Do not buy pes 2012

[StirlingBear]

well i am going for PES2012 tomorrow, I had FIFA11 (first footie game on the next gen for me) and after the hype it had I felt a bit disappointed with the game as apart from online which was fun for a bit it still does not come close to PES for me, or PES how I remembered it.

Hopefully i am not too disappointed tomorrow night when i have a game.

 

[abu97]

everyone is on about fifa crappy programming and no tactical planning and how everyone is messi but i played a game on superstar and someone scored a solo and i'll give ya three guesses who it is.
Heskey
Heskey
Heskey
I mean come on, i don't suck at defending as i was using r2 and square and he was doing speed bursts and ronaldo chops and tbh everyone know hesky got no technical ability and even on fifa he plays more to his real lie attributes. I agree in fifa 11 you don't need tactical strategies but on fifa 12 i keep on losing because my teams high defensive line eventhough you gotta admit fifa's tactical management is weak compared to pes eventough they removed some planning from 2011. I once went to my friend 'can you do things like slow build up play or offside traps' and he answers ' you can but know one uses them' So basically fifa is bought for people that aren't arsed to think of strategies and instead they go to the line up and just change some players thats all.

A lot of people question fifa's individuality and if someone asked me the question whoh has better indivduality i'd say pes anyday of my life. However after playing both games, pes's individuality can be ridiculous because A. Every player collides in the same way regardless of balance, B. Every forward or winger thinks they can be messi and start to speed burst regardless of acceleration of anything and C. Speed is bugged- players like bale can't catch up with berbatov but distin can catch up with berbatov.
In fifa players fall to the ground differently, they run differently and fifa actually use the help of inviting real players to copy their faces, running etc.
I mean come on, it's 2012 and pes only have 4 different dribbling styles with hardly any skills or signature moves.
I mean i agree with a lot of you that fifa has come to the point where players can just skill players up with hocus pocuses and do unrealistic stuff but this year tactical defending makes that hard amd i'd rather have a game overrating things like finesse, speed and skill than a team that underrates manuel shotting and skill.

This is my opinion so don't people go on a rant that i never watch football and if i told you the truth, pes 2012 plays like a football game if it didn't have those ridiculous bugs but so far fifa plays better but not tactically

 

[Makavelian]

Bammer you

 

[S-D-P]

The main thing that irritates me about konami is decision making, even if I regard pes gameplay so highly they are an illogical company who make strange decisions. Its not easy deciphering through feedback but this is what they are paid to do, again this effects their decision making.

Who the fuck asked for football life + club boss(copying that shit EA game I think) think of time spent developing this mode when other areas need attention, just an example of konami logic. Long passes have less freedom even with the manual modifier compared to last year, another example of konami changing an aspect of the game that only needed polishing in the animation department. Manual crossing also removed yet through balls are much better, a typical konami practice of improve one aspect and make another thing worse.

Nothing will change how highly I rate pes 2012, but the game should be further ahead than it currently is and the same formula is getting tedious, konami's decision making insults my intelligence.

So that's what annoys me about pes, fundamental gameplay and offline modes may be superb but konami take the piss too much. I sometimes struggle to comprehend the brilliance of pes yet do the same for the utter stupidity of the design choices.

 

[abu97]

pes 2012 has improved from pes 2011! pes 2011 turning was like turning a double-decker bus and remember when cb's were monkeys that ran away from every through ball. Ridiculous - this is not the way football is supposed to be played. konamihave listened to feedback like every attacker is offside or evryone runs away and it is too static and to remove the stutter and catchup bug and they didand those were the things that make 2011 unplayable and the worst pes to date. pes 2012 has imprved slowly and improve like this every year taking out the most annoting things eventhough they do put in more bugs but those bugs aren't gamebreakers or don't make itt unplayable, do they?

 

[S-D-P]

pes 2012 has improved from pes 2011! pes 2011 turning was like turning a double-decker bus and remember when cb's were monkeys that ran away from every through ball. Ridiculous - this is not the way football is supposed to be played. konamihave listened to feedback like every attacker is offside or evryone runs away and it is too static and to remove the stutter and catchup bug and they didand those were the things that make 2011 unplayable and the worst pes to date. pes 2012 has imprved slowly and improve like this every year taking out the most annoting things eventhough they do put in more bugs but those bugs aren't gamebreakers or don't make itt unplayable, do they?

If this is in response to me I didn't mention any of that bullshit you just wrote. And trust me they didnt need feedback to sort out the bugs from pes 2011.

