Just for fun: Views on konami's thinking behind next gen ideas?

[Amateur]

Well if anyone cared to take an interest it's an infinitely more possible scenario than them "not caring" as so many seem to see it.

It is a more possible scenario, but at the same time much worst. Because they cannot even afford the improvements that need to be done.

If they indeed don't have the money, I think they should stop whatever they are doing before taking another hit again. Their reputation has had enough, if they simply do not have the ca$h.. maybe it's better for them to stop fighting a lost cause.

Maybe they had the money to make great PS2 games, but they just cannot afford to develop proper Next Gen Games. Which is very credible in my opinion, but just doesn't makes much sense.

 

[MachineHead]

Well if anyone cared to take an interest it's an infinitely more possible scenario than them "not caring" as so many seem to see it.

Surely it's not about the money. If the game has gone worse instead of better, it's about lack of vision, not caring or being stupid. Konami can't be THAT poor.

 

[iamcanadianeh]

I agree that money, and the size of the dev team is a major factor which needs to be considered when making blanket statements like "Seabass is Lazy." Seabass is a game developer, and I doubt that if anyone spent a week with him that they would be able to still suggest something like that (and I've heard it suggested many times on this forum).

There are a few other things which people don't tend to think about:

1.) Making a football game is difficult. It might be one of the most difficult genres to design. Compare this task to a first person shooter, or an RPG, for example.

2.) The move to next gen may not be as easy as many of us think. Yes, they were trying to keep the core of the game, but a lot of things that have disappeared from PS2 to PS3 may have disappeared because of the amount of work that was needed to put into bringing the game onto the next gen consoles. Moreover, it's not that these things were removed from the game, just that they were not added when they game was redesigned for the next gen (because other things were higher priority to work on). Seabass has admitted that his group still develops like they are working on SNES, and it is clear that they are trying to step up to the next level without destroying the core of what their fans want - PES 6 gameplay. But, again, I'm sure that's easier said than done.

3.) No game is perfect and people complain about almost every game that there is - Fifa, NHL, FPSs, etc, etc.

My personal opinion is that the Konami group are going to continue to grow, and that even if certain aspects of the game remain with one foot in the past, that it is probably for the best. The last thing I want to see is a new version which is so far removed from the heart of what PES is, that it's not recognizeable as PES.

Also - I think the fact that they have revolutionized the entire sports gaming industry with the invention of BAL/Fantasista should give people a clue to the fact that Konami still have what's most important - innovation.

 

[S-D-P]

i just want to see changes to the gameplay, i couldn't give a shit about BAL, or online play, if this happens i might be tempted back from fifa but there is a lot of catching up to do in terms of the gameplay, i think konami can pull it back over the next few years.

 

[MachineHead]

2.) The move to next gen may not be as easy as many of us think. Yes, they were trying to keep the core of the game, but a lot of things that have disappeared from PS2 to PS3 may have disappeared because of the amount of work that was needed to put into bringing the game onto the next gen consoles. Moreover, it's not that these things were removed from the game, just that they were not added when they game was redesigned for the next gen (because other things were higher priority to work on). Seabass has admitted that his group still develops like they are working on SNES, and it is clear that they are trying to step up to the next level without destroying the core of what their fans want - PES 6 gameplay. But, again, I'm sure that's easier said than done.

3.) No game is perfect and people complain about almost every game that there is - Fifa, NHL, FPSs, etc, etc.

2.) Is a good point, and admittedly I haven't thought about it much. The solution could be passing a year, but that might just make FIFA stronger.

3.) What about if people didn't complain at all? We wouldn't see much advance in the gaming industry.

 

[byondthought]

The fact is, I don't think any of you understand how much money Konami actually have.

It's fairly well documented around those that care they are a very very small company (in comparison) and do not have high funding at all. It's actually refreshing to see a relatively small games company, even more so a small branch of a small company surviving and winning the battle against EA. (Note: that's my opinion I will not turn this into a FIFA Vs PES debate)

In a few years I can completely see EA buying out and dissolving Konami as they have done with a thousand other small companies, ruining them in the same swoop. Then you guys will have nothing to moan about, after all there'll be no comparison.

they make enough profit each year to re-invest into the next, they dropped the ball with bad managment.. they thought they didnt need to spend more money on development... god how much did they pay messi for that ridiculous advert and marketing or liverpool and man utd for the name rights and shit...!!! trust me they have enough money to put into pes they just choose not to, its bad managment not poor little konami..!!!

