Pes 2011 worst game in years

[Amateur]

Hi, again another ridiculous post! Basically you don’t get this game at all. The problem is you, not the game and your analogies are laughable! You haven’t understood how this game works tactically at all. Just moaned about not being an instant expert with it!
The only thing we agree on that PES 2010 was a good game with loads of depth under the general broken and on rails movement!

You need to stop bitchin, get off your high horse of your gaming ability and vision for a game being prefect which it isn’t its just lob sided in terms of tactics! Tactics are highly important and is a factor as big as animations etc.. in terms of football games! Bt this game gets them right. BIG time! It’s surprising a step up from PES 2010 which was great in terms of this but 2011 moves then on.

The systems are basically the same, just there’s depth and you need to re understand them again. They aren’t much different to PES 2010, just organized different and with the added team management it’s the most tactical game you can buy.

Seriously if you thnk PES 2010 is better than PES 2011 in terms of being a sim? A tactical game and a good one I enjoyed indeed but when I can sprint past the whole Germany team with Martin Petrov with ease and score without any trouble and it’s more stuck on rails than a express train. Well your talking out of your arse!

Nah, not really.

Before uttering sheer stupidity, taking your opinion for a fact, pretending that you understand my argument when you clearly don't, uttering the word "debate" when you don't know shit about debating; that sort of thing.

I know what I'm talking about; you clearly have no idea about what you are talking about, starting with the fact that you don't actually understand the difference between facts and opinions.

Consider this the first and the last time I waste my time on you.

For the game truly to be put in the "simulation" category, you have to exclusively focus on the BAL aspect of the game. When you play the whole team, the simulation part is already gone out the window. Because last I checked, football teams don't operate with a hive mind. For example, old submarine sims where you control every station on the boat, is not actually a simulation. Later sims where you order the AI to perform different tasks aboard the boat on the other hand, is a simulation. The PES series is not really a simulation series, and as far as I know, never claimed to be a simulation. It is a football game, and the difference between a sim and a game is usually different perspectives on importance of realism. If you look at the difference between GP4 and F1 2010 where one game claim to be a simulator and the other a game, it is quite easy to understand the difference.

BAL on the other hand can rightfully be called a football career simulator, although not a very detailed one.

So unless someone find an official commercial where konami claims that the PES franchise is a simulation, your demands for more realism should be changed to pleas for more realism.

New Star Soccer and Trequartista are football sims, where you play one player and have to approach the game as if it's you against the world, making your career until you retire, much like BAL mode in PES.

Yeah, but here is where I disagree with you.

Konami said, in more than one occasion, that PES11 was aimed at the "hardcore" fans who switched to FIFA: why did the "hardcore" fans moved to FIFA? Because according to the "hardcore" fans, FIFA was more "simulation" like, and PES was too "arcade".

So when Konmai said that PES11 was aimed at the "hardcore" fans, it almost sounded like they were saying that PES11 would be more "sim" like and less arcade.

In addition, when Konami admitted that all PES game to date had been mere extensions of the Famicom era, Konami claimed that PES11 would be different; but guess what? PES11 is yet another extension of the Famicom era.

*SHOCKING*

My argument is a fairly simple and realistic one: the video game can and should be better....

This is what it all boils down to: even when cheating or scripted play is not as obscene, when you play against friends, the game is even more boring.

I don't care about AI cheating, because it has always been an essential part of the game, for as long as I can remember; and more importantly, it will never actually make the game more enjoyable, at least not for me, because it does not actually changes how it plays.

How is a better GK and a better referee, supposed to make the game significantly better?

Does it changes how you dribble? How you tackle? Does it actually affects the core areas of the game? Making a dumb game more difficult than it should be, will not guarantee a more enjoyable experience.

In other words, how enjoyable a video game is, has little to do with difficulty and a lot to do with the concept: is the concept good enough? If you don't enjoy the game when playing at amateur difficulty, chances are that you will not enjoy the game when playing at expert difficulty.

FIFA11 is fun for a laugh, nothing more, just for a laugh with friends; but if you want a serious game with some substance and replay value, FIFA11 is a failure in this respect.

The dribbling system that FIFA11 uses is the same one that PES11 and PES5 use: the ball carrier is always RUNNING, you cannot hide your intentions because your intentions are always materializing before your very eyes.

