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(*FAO 'Amateur') Why ProEvo2010 is Solid Gaming Gold (*FAO 'Amateur')

MatTheCat

Registered User
May I ask, what has improved in PES10? and is it worth buying?

PES 2010 is far from perfect so I will start with some glaring annoyances in the game.

The goalkeepers in general are just not all to clever but from time to time the goalkeeping AI goes totally awol. Indeed, this often undermines gritty hard fought contests where horribly lame goals that give no satisfaction to anyone can occurr due to faulty goalkeeping AI. I am not talking about cheap parried shots or keepers letting balls go under their legs here, I am talking about keepers quite simply taking off as though they have just seen an ice-cream van somewhere at a crucial moment. These flaws can of course be combatted by the fact that you can take control of your keeper. Indeed, this little (re)addition to the game certainly adds extra excitement and satisfaction elements to the game when you begin to get good at doing this, but only if the game allows you to take control quick enough which leads me to the second major flaw in the game.

Button lag is unnacceptable. Contrary to what the usual Konami arselicking sites (PESfan, WENB) like to promote, it's not 'realism', its not 'waiting for animations to complete', and its not an 'intended part of the game'. Its just damn frustrating but something you will have to learn to work with if you are going to tap into the vast pool of gameplay depth that this game offers.

Other than there are the minor flaws such as the robotic player animations, limited ball control methods, limited methods for passing ball around, horrible collisions system, etc etc. You get the idea, plenty has been written about these things and are presented as the main reasons for PES's suppossed 'inferiority' to FIFA on many review sites.

Before I move on to actually telling you why I love this game and gain a fantastic amount of excitement and enjoyment from it, I should also mention the crowd noises. To sum up Konami's default chants, they are nauseating. In a few words, they are completely fucking headache inducing and make me want to puke all at the same time. 'Poor quality crowd chants' may not seem like a big deal, but I was unable to play PES for more than 20 minutes until I had sorted out and installed a chants pack for it. Since I play on PC, this wasn't a hard thing to do (see: http://www.pesgaming.com/showthread.php?t=73745 ). But if I was a 360 gamer for example, I would be stuck with these bloody awful droney chants that never let up and they would serioulsy damage my enjoyment of the game. Like I said, I couldn't really play PES2010 until I got my chants pack sorted out.

So what is good is about the game you ask and how is it different to PES2009?

Apart from another new lick of paint, on first examination, this game is not a lot different to PES2009. However, when you get playing it a bit, you will realise it is nothing like the last incarnation of ProEvo and for me, that magic lies within the AI which in my opinion is the best balanced AI engine that Konami have ever produced. It is now a lot harder to simply charge down the line or through defenses with all the best players although it is still possible. However, the way the defensive AI has got so much more clever in dealing with this type of exploitative gameplay) means that the cheap goal scoring methods are no longer the most efficient route to goal by an order of several magnitude. Of course, you can still score cynical looking goals but the game no longer rewards the gamer so richly for 'that shitty style' of gameplay. Indeed, if you are needing to get a goal back for a game that is worth a £10 bet, you are probably more likely to get it by setting up a Lampard or Ballack for a 20-25 yard blast or from an early crossed ball (when the radar movement suggests the time is right) than by getting the ball to Messi and simply trying to run through everyone. Whilst, I am sure that given the passage of time all the usual cocksuckers that end up top of PESwankings will have worked out the lamest method of getting a goal sooner or later, for most of us the AI really does encourage us to try 'playing the game' instead of trying to break or exploit the game.

Furthermore, I should add that the sliders system in PES also has a very noticeable impact on how your team plays, moves, defends, and attacks. So I would imagine that when the 'Cut-back Queens' do start to disover PES2010 AI flaws, knowledgeable adjustment of the sliders could well greatly frustrate thier cynical ploys, whatever they may turn out to be. But moving away from playing against the Rob McLeans or Wallaces's (PESwankings top gunners) of this world. The sliders are something that you will overlook at first, but when u get playing the game, and feel that your team needs say more width or perhaps need to tighten up thier act and be more tenacious in the middle of the park, adjustment of those sliders work a treat.