 

[CaptainCabinet]

they make enough profit each year to re-invest into the next, they dropped the ball with bad managment.. they thought they didnt need to spend more money on development... god how much did they pay messi for that ridiculous advert and marketing or liverpool and man utd for the name rights and shit...!!! trust me they have enough money to put into pes they just choose not to, its bad managment not poor little konami..!!!

Your name sums you up well.

 

[jenicek68]

I feel, that PES 2008 was so bad, that I stayed with PES 6.. But PES 09 was big step forward and definitely in right direction.. Dont forget that PES 6 was for PS2 technology.. During that PS2 period they been trying to cut out engine as much as they can so they can put more staff in to it, but also keep it graphicaly at least same as their precedor.. But PES 6 came on Xbox 360, and it was really good version.. I felt it had few bugs, but generaly it was PES and it was nextgen too.. Than PES 2008.. Firstly, when i was running for that game to Gameshop in Swansea I was so excited.. Then i put it in the drive.. First Vid was cool and i felt it is going to be allright, then Menu and I felt there is something wrong about it.. Then my first match and I knew that it is whole disaster.. I felt, that they should rather wait till 2009 and they really should.. I feel that engine right know is capable graphs, which can fifa dream about.. You can see, that everything is sharp and running smooth.. It is gameplay which need to be improved, and so far if i look on my letter, there are not many issues, but they are really affecting whole result.. Guys, now look.. Graphics have really improved, animation is not best.. But if one team will spend on it whole season, then result will be most stunning. I feel that PES is right now teenager and next season it will become young adult.. They got engine to shoock whole comunity again, just they have to work on gameplay and animation..

 

[S-D-P]

I feel, that PES 2008 was so bad, that I stayed with PES 6.. But PES 09 was big step forward and definitely in right direction.. Dont forget that PES 6 was for PS2 technology.. During that PS2 period they been trying to cut out engine as much as they can so they can put more staff in to it, but also keep it graphicaly at least same as their precedor.. But PES 6 came on Xbox 360, and it was really good version.. I felt it had few bugs, but generaly it was PES and it was nextgen too.. Than PES 2008.. Firstly, when i was running for that game to Gameshop in Swansea I was so excited.. Then i put it in the drive.. First Vid was cool and i felt it is going to be allright, then Menu and I felt there is something wrong about it.. Then my first match and I knew that it is whole disaster.. I felt, that they should rather wait till 2009 and they really should.. I feel that engine right know is capable graphs, which can fifa dream about.. You can see, that everything is sharp and running smooth.. It is gameplay which need to be improved, and so far if i look on my letter, there are not many issues, but they are really affecting whole result.. Guys, now look.. Graphics have really improved, animation is not best.. But if one team will spend on it whole season, then result will be most stunning. I feel that PES is right now teenager and next season it will become young adult.. They got engine to shoock whole comunity again, just they have to work on gameplay and animation..

it is going in the right direction but after a while pes 2009 to me personally feels very similar to pes 2008. next year needs to be much better than the past three games put together.

 

[byondthought]

Your name sums you up well.

so does yours..!

 

[iamcanadianeh]

2.) Is a good point, and admittedly I haven't thought about it much. The solution could be passing a year, but that might just make FIFA stronger.

3.) What about if people didn't complain at all? We wouldn't see much advance in the gaming industry.

2.) I meant for 2007 and 2008. They definitely should be caught up now that it's 2009.

3.) Agreed. Complaining is unavoidable - that's is my point. The grass isn't that much greener elsewhere, and complaining is always easier than actually doing the work involved yourself. It really is staggering when you think about how many people and how much time must be involved with developing a game like this every year, and then we have all these totally ungrateful people who do nothing but insult the developers - but do any of use really know what it's like to develop a video game? I should probably shut up now, since I'm contradicting myself, but my point is that we should be making positive well thought out suggestions, and take the faults of the game with a grain of salt. Simply insulting the developers is ill-informed and isn't going to get us anywhere as a community.

 

[Amateur]

2.) I meant for 2007 and 2008. They definitely should be caught up now that it's 2009.