 

[abu97]

it weren't a response - i just looked at the topic name and wrote down what I thought

 

[S-D-P]

it weren't a response - i just looked at the topic name and wrote down what I thought

Sorry mate, was confused thought you were replying to my post about the bell ends at konami:laugh:.

 

[Chri44ophe55]

I bought it and I love it to be honest, this game actually requires skill compared to PES 11, players actually get in decent positions now!! And if you learn how to defend properly you wont have problems with these God like dribblers.

 

[OCKRASS]

The contain function is next to meaningless and the CPU seem to score 102% of their goals from basically having the advantage of being a computer programme and having faster reflexes than you when their attacker is at the corner of the eighteen yard box to magically dart passed your defender (who is always left one on one lol) to get inside you for a cheap goal. Tell me, even if I hold up play with Carragher against Walcott there is no defensive team mate support lol, when do you ever see a speed merchant against a slow coach just constantly being left one on one all game. I suppose you could combat the cheating burst of pace by playing with sliders but then that just feels that you're cheating the CPU.

P I'm telling you, you play PES Top Player or Superstar and then come back to FIFA, it's like you've been training for the Marines and coming back to the Cadets!!

I hope you realize that you have contradicted yourself over and over again.

From the sections that i highlighted it sounds like the "Cadets" are kicking your arse ...and you are not even playing on the highest level.

Give me a break! Your response sounds generic......"Fifa has no soul.."

WTF does that mean anyways? :w00t

EA ...Its in the game

 

[OCKRASS]

Surely you can see that as an offline game for some people fifa is just not worth it, I could mention many areas where its falls behind pes with regards to fundamental gameplay, although I respect fifa as a football game I find it very one dimensional and for me player individuality and AI is still not good enough to keep me playing for more than a week.

Dont know why you seem so desperate for people to feel the same as you, bit sad really.

Sup SDP,

You are one of the 30 to 40 fans that i referred to in my previous post.

I am pretty sure that Fifa's offline game is far superior to the restrictive gameplay of PES. The "some people" that you speak of have their right feel that way but it does not take away from the fact that PES is crap compared to Fifa.

Now PES 2012 is a better game ..but still not good enough. Please do not mention fundamental gameplay since even the fish (Seabass) has admitted to the superiority of Fifa's gameplay over PES.

On the contrary SDP, I am not desperate but instead proud since I have millions who stand behind me on Fifa's status as the #1 footie game on the market today.

I know you feel obligated to defend the PES series ...but you are fighting a losing battle ...son.

peace

 

[abu97]

techboy, incase you haven't heard, they introduced tactical defending and don't even think it's crapper than pes defensive system. Now Carragher can hold up play till he sees another one of his teammates to call and the positioning isn't fully automatic unlike pes. Also there is a stand tackle button in fifa on tactical defending (not legacy defending) unlike pes where the computer chooses when to do your stand tackle, We all know pes is better tactically but that doesn't mean fifa are crap at tactics. I tried experimenting with tactics and it works most of the time but sometimes feels weird.

Also we all know pes is the favourable one for AI unlike fifa's dumb one but in fifa players are running about as ea tries to do what konami accomplished this year at 2009 and players would point where they want the ball played to them but however it failed as players moved in retarded positions so they decided to take that feature know and nearly every fifa gamer i know does 1-2's or one touch passing

 

[ilyasmad]

The flaw of fifa's defending is that, you can't decide what type of tackle you want to input. It does the same stab tackle everytime. The flaw of PES tackling system is exactly what Abu says. Nevermind that, the point being, there will always be alot of flaws for all current and future football games; simply because all the things you can do on a real football pitch, you cant do in the game. For both football games in general due to various limitation(even with vast amounts of budgets and tech), its impossible for one to program certain things, this is why football games will never be simulations.

OCKRASS,
from my assumption, no offense
for you all things that are valued higher from the majority automatically means that, it should be "by fact" no doubt the better product for everyone. For All things in general there will always be a minority that genuinely believes for fact that the product they are supporting is better. People's perspectives are just different.

For me at least, there is still some hope for KONAMI in the future, anything can happen, if they got it right once, they should be able to get it right again.

I am enjoying PES 2012 plus jenkey's patch more than FIFA 12(Damn i wasted money on that, hardly played it), and genuinely believe that it is a better game, and nothing is going to change my opinion of it.