In other words, you can cover/run spaces of over 50 feet of distance by simply directing the left analogue stick without the assistance of a running/sprint button: you should know how this affects the usage of the left analogue stick.... and how the usage of the left analogue stick affects all the areas of the game.

FIFA11 has better animations, better feel, but it revolves around the same automatic concept; which means that the defensive system and attacking system, and passing angles, all the areas of the game revolve around a restrictive and outdated dribbling and man-marking system: the dribbling and man-marking system is the heartbeat of the game, it determines all the areas or dimensions of the game.

I can measure a pass, I can measure a shot.... yet I cannot measure a tackle? I cannot measure dribbling?

Sums up the game.

Oh and, how can I forget the simply brilliant defensive system; a defensive system where the left analogue stick literally determines the direction in which you run.... effectively neglecting the most essential aspect of football.

If by pressing the "pressure" button, the player whom is closest to the ball carrier automatically starts running after the ball carrier.... Then why the fuck do I even need the left analogue stick just to run around like a fucking headless chicken?

We have a very simple and straightforward dilemma: either we use the left analogue stick for RUNNING around like a headless chicken, or, we use the left analogue stick for MAN-MARKING purposes.

The dilemma is fairly simple: the left analogue stick cannot handle both RUNNING and MAN-MARKING, or RUNNING and DRIBBLING.... which is why you cannot measure your tackles, and why you cannot measure your dribbling, and why it is possible to run without the assistance of a running button.

REAL LIFE FOOTBALL: where defensive reactions and defensive positioning ARE determined by the movement and position of the ball -- because human beings can only react to what they can see with their two eyes.

PES/FIFA FAMICOM FOOTBALL: where defensive reactions and defensive positioning ARE determined by an analogue stick -- the movement and position of the ball entirely redundant because "build up play" is not actually necessary, due to more than one reason, one of them being the fact that a super-human on the pitch will always have the ability of reacting in accordance to what he can see with his twenty eyes.

With PES11 and FIFA11, build up play is not necessary nor even possible, in reality only a mere illusion: when defending or when not in possession, the sprint button and left analogue stick directions are NOT affected by the movement and position of the ball.... neglecting the most essential aspect of real life football.

If you do not need to predict WHERE and WHEN the ball carrier will pass the ball, because in fact, the sprint button and left analogue stick directions are not actually affected by WHERE and WHEN the ball carrier passes the ball: you cannot play anything remotely close to football... because the circumstances are not determined by the movement and position of the ball, instead, the circumstances are pre-determined or "scripted" regardless of where the ball might be.

Passing the ball in many different directions, is not that big a deal, when the COM has full control over the dots or targets at which you are aiming your passes: the COM dictates the circumstances, and the USER reacts to the circumstances.

This is what PES is all about: it has always been about reacting to COM dictated circumstances, it has never revolved around the idea of USER dictated circumstances.

When you play against your friends, the COM drifts from one side to the other, shifting the momentum of play from side to side; when you play against the COM on the most difficult level, the COM drifts to one side for most of the time, favors one side over the other, thus making it more challenging, albeit more scripted.

So, again, back to the simple argument: if by pressing the "pressure" button, the player whom is closest to the ball carrier automatically runs after the ball carrier....

This means that the left analogue stick is not affecting the direction in which the mentioned individual is running, which also means that the position of the ball determines the defensive movement or defensive reaction of the individual, which begs the question: why the fuck do I even need the left analogue stick just to run around like a fucking headless chicken?

It fools a lot of people, but at the end of the day, is it too easy to hold possession? Yes.

Because the left analogue stick is one button, and yet we have ten individuals on the pitch; so reacting like a singular headless chicken whilst your opponent ping pongs the ball around....

A scripted and automatic procedure, and even broken, because you cannot prevent it from happening time and time again: scripted and automatic when playing against the COM and when playing against your friends.

The defensive system is stupid, and the new passing system transformed a defensive concept that has always been dumb, into an even dumber concept.

PES and FIFA do not work like CHESS, where you have STATS that do not actually function automatically because it actually requires skills from the user; CHESS being a game where both players have the same identical team, a game where the outcome is decided by how the players create and dictate the circumstances.

When you play PES11 and FIFA11, the circumstances are already pre-determined or "scripted" for you, as dictated by the COM: which beats the purpose of playing football, and would certainly make chess a pointless COM dictated game.