Finally, what makes ProEvo 2010 a cracking game in my eyes is that the game makes me cream my fucking pants on a regular basis! Over the top utterly fucking fantastic goals are a regular occurrence in PES2010 and I for one couldn't give a crap whether this reflects real football or not. I would rather be playing a video soccer game against my bros/mates where half the goals scored are screamers from 25 yards out or bullet diving headers than practically all the goals being scored from dribbling and short passes before shooting from 6 yards out as has been the tradition amongst so called 'great players' of ProEvo in past times. Some people argue that in PES2010, you get far too much space to shoot from long range and it is indeed the case that the game does encourage long range shooting opportunities. It is also true that if you know how to read radar movements, that big long high crosses can be utterly devasting on a regular basis. But combine the opening up of the defensive AI in this respect and combine it with the tightening up of the AI in response to the cynical dribbling cut back bullshit of yesteryear, and you have a game that rewards creative and ambitious gameplay as oppossed to punishing it, whilst bending it over and bearing it's arse to anyone who opts to dribble through the whole team into the same old sweet-spots with Messi and co, PES4 - PES2009 style.

Also I should stress that 'these cracking goals' which I have stated occur regularly in the game, have not the slightest whiff of a 'pre-manufactured' feel to them in the same way that many of the seemingly 'amazing' goals scored in FIFA do. Each of them is very different; each of them makes the gamer think that HE scored it; and for most of them, an intuitive sense of timing (again, unlike in FIFA) is a critical factor between hitting the G-spot or not. At its best, scoring in PES2010 gives big time thrills, whereas scoring in FIFA10 gives mild satisfaction at most.

In short, despite some horrible bugs, PES 2010 is a genius of a game. The biggest thrills come from the games shooting mechanics but this would mean nothing without being built upon a brilliantly well balanced AI system that actually encourages and rewards the gamer for actually 'trying shit out', for a fucking change!
 

Hunter

BELIEVE
I agree. At first glance, with better graphics obviously it looked and slightly felt like PES 2009, but the more you play it, the more you realise that it is so far apart from the few previous PES titles that it's amazing. Konami have finally nailed the gameplay on these current-gen consoles and I for one will be playing PES 2010 all year round this time, especially now that online is virtually lag-free (unless you choose to play people from Italy etc).

I'll talk more in-depth about this later, but it's nice to see a really thoughtful thread discussing it.
 

shaun7

Registered User
Agreed aswell. Good post.
It takes time to get used to but it's a good game and yes it has bugs as you said, but it's a good game.:)
 

CAN7ONA

Registered User
Whilst, I am sure that given the passage of time all the usual cocksuckers that end up top of PESwankings will have worked out the lamest method of getting a goal sooner or later, for most of us the AI really does encourage us to try 'playing the game' instead of trying to break or exploit the game.

^ Sig worthy.
 

clm7

Registered User
good post and while i respect your opinion, i have to agree and disaggre with a couple off things,

the keepers im afraid are atrotious, and yes its good that once again you can control them, it takes 3 buttons? why?

i agree button lag is unacceptable,online especially, the excuses made are nonsense

when you score a great goal you know you've worked for its very worthwhile,

tranfers? wtf?

looks amazing,chants are awfull(thanks for the link)music good, commentating better,penalties brilliant

but for me its still not next gen,

would like to know your opinion for online, i feel its crap,
100 in a lobby,takes ages to get a game,no filter system to filter the madrid/barca noobs, i always have country room now,while i dont get lagg i only get button lagg even more than offline, thers so many possabilitys for online and konami have just ignored them imo
 

iamcanadianeh

Registered User
^ Sig worthy.

Agreed, in fact, having just got the game here in Canada I'll admit I had a tough time with it last night (first playing)... Because I was trying to break the game, not play it.

Truth be told, that might also explain a lot of the low scoring reviews.
 

Winger

Registered User
Also I should stress that 'these cracking goals' which I have stated occur regularly in the game, have not the slightest whiff of a 'pre-manufactured' feel to them in the same way that many of the seemingly 'amazing' goals scored in FIFA do. Each of them is very different; each of them makes the gamer think that HE scored it; and for most of them, an intuitive sense of timing (again, unlike in FIFA) is a critical factor between hitting the G-spot or not. At its best, scoring in PES2010 gives big time thrills, whereas scoring in FIFA10 gives mild satisfaction at most.

I should first state on what level of difficulty I play both games. PES: Top Player. FIFA: World Class with a Semi-Assisted Control Scheme.

You must be fucking brilliant at FIFA. I find it rare enough to actually score a goal, nevermind score an absolutely brilliant goal, which makes it all the more satisfying when I do manage to see the net ripple, especially if it's a well worked goal. In PES I found the goals to come more frequently, and more easily, which soon diminishes any unique feel.

