Konami Please Read And Sort It Out - SAVE OUR GAME
First I would like to mention that I originally signed up here to post my review / feedback on PES, and was shocked to read this post http://www.pesgaming.com/showthread.php?t=88705 by "asbestos".
Shocked because it was as if he had taken the words right out of my mouth.
Now I could of just replied to that post, but have chosen not to. I am not trying to make spam, I believe that this forum is for Konami to read and take in feedback and I feel that one post is not strong enough for them to stand up and take notice, especially when that topic is now filled with petty arguments and silly comments.
So anyway, like "asbestos", I to never register on forums and I to am a lifelong fan of the Konami football series. And its finally time for me to post on here and hope Konami take notice and save my favourite game. I also have owned every Konami football game since ISS and it actually breaks my heart that it has come to me complaining about it, something that id never thought id do!
But Konami have ruined it. It is a complete mess and an embarrassment to a football game - and I highlight the word "game". Before I continue I would like to say that there are "some" positives to the game which I will highlight later.
So PES 2012, 2011 and 2010. (Actually, I thought that 2008 and 2009 for ps3 were pretty good, but could tell something was missing. Then when 2010 came out, that was it over.) They lack the most important concept in playing a game. Ask yourself the question, Why do we play consoles? The simple answer is - because it is FUN.
PES no longer is FUN.
Die hard Konami fans will remember playing ISS and PES all the way up to before they started making PES for ps3 / xbox and will know it was unbelievably fun. No matter what, you were enjoying it. You could leave your mates after getting beat 10-0 and still leave with a smile on your face. Mad runs and crazy shots that would rocket into the goal. Now however, if you win 10-0, you leave pissed off. You constantly sit in shock and confusion throughout the whole game wondering why things are happening. You really do wonder how the hell this game was actually released. Its a joke.
Again this comes back to the point of a game being fun. I do not enjoy playing PES anymore, not one bit. Its obvious that they have spent all their time making the game look fantastic, which it does. The graphics, the strips and faces, the champions league. The attention to detail is immense. Miles better than FIFA. Well done Konami.
Unfortunately I do not buy a "game" for it to look amazing. I buy a game because I want it to perform well. I want to enjoy it!! If I wanted to see something look fantastic I would just watch the real thing. I hate to say it, but its as if they have tried to be like FIFA. Every PES fan knows that people used to only buy FIFA because "ooh its got all the real names and teams and its got the commentary from sky sports and its got my crappy team in it from the lowest league in the world" bla bla BLA. And that is the sad sad truth - that's what sells games - that's what makes them money.
Konami was always the underdog - nothing about it was official, but no one cared because it made up for it all in gameplay. Now it has lost its gameplay, I feel there is not one good football game to play any more as I refuse to play FIFA, being the die hard PES fan that I am.
So what exactly is the problem with the gameplay? "Asbestos" summed it up pretty well, but I will add to it.
I was about to write "The biggest problem with the gameplay is.." but there are sadly so many.
Shooting and scoring is awful. Every shot you take will either be weak and it will be a simple save, or the keeper will be sleeping and the ball will float into the goal, or it will blast over or wide, so much that it becomes fake. Fake sounds harsh but have Konami ever sat down and watched a football game? A decent shot from an average team from outside the box, the ball will usually reach a point in its height that it begins to drop, (hey its gravity!). On PES however the ball just keeps going up and up and up as if its leaving the planet. I cant believe Im about to give FIFA a praise here, but I was watching my mates play it and they were taking some decent shots from outside the box / corner of the box - they were powerful shots and once the ball hit its max height it lowered and nicely tucked into the bottom corner. I nearly choked when I saw it, it looked class. Try this on pes and the ball turns into a helium filled balloon.
I mostly play online and I cannot remember the last time I scored, or conceded a really good goal. Most goals are corners, scrappy goals with deflections with everyone standing in the box, and one on ones where 9/10 times can simply run round the keeper. Compare the shooting with lets say PES 6 (PS2), the goals on that game were immense. You could quickly turn and shoot first time, or run down the wing and quickly cut inside and strike it and being honest most of the time it would not be a goal, but would be on target or pretty close! And when they were on target they were some crackers! Shots would batter off the keeper and there was usually someone there to tuck in the rebound - it always kept you on the edge of your seat. I mean scoring a great goal on a football game?! Really?! Its unthinkable on the current PES.