Yet Konami and EA Sports continue going down the ISS, PES5, PES6, FIFA09, PES11, FAMICOM road: stupid AI is not the problem, stupid AI was never the problem.... the problem has always been fairly simple.... stupid concept.

 

[metsuri69]

I can only admire the dedication of sminky pinky when it comes to dissing the game, even I feel exhausted by the amount of work you put in to it. Well as long as you're having a good time it matters huh?

Then to Amateur's post, I really feel you're passionate about making the game better in overall but to be honest I don't quite understand all your points, or at least don't understand what you are suggesting should be done to the game.. But let's try to communicate?

the COM dictates the circumstances, and the USER reacts to the circumstances. This one I understand a bit, indeed it's not like you can "put the AI into it's knees" with pure wits and tactics. It's more like you might be able to exploit it's gaps somehow.. Though the AI might be able to humiliate you, as you pointed out. And especially your defence in PES 2011.. And this seems to piss off lots of players. I myself though have been mostly happy and felt really good seeing my defence ripped apart by a few smart passes..
Thought: FINALLY they do it. The PES "Invincibles" years might be over.. In 2010, keeping clean sheets was a walk in the park.

If by pressing the "pressure" button, the player whom is closest to the ball carrier automatically starts running after the ball carrier.... Then why the fuck do I even need the left analogue stick just to run around like a fucking headless chicken? The cursing makes this statement powerful.. still I don't quite understand it. As at least personally I don't press pressure button all that much, only when in decent position and trying to "knock the ball" out of the attackers feet.. Pressing it in wrong times only cause you to fail. Which is great imo. Otherwise it's much about positioning and backing off I think.. so yes definitely left analogue stick plays a much bigger part than pressure-button. Also don't forget R2button on man marking.. How do you suggest the defending should be implemented to controlling your player?

About measuring your dribbling, I agree that maybe could be given a thought about left analogue working as analogue when it comes to dribbling speed (press less, run slower), but I don't know how this really would work in game in the end.. Might be a bit too complicated for player to fine tune his left analogue touch to control your player speed.

Indeed in PES2010 left analogue stick was pushed too far imo, as tricks and dribbling came from same stick. I think it was a good implemention by Konami to get right analogue stick to help with tricks.

Let's make one last thing straight: I agree there are glitches in the game! I agree and I'm angry that Konami keeps breaking toys that were working on last version. There's definitely so much bugs in the game that it makes me wonder did they ever Beta-test the game at all..

Still I'm not into negativity as much as I'm into "work with it".. I'm still having fun with the game, and trying my best to make it as enjoyable as possible by learning how to play PES2011 and so work around as many it's problems as possible.
I'm NOT trying to bend the game to my will, to work as I'd want, as haha a game cannot be reasoned with.
Some of you should just accept the fact that PES2011 is indeed a GAME. Not a football simulator in all it's matters!
And all the games you can learn to beat, if it doesn't seem like fun to learn to beat it. It's smarter just to quit playing.

 

[klashman]

Nah, not really.

Before uttering sheer stupidity, taking your opinion for a fact, pretending that you understand my argument when you clearly don't, uttering the word "debate" when you don't know shit about debating; that sort of thing.

I know what I'm talking about; you clearly have no idea about what you are talking about, starting with the fact that you don't actually understand the difference between facts and opinions.

Consider this the first and the last time I waste my time on you.






Yeah, but here is where I disagree with you.

Konami said, in more than one occasion, that PES11 was aimed at the "hardcore" fans who switched to FIFA: why did the "hardcore" fans moved to FIFA? Because according to the "hardcore" fans, FIFA was more "simulation" like, and PES was too "arcade".

So when Konmai said that PES11 was aimed at the "hardcore" fans, it almost sounded like they were saying that PES11 would be more "sim" like and less arcade.

In addition, when Konami admitted that all PES game to date had been mere extensions of the Famicom era, Konami claimed that PES11 would be different; but guess what? PES11 is yet another extension of the Famicom era.

*SHOCKING*

My argument is a fairly simple and realistic one: the video game can and should be better....

This is what it all boils down to: even when cheating or scripted play is not as obscene, when you play against friends, the game is even more boring.

I don't care about AI cheating, because it has always been an essential part of the game, for as long as I can remember; and more importantly, it will never actually make the game more enjoyable, at least not for me, because it does not actually changes how it plays.

How is a better GK and a better referee, supposed to make the game significantly better?