You first of all state that "these cracking goals" happen regularly in PES, yet they don't have the slightest whiff of a "pre-manufactured" feel to them, as such goals do in FIFA. That's a paradox if there ever was. In PES you can score from a cross almost at will, with the same two finishes, with the same two annimations, on darting bullet headers and diving headers. Or you can change it up to the other preset "feel free to score" option of a long range drive. How the fuck is there nothing "pre-manufactured" about either of these avenues. And how can either remain unique and different just because the header may go to the left of the keeper, or the long range drive my curl a shade more than the previous effort, when it is so damn easy to get the efforts off in the first place.

And I don't know how you can claim scoring a goal in PES leaves the gamer feeling as if he scored it, while in FIFA there is no such intuitive sense of timing required. Get your timing wrong in FIFA and you're going no where, even in the most easy of scenarious. Get your timing wrong in PES, even in the most difficult of scenarious, and you'll eventually stumble over the finishing line.

If you're refering to FIFA on a difficulty below World Class, and on an Assisted Control Scheme, then you're basically talking about a different game. EA have parcelled FIFA with two different parrallels, one for those who like the pick up and play experience with a lot of great goals; ie, PES, which is available via an easier difficulty with an assisted control scheme. And then there is the parrellel that is closer to a simulation, a tougher test with more skill required, which comes on a higher difficulty with a semi-assisted (or a manual) control scheme.

I'm not here so much knock PES 2010. I think it's a good game, good, not great. I just think FIFA is better this year. And some of the criticisms being put against FIFA just aren't true.
 

MatTheCat

Registered User
I should first state on what level of difficulty I play both games. PES: Top Player. FIFA: World Class with a Semi-Assisted Control Scheme.

I am playing FIFA on World Class with everything assisted except long passes which are semi-assisted. It is all very well stating that the game totally changes if you opt to go fully manual, but if you do, then you have no chance against people who are playing with the main things (passing and shooting) on assisted.

Don't argue this point please. Most of my mates are knuts about FIFA and NOBODY plays with assisted shooting, at all, for a very good reason.

The rest of the arguement is immaterial in my opinion as well. FIFA's AI chucks 1-1 situations into the fray as though they were going out of fashion. And as you should know if you are anywhere as good as you say you are, a 1-1 situation (yes, with assited shooting) is a goal everytime providing you have half an iota of ability at the game and shoot using 'special shot' or 'lobbed shot'. As soon as I discovered that, the game was binned cos that aint even a game, its a damn farce!

The final thing I will say about the super-new methods of scoring in PES2010, is that although it is easier than ever before to score long range screamers and pull off lighting bolt diving headers, there is no sure and set forumla for success with these types of efforts. This is very unlike the 'cut-back' for example or any of the various other similarly cynical methods of exploiting PES's AI that have bogged down previous versions of the game since PES4. Even if the chances of success from say a long range screamer was as high as 50/50 (I have found it to be knowwhere even near as high as this although this may change as I learn to play the game more), this is a huge improvement from the 90% success rate that the Cut-Back-Queens could expect once they had managed to dribble the ball into the same old sweet spots.

Like I said, combining the new found 'strengths' of the defensive AI with its newfound 'weaknesses', and you have a game that encourages you to deploy flair and ambition other than keep your cards totally close to your chest until the 100% dead cert opportunity crops up.

If u dont like it, go play online FIFA with your shooting set to 'unassisted' and miss all your 1-1 chances whilst some n00b on assisted shooting bury's you about 10-0.
 

steveomilan

Registered User
my copy of pes2010 is on ebay as we speak- i cant get used to the way they players move after playing fifa 10 and the passing is too fast

i am a massive pes fan but if you try and turn in a circle the players turn wierdly
 

profit89

Registered User
This game is brilliant, I agree with the Original Poster. I only care about playing offline/multiplayer anyway, and the game is fully enjoyable when it's played with mates. It's brilliant.

But I'm hugely disappointed that in offline cup/league modes they prohibit a mate from controlling a cpu opponent. That's utter rubbish.

Let us play the way we want Konami. And stop taking out features that appeared eons ago on the PS2 version.
 

muzza798

Registered User
This game is pretty much unsellable imo. Online is addictive no matter what the circumstances. You win and you want to win more, you loose and you want revenge. I can never end this game on a defeat even if i have to play for another hour.

ML is addictive and unlocking the national teams for classic players is actually kinda fun and gives me somin extra to do even though ill have to do it 8 times or w/e. Currently bashing one out with Holland and doing ok. Barely made it past Russia but with cuntalaar up top getting goals is a distant hope more than a expectation.

This game has finnaly got an all round package. Offline you have ML, cups and uncomprehsively good mutiplayer with friends, BAL and then there's online. Each mode could carry this game on its own but all 4 in 1 game? Bloody hell, even COD MW2 may suffer from the uncureable 'pes addiction'.
 
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