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What happened to playtesting!?!?

stajin

Registered User
Konami NEED to find proper playtesters - I mean, how could your playtesters not note that the referee is not only biased, but wrong the majority of the time?
How many times do you get the ball in the penalty area but give away a penalty, even though it's plain to see you got the ball way before the player?
How many times are you in THIER penalty area, about to shoot then get taken out from behind for the ref to wave it away??

How can they not notice the commentator says SHOTS (not SHOOTS, SHOTS) some of the time? I mean it's pretty basic stuff!

How on earth could they NOT notice this, it seems PES2010's main idea is to annoy you to death!!

Not only that, but what's with the ping pong in midfield? You spend half the game running round chasing the ball as they (e.g. Real Madrid) always have a way to pass, but when you get a ball your entire team turn into retards and give the ball away?

If your going to add that sort of AI into the game then make BOTH teams have clever positioning, after all the player can't control the placement of 11 players at once.

Next is passing - I've lost count of the times I've had a player close, pressed in his direction and pass and it passes miles out to someone else? I mean WTF??? It's blatently obvious who I mean to pass to but the game spoons it? why? and don't say manual passes - I shouldn't have to jump through hoops to get the player to make a basic pass to someone yards away in open space.

Why can't I choose which player I want to change to and why can't I choose WHEN I want to change?

It seems if they have a striker running towards your penalty area it just won't choose the player you want until it's too late. Instead you have to hammer the player change button like crazy in the hope you'll get to be that player before they score as your other defenders seem incapable of being positioned anywhere remotely useful.

Why do you only get the choice of having the AI change player for you, pressing L1 to get the AI to choose a player and sometimes changing for you or pressing L1 to change and having the AI spoon it if you don't press L1 before they get it?

Give us the option (in defense for instance) to NEVER change player UNLESS we press L1 or get the ball.

In short, just get someone who IS NOT on the development team to actually play the game - as it seems you have made PES2010 all about playing football the way YOU want us to play rather than the way WE want to play and added in artificial barriers to force us to do this -
e.g.

You go to intercept a ball and a magical invisible barrier stops you.
You go to run back in defense, the ball goes near your player and they automatically make the most retarded attempt to get the ball ever, completely messing up your run. If -I- want to attempt an interception then -I- will, stop forcing it to mess it up and stop the run.

You get the ball, you launch it forward and your striker(s) are in a MASSIVELY offside position - why? Do you guys actually watch football or what? you won't find Rooney sat in the penalty area whilst there's no defender in 10 meters of him in a real game, so why's he doing it in this? Just an artificial attempt to stop you playing the ball fast to the strikers as the defensive AI can't cope with it.

With throw-ins it actually MAKES YOU WAIT for the opposition to mark your players before it'll let you throw? I mean WTF? my players have no one near them, i hit X, hell I HAMMER X and it just won't do ANYTHING until the opposition get to mark people!

If you get the ball with your keeper, you can't throw it out or kick it out until the opposition have run back - why? Seems you've coded it to not allow players to take advantage of the fact that some teams send loads of players up for attack.

What's with freekicks/corners when subs are being made? It makes you wait until the icon at the bottom is gone meaning if you have an obvious opening you can't take it - surely it should do the sub and THEN go to the corner/freekick?

You go to slide, you GET the ball, then thier player is up like a flash and has the ball back but your player seems superglued to the floor?
Surely if they can get up that fast, so should you be able to?
Or you take the ball (slide) and another opposition player is there to pick up the ball - never seems to be that one of your players is there but yet they always are? why?

How about releasing a game a few months before PES2011, like a PES2011 preview. Give us a chance to actually point out where your going wrong as it's the most basic things that your messing up.
Just a few fixs and you'd have an amazing game. As it is, it's a good game when it doesn't go wrong. (e.g. amazing last second tackle, replay shows you clearly got the ball first and yet it's a red EVERY time but your about to score, get taken out from behind, they don't even TOUCH the ball and nothing given).
At the very least FIX your mistakes - it can't be that hard to patch the ref surely?

And what the HELL is with 'GOD MODE', you can be dominating a game, you score and all of a sudden they just can't be tackled, we're talking THREE ON ONE and they STILL can't tackle them??? Even Messi/Ronaldo can't do that 100% of the time, but once god mode is on, it just seems that the PC has choosen that it will score and will BIAS everything to the opposition favour. It's just silly!

Maybe I'm gettin cynical, but it seems your more worried about getting a bigger audience (multi platform) and raking the money in then fixing basic mistakes as you might have to fix them more than once on different platforms.
And that rather than FIX the code you have to make it work, you hide the fallability of the AI by adding in 'workarounds' to stop them being exposed. e.g. no fast throw ins, ref waits till they have all players back before allowing free kick, can't always throw the ball out fast, makes you wait on throw ins for the AI to get in position.

PES just seems to be minor improvements now, nothing more. PES 2010 is just PES 2008 ver 3.
 

stajin

Registered User
PES 2010 is shit. They've improved every area except the one that counts

Which area would you say that is?
Personally I think it's the fact that half the time the game just pisses you off because they become untouchable or the CPU interferes with what your trying to do and gets in the way.

E.g. What sort of idiot would have the boot it button (O) the same as the slide tackle button - there no way to guarentee they're not just gonna take the player in front of it rather than kick the ball upfield - instead you have to give them the ball by pressing square to kick it out.