Does it changes how you dribble? How you tackle? Does it actually affects the core areas of the game? Making a dumb game more difficult than it should be, will not guarantee a more enjoyable experience.

In other words, how enjoyable a video game is, has little to do with difficulty and a lot to do with the concept: is the concept good enough? If you don't enjoy the game when playing at amateur difficulty, chances are that you will not enjoy the game when playing at expert difficulty.

FIFA11 is fun for a laugh, nothing more, just for a laugh with friends; but if you want a serious game with some substance and replay value, FIFA11 is a failure in this respect.

The dribbling system that FIFA11 uses is the same one that PES11 and PES5 use: the ball carrier is always RUNNING, you cannot hide your intentions because your intentions are always materializing before your very eyes.

In other words, you can cover/run spaces of over 50 feet of distance by simply directing the left analogue stick without the assistance of a running/sprint button: you should know how this affects the usage of the left analogue stick.... and how the usage of the left analogue stick affects all the areas of the game.

FIFA11 has better animations, better feel, but it revolves around the same automatic concept; which means that the defensive system and attacking system, and passing angles, all the areas of the game revolve around a restrictive and outdated dribbling and man-marking system: the dribbling and man-marking system is the heartbeat of the game, it determines all the areas or dimensions of the game.

I can measure a pass, I can measure a shot.... yet I cannot measure a tackle? I cannot measure dribbling?

Sums up the game.

Oh and, how can I forget the simply brilliant defensive system; a defensive system where the left analogue stick literally determines the direction in which you run.... effectively neglecting the most essential aspect of football.

If by pressing the "pressure" button, the player whom is closest to the ball carrier automatically starts running after the ball carrier.... Then why the fuck do I even need the left analogue stick just to run around like a fucking headless chicken?

We have a very simple and straightforward dilemma: either we use the left analogue stick for RUNNING around like a headless chicken, or, we use the left analogue stick for MAN-MARKING purposes.

The dilemma is fairly simple: the left analogue stick cannot handle both RUNNING and MAN-MARKING, or RUNNING and DRIBBLING.... which is why you cannot measure your tackles, and why you cannot measure your dribbling, and why it is possible to run without the assistance of a running button.

REAL LIFE FOOTBALL: where defensive reactions and defensive positioning ARE determined by the movement and position of the ball -- because human beings can only react to what they can see with their two eyes.

PES/FIFA FAMICOM FOOTBALL: where defensive reactions and defensive positioning ARE determined by an analogue stick -- the movement and position of the ball entirely redundant because "build up play" is not actually necessary, due to more than one reason, one of them being the fact that a super-human on the pitch will always have the ability of reacting in accordance to what he can see with his twenty eyes.

With PES11 and FIFA11, build up play is not necessary nor even possible, in reality only a mere illusion: when defending or when not in possession, the sprint button and left analogue stick directions are NOT affected by the movement and position of the ball.... neglecting the most essential aspect of real life football.

If you do not need to predict WHERE and WHEN the ball carrier will pass the ball, because in fact, the sprint button and left analogue stick directions are not actually affected by WHERE and WHEN the ball carrier passes the ball: you cannot play anything remotely close to football... because the circumstances are not determined by the movement and position of the ball, instead, the circumstances are pre-determined or "scripted" regardless of where the ball might be.

Passing the ball in many different directions, is not that big a deal, when the COM has full control over the dots or targets at which you are aiming your passes: the COM dictates the circumstances, and the USER reacts to the circumstances.

This is what PES is all about: it has always been about reacting to COM dictated circumstances, it has never revolved around the idea of USER dictated circumstances.

When you play against your friends, the COM drifts from one side to the other, shifting the momentum of play from side to side; when you play against the COM on the most difficult level, the COM drifts to one side for most of the time, favors one side over the other, thus making it more challenging, albeit more scripted.

So, again, back to the simple argument: if by pressing the "pressure" button, the player whom is closest to the ball carrier automatically runs after the ball carrier....

This means that the left analogue stick is not affecting the direction in which the mentioned individual is running, which also means that the position of the ball determines the defensive movement or defensive reaction of the individual, which begs the question: why the fuck do I even need the left analogue stick just to run around like a fucking headless chicken?

It fools a lot of people, but at the end of the day, is it too easy to hold possession? Yes.

Because the left analogue stick is one button, and yet we have ten individuals on the pitch; so reacting like a singular headless chicken whilst your opponent ping pongs the ball around....

