints" of Andrea Pirlo, because the 11 players on the pitch (GK included) all have the same identical "link feints" animations. So much for "Player ID" when Buffon and Pirlo end up doing the same exact things with the ball....
Graphics?
The one area where many people will agree, PES is better than FIFA. That being said, though, is it really all that difficult to beat the bizarre-looking cartoon-like creatures that we must pretend look similar to human beings when we play FIFA13?
Balanced play?
Actually, that is something that PES13 appears to achieve quite successfully, though in my opinion, it fails at the most important thing: the enjoyability factor.
Manual shooting? Manual passing? Dribbling? First touch?
Same old shit, slightly tweaked, but not worthy of any mention, because it fails not only at what it should do, but also at what matters the most: the enjoyability factor.
At the end of the day?
.....PES13 feels dead and linear, it's almost as if the off the ball movement is eight directional, due to how repetitive and linear the off the ball movement patterns are (again, practically forcing you into constantly using the right analog stick off the ball gimmick).
PES13 is the second football simulation (after the mighty PES08), that I cannot take seriously neither as a simulation game nor as an arcade game. Of course, it goes without saying that how much you enjoy the game (or not), is entirely subjective. Though what I think is as good as a fact, is that a football simulation with such a limited off the ball system should not be considered, by any serious gamer, an actual sim game.
As far as I'm concerned, Konami has failed at their own game, the direction of the series is a complete mystery even to them, and this is reflected by the poor quality of their product. I fail to see why PES13 is two years worth of improvements over PES11, in fact, I think that PES11 before the post-release patches (yes with "catch up" bug included) was better than PES13.
My rating: 4 out of 10.
FIFA13
Should I write a long and detailed essay explaining each aspect of the game? Or should I simply say that if you have played FIFA11 and FIFA12, that FIFA13 is simply FIFA12.5?
Same old FIFA really: repetitive passing, shooting, dribbling, etc, etc. But when compared to the complete shambles that PES13 is, FIFA13 actually manages to look like a half decent game.
Though, it needs to be said: the FIFA franchise, at the core, is almost identical to PES; yes, the execution might be very different, but at the core, the D-PAD roots are the same identical game, without anything that resembles a midfield battle, ball moving from end to end as you would expect from a pinball game.
At one end, you might be using your defensive midfielder, and at that precise moment, the computer is fucking up with your defenders, moving them towards absurd positions, so that the striker/opponent can have an easy (and equally obvious) chance at goal. This should not be called "AI cheating" due to the simple fact that it works at both ends of the pitch; however, this is also the reason why FIFA13 is an arcade game, as opposed to the sim game that it's supposed to be.
The cartoon-like faces and colors, remain virtually identical: a disappointment to some (when you consider the vast resources that EA Sports have), but something that the vast majority of fans have come to accept by now, as something that EA Sports will never fix, at least not as far as this gen of consoles is concerned.
Bottom line?
EA Sports knows why people buy their game year after year, they know what they have to do, the direction of their franchise is well defined, as has been reflected by the quality of their product in the past 3 to 5 years.
FIFA13 is not a simulation game, not by a long shot, but it is a good arcade game, it can be taken seriously as the arcade game that it is. At the end of the day, it is a fun arcade game that can entertain for about two to three hours, though unlike great arcade games, FIFA13 lacks the depth to keep you entertained and interested in the long term.
My rating: 6 out of 10.
PES13
Like it's been the case since PES11, you can see material to make a decent game, but unfortunately, as with PES11 and PES12, that decent material is overshadowed by too many massive flaws.
Off the ball movement is particularly inexcusable: static/nonexistent movement by the forwards in the situations that require more lively off the ball movement, yet at the same time the forwards go one step further in fucking the game up, by moving very quickly and positioning themselves in an off-side position, in the situations in which you expect them to move just as slowly as they move 90% of the time.
Due to the off the ball movement being (by all means) incomprehensible, I feel forced into constantly having to use the right analog stick off the ball gimmick: this effectively injects a bit of life into an otherwise life-less system, yet at the end of the day, fails at what really matters, which is actually adding to the enjoyment value of the game.