Because of the awful scoring, this makes the online feature pointless. For me, the whole point of online is to compete to say who is the better player - not who is the luckiest. I mean sometimes luck happens, but in every game? I don't think so Konami. The online rating system does not make any sense and is unfair. In most games I can easily keep most of the possession and create the most chances, but am not rewarded. Then my opponent who is clearly crap, gets a lucky through ball on the counter and runs round the keeper in the last minute or heads in from a corner. He then picks up the points. Im sorry but that says he beat me and then says he is a better player than me. It would make more sense if the rating was based on the stats of the game as well as the final score - the game should take silly pieces of luck into consideration. It takes a lot of time to build up my rating then when I play someone with a rating of 350 and im on 560 they get lucky and I drop a mountain of points! I also do not understand why sometimes I will drop for example 10 points if I lose but the winner (my opponent) will only go up 6? Why am I punished more? It should be even! I am not a sore loser, hell I can take a beating - you can tell who are the really good players - I just cant stand it being unfair.
The AI is a joke. This is what makes defending impossible. Players will also randomly be standing way out of position. I set my formation so I know where my players should be standing so I can make a pass. Yeah right, they wander around and its no wonder defending is impossible. My centre back will be mid wing! My forwards will be defending when the defence will be further up the pitch!
Through balls - defenders will watch the ball go past them and they will just look at it, maybe run along side it and look at it but make no attempt in actually regaining possession or making a clearance.
Passing - Im a centre back, I run slightly to the right (shooting from left to right) press down+right to make a pass to my right back who is on the wing - the ball should automatically pass to him correct? Yes, but not all of the time. If the receiving player is not in the exact place by 1mm the player will just pass a very weak pass at plain 45 degrees and will usually go out for a throw in or the offence will run in and steal it. You have to ask yourself - Why would I want to make a pass like that?! Its obvious who I want to pass to, so just do it!!
Shooting or passing when chasing a loose ball - players will just slide way to early and completely miss the ball. Ok so maybe they have implemented a timing thing into the game now where I have to time it perfectly when I want my player to kick the ball. WHY? What is the point? Why would I want my player to slide and miss the ball? I should be able to press shoot or cross while my player is running to the ball and then when he gets there he should then make proper contact! (Like what used to happen!!) This is especially frustrating when you spend all your time breaking through a tough defence and when you finally get through you press shoot and just slides and completely misses the ball!
Keepers - run out to collect a through ball but what happens? You suddenly are in control and dribbling with the keeper! By the time you get over your shock, he has lost possession - open goal - bang - goal. He should automatcially boot it up the field! I know you can turn off the assisted AI, however what is the point in it when this is what happens? Why would I want my keeper to do that?!
Very simple things also annoy me. For example since the release on PS3 / Xbox, they have removed the man of the match. WHY? Something so simple is sadly missed!
The "Spider web" for the players stats was a super effective way for telling how good a player was. Now this rating thing does not make any sense! I mean look at David Villas overall rating! It is pathetic, yet he is very good! So you have to ignore the overall rating and go through technique, speed, phy and res individually to read all the stats - it takes ages! I do not want this - no PES fan does! The overall rating is a direct copy from FIFA - trying to be like FIFA again are we?! In master league some players have an overall rating of more than 100! Eh? How can someone be better than 100? Flawed to the MAX.
The community feature is also a disappointment (not online, but could apply). Remember on older PES games in community - there was the "Titles" Something so so simple and fun, has again been removed. There was enough stats there to keep you amazed for hours, comparing you and your friends results!
And here's the sad bit. Me and my friends to this day refuse to play any PES game with each other, other than PS2. Yes, we are still playing PES on the PS2. And it is the best piece of fun ever on a console, it cannot be beaten! We have played it that much we have accumulated nearly a million PES points on PES 2009. Konami are for some reason still releasing PES for PS2. Ok the gameplay has not changed for several years, but it is still 100 times better then the "better and new" pes on ps3. Just picked up 2012 for ps2 and we are starting a brand new community. I feel this may be one of the last proper PES games so get it while you can and enjoy!
And thats the whole point! Fun! Gameplay! Not trying to get brownie points over each other because PES has better graphics and FIFA has more licenses!
To this day, I still try to persuade people to get PES instead of FIFA, but now its getting to the stage why should I do your work for you if you are producing gameplay like this?
Get back to your roots PES! Produce a FUN and ENJOYABLE game. Not this stressful piece of garbage! I would be over the moon if PES 2013 had all fake names again but played out of this world! Wouldn't mind playing as "Senior" again as BRAZIL in ISS!