A scripted and automatic procedure, and even broken, because you cannot prevent it from happening time and time again: scripted and automatic when playing against the COM and when playing against your friends.

The defensive system is stupid, and the new passing system transformed a defensive concept that has always been dumb, into an even dumber concept.

PES and FIFA do not work like CHESS, where you have STATS that do not actually function automatically because it actually requires skills from the user; CHESS being a game where both players have the same identical team, a game where the outcome is decided by how the players create and dictate the circumstances.

When you play PES11 and FIFA11, the circumstances are already pre-determined or "scripted" for you, as dictated by the COM: which beats the purpose of playing football, and would certainly make chess a pointless COM dictated game.

Yet Konami and EA Sports continue going down the ISS, PES5, PES6, FIFA09, PES11, FAMICOM road: stupid AI is not the problem, stupid AI was never the problem.... the problem has always been fairly simple.... stupid concept.

I'm actually surprised a read all that, but again, another Bizarre post!

It took you what? 23 lines to actually get tot he point about PES 2011, I'm sorry but this isn't a FIFA forum. I didn't mention FIFA so why bring it up? i've discussed that game tot he death and I'm just bored of that game and totally disillusioned with it!

So when i got the the point this is what i've seen:

REAL LIFE FOOTBALL: where defensive reactions and defensive positioning ARE determined by the movement and position of the ball -- because human beings can only react to what they can see with their two eyes.

PES/FIFA FAMICOM FOOTBALL: where defensive reactions and defensive positioning ARE determined by an analogue stick -- the movement and position of the ball entirely redundant because "build up play" is not actually necessary, due to more than one reason, one of them being the fact that a super-human on the pitch will always have the ability of reacting in accordance to what he can see with his twenty eyes.

Well done for stating the obvious, also well done for not only stating the obvious but going into great detail in stating it, do you want cookie?

Not just that, what is this rubbish bout PES 2011 not having build up play. What you need to do is actually show us some sort of video of how you play since I'm convinced your infact just pissed your not a master of PES 2011. No Football game is impossible to master. I mean it's not hard really to destroy the AI on PES 2011 but it's so alive, and the stats vary the game so much the AI will always throw something up at you!

metsuri69 look at it from this way. this post i quoted from Amateur is basically hammering PES 2011 for not being a absolute 100% perfect simulation of football! To why he's hammering the game? Because again, like i said he's struggling with it and instead of trying to understand the game (which isn't really that hard) He's taking the 'Let's moan and bitch' way out

It's the 'lack of build up' point which i find just ridiculous!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9rBpmt5pRsk

Not just that that strange stuff about the game being highly scripted on two player mode?

Look at the difference in terms of goals between the video above and the one below!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJMOechIYGc

 

[BigP_Hellas]

Oh please, what a painfully Feeble retort. How old are you? 15?

Engage the dormant matter residing in your skull and read my previous comment properly before typing nonsensical shite.

Its like reasoning with a child but I will make the point again -

If you DON'T like the contents of THIS thread, DON'T bother POSTING in it!

I love this thread! Sminky, you've managed to show me how lack of sex can translate into aggressive online behavior! You need to get out of your moms basement and get laid, buddy!

 

[sweetmusicman]

P.S. Brother take it from someone who are just as bad if not worst then you when it comes to Pes 2011. I suggest you take some more time with the game. Try new formations like I do, even tho I have to admit with little success.


I am still struggling to score goals in Pes 2011. If the ball is not ballooning like a rugby ball then it lobs, without my intention when pressing shoot.

Any ideas on how to be more successful guys? Sorry to have highjacked the original thread, but I did not deem to start a new thread for this.

 

[DIECI]

Guess you haven't played PES 2008 then

Play?? That game wasn't evan playable, I dont cosider it part of the PEs family of games, it was a complete joke!

 

[DIECI]

why do people find the need to attack eachother when discussing a video game? LOL
Lets agree that everyone is entitled to their opinion, if someone loves the game great enjoy it to the fullest, if others dont well thats their right as well. For me, I fall somewhere in the middle, there are things I like about the game and there are things I dislike. I still play it and enjoy it, but do I enjoy it as much as past PES games? NO, Do I think its the best PES game ever? No.... To me its a good game but Konami needs to make it deeper and improve some key aspects in PES2012. And YES I think PES2010 had better gameplay, it was more of a challenge and more tactical.