 

[shaun7]

techboy, incase you haven't heard, they introduced tactical defending and don't even think it's crapper than pes defensive system. Now Carragher can hold up play till he sees another one of his teammates to call and the positioning isn't fully automatic unlike pes. Also there is a stand tackle button in fifa on tactical defending (not legacy defending) unlike pes where the computer chooses when to do your stand tackle, We all know pes is better tactically but that doesn't mean fifa are crap at tactics. I tried experimenting with tactics and it works most of the time but sometimes feels weird.

Also we all know pes is the favourable one for AI unlike fifa's dumb one but in fifa players are running about as ea tries to do what konami accomplished this year at 2009 and players would point where they want the ball played to them but however it failed as players moved in retarded positions so they decided to take that feature know and nearly every fifa gamer i know does 1-2's or one touch passing

I have to say this.
Fifa's tactical defending is way more FLAWED than pes 12's new defending system. I never feel in control in fifa 12's defense. Why?
Well there are a couple of reasons.

- AI PRESSURE does not work
- Contain is useless
- sliding tackles are pure s*** as the AI players WILL ALWAYS dribble past it
- standing tackles are a hit and miss. No timing needed and this is the biggest issue.

The AI intercepts every through ball with superman agility. And standing tackles do not work like they should as the AI can easily dribble past your tackle. And there are MANY spots where the player/ attacker becomes untouchable. Note that this can happen to you aswell. The game has these spots where defending NEVER works. Try it from the side, near the keeper, press square and x to feint a shot but do it at a 90 degree angle (EVERY PLAYER CAN DO IT) and you can just keep going straight until you reach that semi circle spot in the keeper's line and YOU WILL NEVER GET TACKLED. The result? A finesse shot in the corner.

Now you see why the defending is flawed in fifa? try it. It works all the time. That's why the AI always play passes to the wingers who then magically become unstoppable when they reach your goal from the sides and then they keep turning until they shoot. Why? Because of these spots where a standing tackle never works.

Seriously it's flawed beyond belief.
If you do not believe me, try it for yourself.

I never said that pes 12's defending is perfect, far from it. The idea was good, but the execution is off, however you have control far, far more than in fifa 12.

In pes standing tackles are manual btw. Press R2 and X to hold up play, release them to position yourself better from time to time, and when he is close, release r2 and hold x. You player does that standing tackle animation.

 

[MozzyEng]

I agree with the above having played it at my nephews house. And to me its no surprise at all. Fair play to ea though for buying all rights to leagues etc, cause this is there big selling point NOT THE GAMEPLAY, AND THEY KNOW IT!. I cannot see Pes ever outselling fifa. Most people who play fifa wont even give pes a go. Well if they want to be bored its upto them. No pes aint the perfect footy game, But at least its there to be counted, Not hid behind a huge marketing screen

 

[OCKRASS]

I have to say this.
Fifa's tactical defending is way more FLAWED than pes 12's new defending system. I never feel in control in fifa 12's defense. Why?
Well there are a couple of reasons.

- AI PRESSURE does not work
- Contain is useless
- sliding tackles are pure s*** as the AI players WILL ALWAYS dribble past it
- standing tackles are a hit and miss. No timing needed and this is the biggest issue.

The AI intercepts every through ball with superman agility. And standing tackles do not work like they should as the AI can easily dribble past your tackle. And there are MANY spots where the player/ attacker becomes untouchable. Note that this can happen to you aswell. The game has these spots where defending NEVER works. Try it from the side, near the keeper, press square and x to feint a shot but do it at a 90 degree angle (EVERY PLAYER CAN DO IT) and you can just keep going straight until you reach that semi circle spot in the keeper's line and YOU WILL NEVER GET TACKLED. The result? A finesse shot in the corner.

Now you see why the defending is flawed in fifa? try it. It works all the time. That's why the AI always play passes to the wingers who then magically become unstoppable when they reach your goal from the sides and then they keep turning until they shoot. Why? Because of these spots where a standing tackle never works.

Seriously it's flawed beyond belief.
If you do not believe me, try it for yourself.

I never said that pes 12's defending is perfect, far from it. The idea was good, but the execution is off, however you have control far, far more than in fifa 12.

In pes standing tackles are manual btw. Press R2 and X to hold up play, release them to position yourself better from time to time, and when he is close, release r2 and hold x. You player does that standing tackle animation.

Sup Shaun7,

I cannot argue that the Fifa12 defense system is harder to grasp this year, but i know it is because they have moved to a more manual defending.

I experienced the same problems at first until i stopped trying to pressure the attackers. Contain only works on some teams that are not vicious in their attack. What I know do is sit back, try and get close to the attacker and push. If not, sit back and let the other players play their roles.