It's just lost its fun, PES 6 was amazing mostly - players responded straight away, adrenaline pumped matches between players and it was about who was better, not who the CPU would interfere with less.
 

stodge

Registered User
PES 2010 is a nice change from FIFA for me but I agree - it's frustrating and Konami seriously need to fire their testers and designers. I hate the ping pong and that fact that I can't get anywhere near the opposition as they knock it around like Italy or Brazil, even if I'm playing the worst team in the league. I also hate the fact that my fast striker can get past a slow defender yet be caught from behind. The refs drive me nuts too and not being able to control my player while the opposition throws in, yet they gain control before I throw in. I think Konami is desparate but hopefully 2011 will be different because PES2010 does have a few things I much prefer over FIFA, including excitement, flow, ball physics that don't always seem to be on rails and can often produce wonderful surprises and lots of "ooooooooh" and "noooooooooo" moments!
 

stajin

Registered User
Yeah, I know what you mean - it just seems to be them taking the wrong approach.
Take the throw ins for instance - if the opposition aren't in the right place when you're ready to throw the ball in then that's because it's programmed wrong. Fix that rather than making me wait for them. There's just to many artificial things like that to work around bad coding -e.g. the invisible barrier on throw ins. Same with cross field balls - true, long balls should be harder to do because they take more time to come down and can be headed - but why, when I have plenty of time, does my player seem to automatically run behind an opposing player - I've got loads of time to be where it lands, so I'm in front, so why when I'm looking at the radar trying to move that player does it refuse to allow me to move it?
Don't force the player to move for me - make it do WHAT I WANT, not WHAT YOU WANT.

In fact, I think that's one of thier main bugs and mistakes. They have concentrated far to much on making you do what and play how THEY WANT YOU TO, rather than making the framework to allow you to play how YOU want to.

The sad thing is, all this has been said by many people since PES 2008 but KONAMI just don't seem to be listening. Take refs - how many people on this forum are complaining about them just in this version (We all have since 2008).. so where is the patch? There's not even an acknowledgement there's a problem.
Personally I think that if KONAMI don't sort this they'll find thier fan base slowly wilter - after all, PES 2008 = PES 2009 = PES 2010 to far too large a degree, all with the same faults and all having few improvements over cosmetics.
Take the much vaunted tactical system and AI.
If it's so much better how come my players still act like fools? e.g. you make a pass and inbetween the pass and reciepient a player runs in and backheels it outta the way.
Seabass said that players would do anything to get the ball back, and do it cleverly, so how come players in the box, when NOT running and tackling FROM THE FRONT still seem to knock the ball on and out for a corner.
All I'm saying is KONAMI need to actually MAKE A PES 2011, not a PES 2008 ver 4 and FIX THE PROBLEMS - scrap the engine you have at the moment it DOES NOT WORK. Instead make a new game not an update of the old one.
 

scholsey

Registered User
I know it may seem a bit stupid, but can KONAMI not release the PES11 demo a good 2 months earlier and then bring out patches after listening to our feedback?
tbh, the feedback thing sounds a bit stupid to, because we cannot guarantee if KONAMI is listening to our opinions...unless they put a survey option in the PES11 demo. if it does happen, we can give feedback on the gameplay. the commentary, BAL, ML feedback will have to be given to KONAMI after the game is released so they can add improvements in new patches.
what do you guys think, is it really stupid or is it a worthwhile shout?
 

stajin

Registered User
I know it may seem a bit stupid, but can KONAMI not release the PES11 demo a good 2 months earlier and then bring out patches after listening to our feedback?
tbh, the feedback thing sounds a bit stupid to, because we cannot guarantee if KONAMI is listening to our opinions...unless they put a survey option in the PES11 demo. if it does happen, we can give feedback on the gameplay. the commentary, BAL, ML feedback will have to be given to KONAMI after the game is released so they can add improvements in new patches.
what do you guys think, is it really stupid or is it a worthwhile shout?

That is exactly what I've been saying!
Thing is, since PES 2008 we have all said how bad the refs are (as an example), have they fixed them? have they released a patch? have they even ADMITTED there is a problem?
It's all a good idea but they just aren't listening.

In fact if KONAMI does actually read this forum (Which I'm beginning to doubt as they have never made a post that I've seen) why not give US some feedback, c'mon, what are your plans, are you actually gonna fix this mess or you just gonna watch PES fall into oblivion. I for one WON'T be buying the next PES unless there is a major improvement.
Maybe someone can get a petition going for an official answer - I'd do it, but I don't know even know where to start!
 

Dundon's

W.G.P
This years release drove me over the edge, I was still living the dream after 2008 and thought it was just a one off, thought no way can the next game be anything like this pile of shit and that they'd have to fix it, but boy I was wrong, 2009 and 2010 are just taking the piss at this stage so I've just written off the game completely.

These lads will never see a single penny of my money ever again. A sad end to a truly special football game down through the years.
 

stajin

Registered User
The most irritating thing is that this is supposed to be the "official KONAMI feedback zone". Now has ANYONE seen a post of ANYKIND that suggests that KONAMI are actually taking any notice of all this, let alone trying to fix it.
E.g. Why has there been no ref patch?
Seems like they just don't give a damn anymore.
Maybe once they realise they can't sell any copies they might do something about it.
 

stodge

Registered User
Hopefully Ubisoft will bring out their soccer game and it'll be good enough that Konami's market share drops 50% - that'll get someone's attention. Bugs don't attract attention; lost sales do. Konami has lost me as a customer until they bring out a decent game.
 
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