With PES2011 It all feels the same, every team you pick not much variations, In PES2010 there was less balance between teams, fast player wer indeed fast, not like now that every defender slow or fast will catch up with any attacker even Messi, that my friends is not realistic.... sorry its not. Maybe it helps peeps that have no clue on how to play defense and evens the playing field but I much prefer to have to think and cut off these fast players and prevent them from running wild on me rather than knowing the CPU will cheat and help me. And YES you could contain the Messis and Ronaldos in PES2010, you could stop the cut back goals and you could play defense and completely shut down Barcelona, Real Madrid and other super teams with lesser teams IF YOU KNEW WHAT YOU WERE DOING.... Now in 2001 you could all play with very high defensive lines because no matter what, your defender WILL CATCH the attacker before he could get a clear shot on goal. This is why I feel PES2010 was better. When I say PES2011 is shallow and 2010 was deeper when it comes to tactics i mean IN GAMEPLAY mainly, formations mattered last year, fast players mattered, good defenders mattered. When you played against Barca and you picked a small team like Palermo you would need to change up your tactics, worry about Messi and beware of their quick counters, now in 2011 that all dissapeared, you really don't need to adjust anything, just pick up the game and play with default formations. Konami did implement a very nice passing system, YES its great I agree, I love the way it gives you options to pass to any player on the pitch without much limitations, I like the bumping animation and the way you tackle players off the ball and believe it or not I like the ball physics, its good once you get used to it. Player movement is a bit odd though, at times when your player receives a pass he doesn't run quickly right away, it takes a few strides to get going which helps the defenders close in and take your space away, is this a glitch or deliberately placed in there by Konami to add realism? well it doesnt add realism just frustration. Does anyone know what im talking about with this?? How do you control this? is it in how your player gets the ball???

 

[Sminky]

:lol: Guess i was right. People, don't listen to this guy! Konami, PLEASE don't listen to this guy! He can't take having a debate about football games when someone questions him! He just runs away and acts like a child !

He shoots! He misses! Thats ten wasted posts by you newbie. You're an incredible hypocrite having read your posts. I admire the bare faced cheek of it though, you're clearly on here looking to wind me up. I'm not biting on that hook anymore. Go reel in another sucker.

Sminky Pinky, its very easy to sit behind a monitor and be a tough guy online and insult people like your the smartest guy in the world. You do realize that you wouldn't survive one minute in my world ?! I'd love to see kids like you face to face. Youd get knocked the fuck out faster than Messi's sprint on PES10.

I am done arguing with you and wont participate in your childish pussy fights. I get what your saying. PES11 sucks nobody should buy it or play it. Maybe its because of lamers like you that Konami screwed up PES08/09. I hope to god Konami don't listen to people like you. I might not be the greatest PES player out there but I do know what a good game is and how a game should be judged.

So guys please I beg you ignore this kid I can tell he likes the attention that he hardly gets inreal life it seems like.

DIECI, you must be smoking crack bro if you think PES11 has the worst tactical system. Its funny how people forget the past. PES08-09 was the worst PES in every single football aspect. PES1 is def. not.

(laughing) Ridiculous. Quite what any of that has got to do with PES is beyond me. Let me remind you how this started. It started with you posting provocative comments against people like me because I don't like PES2011. Thank you and good night.

I love this thread! Sminky, you've managed to show me how lack of sex can translate into aggressive online behavior! You need to get out of your moms basement and get laid, buddy!

Mate its called wit and sarcasm and I can't believe I have to explain that to you ... although I did laugh when I read your comment. I appreciate the dig ... maybe I am getting too uptight!

 

[Sminky]

I can only admire the dedication of sminky pinky when it comes to dissing the game, even I feel exhausted by the amount of work you put in to it. Well as long as you're having a good time it matters huh?

Then to Amateur's post, I really feel you're passionate about making the game better in overall but to be honest I don't quite understand all your points, or at least don't understand what you are suggesting should be done to the game.. But let's try to communicate?

the COM dictates the circumstances, and the USER reacts to the circumstances. This one I understand a bit, indeed it's not like you can "put the AI into it's knees" with pure wits and tactics. It's more like you might be able to exploit it's gaps somehow.. Though the AI might be able to humiliate you, as you pointed out. And especially your defence in PES 2011.. And this seems to piss off lots of players. I myself though have been mostly happy and felt really good seeing my defence ripped apart by a few smart passes..
Thought: FINALLY they do it. The PES "Invincibles" years might be over.. In 2010, keeping clean sheets was a walk in the park.