3.) Agreed. Complaining is unavoidable - that's is my point. The grass isn't that much greener elsewhere, and complaining is always easier than actually doing the work involved yourself. It really is staggering when you think about how many people and how much time must be involved with developing a game like this every year, and then we have all these totally ungrateful people who do nothing but insult the developers - but do any of use really know what it's like to develop a video game? I should probably shut up now, since I'm contradicting myself, but my point is that we should be making positive well thought out suggestions, and take the faults of the game with a grain of salt. Simply insulting the developers is ill-informed and isn't going to get us anywhere as a community.

Completely agree about that.. moaning endlessly won't help anyone, as well as it is boring. As a community we should do better. Give well thought suggestions, so that if Konami develops another disappointing title, we did our part.. there would be no excuses.

That said, those "complainers" are the same people who buy their games. They have every right to criticize the product.

 

[STEVE67]

The fact is, I don't think any of you understand how much money Konami actually have.

It's fairly well documented around those that care they are a very very small company (in comparison) and do not have high funding at all. It's actually refreshing to see a relatively small games company, even more so a small branch of a small company surviving and winning the battle against EA. (Note: that's my opinion I will not turn this into a FIFA Vs PES debate)

In a few years I can completely see EA buying out and dissolving Konami as they have done with a thousand other small companies, ruining them in the same swoop. Then you guys will have nothing to moan about, after all there'll be no comparison.

Which is the whole point of this thread...as to try to understand why Konami havent just tweaked the gameplay from PES 6 instead of trying to make big changes (which would have been at less cost to them) and end up nearly breaking what was a fantastic game. To be honest i think most PES fans would have loved the game as much if Konami had just improved the graphics from PS2 and give us better camera options instead of adding new modes like BAL and champions league which is no better than the mode already in master league.

 

[Amateur]

Which is the whole point of this thread...as to try to understand why Konami havent just tweaked the gameplay from PES 6 instead of trying to make big changes (which would have been at less cost to them) and end up nearly breaking what was a fantastic game. To be honest i think most PES fans would have loved the game as much if Konami had just improved the graphics from PS2 and give us better camera options instead of adding new modes like BAL and champions league which is no better than the mode already in master league.

There's no doubt that most of us would've liked it.. but the same gameplay isn't going to work forever, people grow out of it, and after they do they'll start asking for something better. Which is completely natural.

Konami has failed to deliver anything better. They could just tweak PES6 and so on. But this is year 2009 you know, so a mere "tweak" on PES6 would not do the trick. They had to make big positive changes instead of big negative changes.

Hopefully they'll get the message with the drop in sales and PES 2010 will be the next PES5.

 

[2GunsUp]

stop moaning 2009 is a cracking game gd work from konami they should make the master league a bit interresting its easily gets boring and more editing options please

 

[dan80]

well we dont want to moan about the game but we need to say something or konami will jsut to nothing they are surpost to be making a better game than fifa but like the thread constructive critzism i think thats good its say what should change in sted of calling sebass a ****** and the letter to konami with proper ansewrs to what we want

 

[Amateur]

stop moaning 2009 is a cracking game gd work from konami they should make the master league a bit interresting its easily gets boring and more editing options please

Just wondering, is this why PES09 was the first version of the series to take a serious hit in sales?? Just wondering, considering it's such a "cracking" game.

Konami must love fans like you, you'd be willing to pay yet another $50 for PES9 with updated kits and some very subtle tweaks.

Don't you understand?? They are using Next Gen Consoles now.. So Why are they making worst games instead of better ones??

 

[byondthought]

Just wondering, is this why PES09 was the first version of the series to take a serious hit in sales?? Just wondering, considering it's such a "cracking" game.

Konami must love fans like you, you'd be willing to pay yet another $50 for PES9 with updated kits and some very subtle tweaks.

Don't you understand?? They are using Next Gen Consoles now.. So Why are they making worst games instead of better ones??

mmm, but some people have less needs and expectations..!!

 

[Amateur]

mmm, but some people have less needs and expectations..!!

Yeah, that's why all of us get a crappy game!!

Maybe it's fitting for me to change PES for FIFA.. at least FIFA is progressing.

 

[2GunsUp]

some peolple expectations just can't be met for example i want to see a licensed premierleague won't happen will it ? but why din't they have license for la liga this time ? the gameplay is good i just wish maybe they good add the german bundesliga to it and remove the dutch league and keep their top teams