We are guilty of trying to use one player in many different roles. I now also use second pressure a lot more to close down the tricky players like Messi.

Use the second AI pressure player to guide him into your manually controlled player. Just do not run endlessly after every player. Keep changing the second pressure player if needed and never pressure from behind the attacker.

PES looks a bit different this year because it is now gearing towards a Fifa like presentation. Slower shots, smoother animations and trigger runs have all been adapted. The series looks promising but Konami is a bit lazy by not changing the engine of the game that cripples the outdated animations.

peace

 

[shaun7]

Sup Shaun7,

I cannot argue that the Fifa12 defense system is harder to grasp this year, but i know it is because they have moved to a more manual defending.

I experienced the same problems at first until i stopped trying to pressure the attackers. Contain only works on some teams that are not vicious in their attack. What I know do is sit back, try and get close to the attacker and push. If not, sit back and let the other players play their roles.

We are guilty of trying to use one player in many different roles. I now also use second pressure a lot more to close down the tricky players like Messi.

Use the second AI pressure player to guide him into your manually controlled player. Just do not run endlessly after every player. Keep changing the second pressure player if needed and never pressure from behind the attacker.

PES looks a bit different this year because it is now gearing towards a Fifa like presentation. Slower shots, smoother animations and trigger runs have all been adapted. The series looks promising but Konami is a bit lazy by not changing the engine of the game that cripples the outdated animations.

peace

I appreciate the tips However, did you read all my post? I wasn't referring to the actual defending system, but the glitches that it has.

Like the hit and miss standing tackle that are fairly inconsistent and the blind spots where the tackle will never work.

BTW, I always lay back when defending, however the AI players just rush forward and my ai controlled players (not the secondary ai pressure) rush with them sometimes thus leaving out spaces. I try to close down the spaces and what happens? The AI leads me to those spots where tackles are prohibited and he will dribble past me ALWAYS.

Note that no matter how good you are, these glitches will happen and are game breakers because in a football game, I need to feel comfortable defending first and in fifa, this cannot be done.

 

[baangus]

- sliding tackles are pure s*** as the AI players WILL ALWAYS dribble past it

Exactly correct, and one of the biggest issues with the offline game. In typical EA fashion, the devs have programmed the AI to flatout cheat (see jet-packing DBs in Madden) in order to provide gamers with an offline "challenge." In FIFA 12, they programmed the attacking CPU ball carrier to respond to the slightest touch of the User tackle button. The moment that button is touched and activated, CPU ball carriers-- regardless of their ratings or skill level -- instantly turn away from the tackle. Gamers on other sites are rightfully calling it ninja or psychic dribbling. Regardless of the name, EA's cute little programming "trick" has resulted in making slide tackling, or the attempt to slide tackle, entirely useless this year. A broken feature in other words.

 

[OCKRASS]

I appreciate the tips However, did you read all my post? I wasn't referring to the actual defending system, but the glitches that it has.

Like the hit and miss standing tackle that are fairly inconsistent and the blind spots where the tackle will never work.

BTW, I always lay back when defending, however the AI players just rush forward and my ai controlled players (not the secondary ai pressure) rush with them sometimes thus leaving out spaces. I try to close down the spaces and what happens? The AI leads me to those spots where tackles are prohibited and he will dribble past me ALWAYS.

Note that no matter how good you are, these glitches will happen and are game breakers because in a football game, I need to feel comfortable defending first and in fifa, this cannot be done.

Honestly, I have experienced the same inconsistency with the new defending and you are indeed correct about the glitches.

They have somehow pushed us into a manual style of defending but seemingly increased the attack of the stronger teams. I am still struggling to beat Barca on Legendary.

However, this is what I admire about EA...the effort to innovate, the drive to create a better game. Clearly, the current defensive system has its faults and the new collision system stinks ...but they still are still pushing the envelop.....I thought Konami would be the one doing all of this. Engineered for freedom never seem to take well in the last game and then they seem to scrap the whole thing and just ....do little to improve on that aspect.

Fifa is more of a modern flashy sim based footie game, while PES has remained on basic strategies. I wish they would step out a little more and see where the real evolution takes them ...instead of the revolving style they have adapted.

peace

 

[baangus]

Fifa is more of a modern flashy sim based footie game, while PES has remained on basic strategies.

The flashy sim works for me when I can have fun with it and play it without wanting to tear my hair out. Whereas I refuse to buy and play any game (PES) that's glitchy and broken in so many areas, regardless of how strategic it is or has been in the past.