If by pressing the "pressure" button, the player whom is closest to the ball carrier automatically starts running after the ball carrier.... Then why the fuck do I even need the left analogue stick just to run around like a fucking headless chicken? The cursing makes this statement powerful.. still I don't quite understand it. As at least personally I don't press pressure button all that much, only when in decent position and trying to "knock the ball" out of the attackers feet.. Pressing it in wrong times only cause you to fail. Which is great imo. Otherwise it's much about positioning and backing off I think.. so yes definitely left analogue stick plays a much bigger part than pressure-button. Also don't forget R2button on man marking.. How do you suggest the defending should be implemented to controlling your player?

About measuring your dribbling, I agree that maybe could be given a thought about left analogue working as analogue when it comes to dribbling speed (press less, run slower), but I don't know how this really would work in game in the end.. Might be a bit too complicated for player to fine tune his left analogue touch to control your player speed.

Indeed in PES2010 left analogue stick was pushed too far imo, as tricks and dribbling came from same stick. I think it was a good implemention by Konami to get right analogue stick to help with tricks.

Let's make one last thing straight: I agree there are glitches in the game! I agree and I'm angry that Konami keeps breaking toys that were working on last version. There's definitely so much bugs in the game that it makes me wonder did they ever Beta-test the game at all..

Still I'm not into negativity as much as I'm into "work with it".. I'm still having fun with the game, and trying my best to make it as enjoyable as possible by learning how to play PES2011 and so work around as many it's problems as possible.
I'm NOT trying to bend the game to my will, to work as I'd want, as haha a game cannot be reasoned with.
Some of you should just accept the fact that PES2011 is indeed a GAME. Not a football simulator in all it's matters!
And all the games you can learn to beat, if it doesn't seem like fun to learn to beat it. It's smarter just to quit playing.

Mate, you've made an old man smile! I guess I have been giving it some about PES2011 but its only because I love the PES series so much but I get pelters from all angles for daring to question PES2011.

Fortunately for me my use of the english language is far more expansive so Its quite amusing seeing the fanboys steaming into an argument with me - Usually because they can't stand negative comments about PES - and resorting to threatening behaviour when they can't intimidate me.

Still I'm happy to get on my soapbox about PES when I've paid £40 for it, I mean theres nothing better than a good whinge!

 

[BigP_Hellas]

Yea buddy just loosen up. But the penalties eh? wtf is that?!? They need to change that shit!

 

[Sminky]

Yea buddy just loosen up. But the penalties eh? wtf is that?!? They need to change that shit!

I'm English mate, I can't loosen up even if I wanted to

The penalties are so stupid, I've read people scoring down the middle everytime just like with PES2008. I don't know why Konami fiddled with the penalties but they have to change the camera angle back and give control back to the player.

 

[superpav]

i think its better then last years. Im finding the game hard though. i cant seem to score a lot of goals which is good. I think people pick fifa because they wana beat everyone 5 0. fifa just to easy.

Im having trouble gettin used to the analog stick as i always play on dpad

 

[Sminky]

i think its better then last years. Im finding the game hard though. i cant seem to score a lot of goals which is good. I think people pick fifa because they wana beat everyone 5 0. fifa just to easy.

Im having trouble gettin used to the analog stick as i always play on dpad

Passing is best thing about PES2011 unquestionably but the switching between pressure and jostling is a bit fiddly (in my opinion).

Still maybe I missed a trick not using the MLO but I've always played PES for the ML because it was always the best bit about it. I'm staying positive that PES2012 ML top player AI will be better.

 

[superpav]

yea pes11 aint perfect but def better then fifa. fifa you score goals and it dont always feel like its you. like its cp assited.

also i must say the pes soundtrack this year is the best. i love the song passion pit the reeling

 

[BigP_Hellas]

I'm English mate, I can't loosen up even if I wanted to

The penalties are so stupid, I've read people scoring down the middle everytime just like with PES2008. I don't know why Konami fiddled with the penalties but they have to change the camera angle back and give control back to the player.

I'm pretty sure they can do it an update.. but will they?... doubtful.