Player ID? Same old shit with a different cool-sounding name.
If the game actually offered something worthy of the "Player ID" tag, then the "link feints" system, which is very simplistic, would have preset untouchable settings for each star player, with each star player having unique dribbling animations which are triggered by holding the L1 (cursor change) button + directing the right analog stick.
Unfortunately, that is not the case with PES13. For all the "Player ID" bullshit that Konami has talked about, the "link feints" system is the same identical copy-paste for all the players on the pitch, meaning that the "link feints" of Antonio Cassano, will also be the "link feints" of Andrea Pirlo, because the 11 players on the pitch (GK included) all have the same identical "link feints" animations. So much for "Player ID" when Buffon and Pirlo end up doing the same exact things with the ball....
Graphics?
The one area where many people will agree, PES is better than FIFA. That being said, though, is it really all that difficult to beat the bizarre-looking cartoon-like creatures that we must pretend look similar to human beings when we play FIFA13?
Balanced play?
Actually, that is something that PES13 appears to achieve quite successfully, though in my opinion, it fails at the most important thing: the enjoyability factor.
Manual shooting? Manual passing? Dribbling? First touch?
Same old shit, slightly tweaked, but not worthy of any mention, because it fails not only at what it should do, but also at what matters the most: the enjoyability factor.
At the end of the day?
.....PES13 feels dead and linear, it's almost as if the off the ball movement is eight directional, due to how repetitive and linear the off the ball movement patterns are (again, practically forcing you into constantly using the right analog stick off the ball gimmick).
PES13 is the second football simulation (after the mighty PES08), that I cannot take seriously neither as a simulation game nor as an arcade game. Of course, it goes without saying that how much you enjoy the game (or not), is entirely subjective. Though what I think is as good as a fact, is that a football simulation with such a limited off the ball system should not be considered, by any serious gamer, an actual sim game.
As far as I'm concerned, Konami has failed at their own game, the direction of the series is a complete mystery even to them, and this is reflected by the poor quality of their product. I fail to see why PES13 is two years worth of improvements over PES11, in fact, I think that PES11 before the post-release patches (yes with "catch up" bug included) was better than PES13.
My rating: 4 out of 10.
FIFA13
Should I write a long and detailed essay explaining each aspect of the game? Or should I simply say that if you have played FIFA11 and FIFA12, that FIFA13 is simply FIFA12.5?
Same old FIFA really: repetitive passing, shooting, dribbling, etc, etc. But when compared to the complete shambles that PES13 is, FIFA13 actually manages to look like a half decent game.
Though, it needs to be said: the FIFA franchise, at the core, is almost identical to PES; yes, the execution might be very different, but at the core, the D-PAD roots are the same identical game, without anything that resembles a midfield battle, ball moving from end to end as you would expect from a pinball game.
At one end, you might be using your defensive midfielder, and at that precise moment, the computer is fucking up with your defenders, moving them towards absurd positions, so that the striker/opponent can have an easy (and equally obvious) chance at goal. This should not be called "AI cheating" due to the simple fact that it works at both ends of the pitch; however, this is also the reason why FIFA13 is an arcade game, as opposed to the sim game that it's supposed to be.
The cartoon-like faces and colors, remain virtually identical: a disappointment to some (when you consider the vast resources that EA Sports have), but something that the vast majority of fans have come to accept by now, as something that EA Sports will never fix, at least not as far as this gen of consoles is concerned.
Bottom line?
EA Sports knows why people buy their game year after year, they know what they have to do, the direction of their franchise is well defined, as has been reflected by the quality of their product in the past 3 to 5 years.
FIFA13 is not a simulation game, not by a long shot, but it is a good arcade game, it can be taken seriously as the arcade game that it is. At the end of the day, it is a fun arcade game that can entertain for about two to three hours, though unlike great arcade games, FIFA13 lacks the depth to keep you entertained and interested in the long term.
My rating: 6 out of 10.