 

[MysteryMan]

why do people find the need to attack eachother when discussing a video game? LOL
Lets agree that everyone is entitled to their opinion, if someone loves the game great enjoy it to the fullest, if others dont well thats their right as well.

I just don't get why so many people ignore basic flaws in the game and pretend it doesn't matter and the game is great because we have "manual" passing now and some more features..

There are some things that are just plain annoying and can't exist in a modern football simulation , one of those is switching of players where sometimes the computer switches it completely wrong and because of that you basically gift your opponent a 1 on 1 chance..

Or defenders catching up to you like their acceleration and top speed is 99 both , I mean sure if a defender is fairly fast it would be understandable to catch u if you don't run far away , but if you get a great trough ball from your playmaker and have a big advantage there is no way a slow defender is going to catch say Messi , thats just ridicilous to assume thats good.

Things like that are very wrong and I can't accept that some people don't admit them as being nothing less than that, and calling pes a great game.

 

[superpav]

like i said its far from perfect. Why is it so hard to get a really good football game on the next gen console. i gave up playin ps3 as the game was broken.

i didnt mind pro09 in terms of gameplay but everyone seems to hate that one

 

[e5197]

I felt compelled to join the forum just to tell you all what has just happened in a ML match. Ive read that the game could be scripted and in a way i do agree as ive lost 3 games in ML already due to me not being able to defend against the CPUs through balls no matter how quick i try to select a different player anyway...

So im playing inter , Im AC Milan and struggling in the league , already lost 2 times which i never done in a whole season of ML on the 2010 Pes. I manage to go up 1-0 through T. Silva so im thinking to myself , hey this is a bit of a surprise(inter are the runaway leaders on ML)
Then i manage to get what i thought was a 2nd goal through Robinho. Next i hear the commentator say 'no its offside' cue a cutscene of Milito (inter striker) running toward the linesman to complain (strange being that it was my striker robinho who scored) when play resumes im awarded a free-kick in my own half with the score still being 1-0 to me!

The goal should have stood robinho took a shot which hit the post and came back to him and he scored the rebound,so def no offside! and what about milito complaining to the ref and me being rewarding a freekick in my own half!!

Now i know the CPU doesn't want me to win but thats ridiculous!

Has anyone else seen anything like this happen to them??

 

[Sminky]

I felt compelled to join the forum just to tell you all what has just happened in a ML match. Ive read that the game could be scripted and in a way i do agree as ive lost 3 games in ML already due to me not being able to defend against the CPUs through balls no matter how quick i try to select a different player anyway...

So im playing inter , Im AC Milan and struggling in the league , already lost 2 times which i never done in a whole season of ML on the 2010 Pes. I manage to go up 1-0 through T. Silva so im thinking to myself , hey this is a bit of a surprise(inter are the runaway leaders on ML)
Then i manage to get what i thought was a 2nd goal through Robinho. Next i hear the commentator say 'no its offside' cue a cutscene of Milito (inter striker) running toward the linesman to complain (strange being that it was my striker robinho who scored) when play resumes im awarded a free-kick in my own half with the score still being 1-0 to me!

The goal should have stood robinho took a shot which hit the post and came back to him and he scored the rebound,so def no offside! and what about milito complaining to the ref and me being rewarding a freekick in my own half!!

Now i know the CPU doesn't want me to win but thats ridiculous!

Has anyone else seen anything like this happen to them??

I've never had that happen, that sounds quite random! I've had some outrageous off side decisions go against me, I'm not too annoyed though as thats pretty realistic, but I do object to players like Jose Enrique having a range of passing at Top Player comparable to Andrea Pirlo.

Speaking of which, I tested this with one of my own players and started playing through balls from the centre circle! Granted not all worked but on several occasions I managed to play a through ball that went through/past 7 opposition players. Thats pretty mental - I was using Dean Whitehead!

 

[xaar81]

wow this caused a fuss its just my opinion,and with all the so called hard core pes fans ive been playing this game years since iss and bought nearly everyone except 08(got given it for free and gave it back).maybe its just me i find the new game very slow and laboured,passing is slow and not accurate, the buttons react very slow not instant,defenders are fasters than forwards wtf is with that,konami should redesign the 2012 game from scratch if they dont they will lose many more customers im not a fifa fan actually hated the games since fifa 95-98,im trying to like this game i really am but i find that its too open for any dumbass to beat me now who never played a footie game in their lives.pes 5 and 6 were great pity they destroyed this game