I know older games were not as realistic, but its more fun, again the reason we play games! I understand there has to be a happy medium, I don't want to play a game where I can shoot from anywhere and score. I liked how PES did take a lot of skill to learn, everyone knows that. This new game is too realistic in all the wrong places and too fake in all the wrong places.
Its a serious sad state of affairs when in this day in age with all the technology we have, there is not a new good football game to play. Its even sadder that people are comparing this brand new 2012 game on a new powerful PS3 to a game possibly older than 10 years on an older console, and yes the old one is better for gameplay - the most important!
I still very much love the PES Shop, and classic teams and players! Also edit mode is a dream. If PES was to get rid of these then they are stupid.
So please, this is my honest opinion on the current PES series, and I know thousands of people feel the same. Please Konami stand up and take notice, or you will lose all your true die hard fans, forever to FIFA?
If Konami do not listen to their imporant fans, then sadly I do not want to be their fan any more if they are going to treat them like this.
First I would like to mention that I originally signed up here to post my review / feedback on PES, and was shocked to read this post http://www.pesgaming.com/showthread.php?t=88705 by "asbestos".
Shocked because it was as if he had taken the words right out of my mouth.
Now I could of just replied to that post, but have chosen not to. I am not trying to make spam, I believe that this forum is for Konami to read and take in feedback and I feel that one post is not strong enough for them to stand up and take notice, especially when that topic is now filled with petty arguments and silly comments.
So anyway, like "asbestos", I to never register on forums and I to am a lifelong fan of the Konami football series. And its finally time for me to post on here and hope Konami take notice and save my favourite game. I also have owned every Konami football game since ISS and it actually breaks my heart that it has come to me complaining about it, something that id never thought id do!
But Konami have ruined it. It is a complete mess and an embarrassment to a football game - and I highlight the word "game". Before I continue I would like to say that there are "some" positives to the game which I will highlight later.
So PES 2012, 2011 and 2010. (Actually, I thought that 2008 and 2009 for ps3 were pretty good, but could tell something was missing. Then when 2010 came out, that was it over.) They lack the most important concept in playing a game. Ask yourself the question, Why do we play consoles? The simple answer is - because it is FUN.
PES no longer is FUN.
Die hard Konami fans will remember playing ISS and PES all the way up to before they started making PES for ps3 / xbox and will know it was unbelievably fun. No matter what, you were enjoying it. You could leave your mates after getting beat 10-0 and still leave with a smile on your face. Mad runs and crazy shots that would rocket into the goal. Now however, if you win 10-0, you leave pissed off. You constantly sit in shock and confusion throughout the whole game wondering why things are happening. You really do wonder how the hell this game was actually released. Its a joke.
Again this comes back to the point of a game being fun. I do not enjoy playing PES anymore, not one bit. Its obvious that they have spent all their time making the game look fantastic, which it does. The graphics, the strips and faces, the champions league. The attention to detail is immense. Miles better than FIFA. Well done Konami.
Unfortunately I do not buy a "game" for it to look amazing. I buy a game because I want it to perform well. I want to enjoy it!! If I wanted to see something look fantastic I would just watch the real thing. I hate to say it, but its as if they have tried to be like FIFA. Every PES fan knows that people used to only buy FIFA because "ooh its got all the real names and teams and its got the commentary from sky sports and its got my crappy team in it from the lowest league in the world" bla bla BLA. And that is the sad sad truth - that's what sells games - that's what makes them money.
Konami was always the underdog - nothing about it was official, but no one cared because it made up for it all in gameplay. Now it has lost its gameplay, I feel there is not one good football game to play any more as I refuse to play FIFA, being the die hard PES fan that I am.
So what exactly is the problem with the gameplay? "Asbestos" summed it up pretty well, but I will add to it.
I was about to write "The biggest problem with the gameplay is.." but there are sadly so many.
Shooting and scoring is awful. Every shot you take will either be weak and it will be a simple save, or the keeper will be sleeping and the ball will float into the goal, or it will blast over or wide, so much that it becomes fake. Fake sounds harsh but have Konami ever sat down and watched a football game? A decent shot from an average team from outside the box, the ball will usually reach a point in its height that it begins to drop, (hey its gravity!). On PES however the ball just keeps going up and up and up as if its leaving the planet. I cant believe Im about to give FIFA a praise here, but I was watching my mates play it and they were taking some decent shots from outside the box / corner of the box - they were powerful shots and once the ball hit its max height it lowered and nicely tucked into the bottom corner. I nearly choked when I saw it, it looked class. Try this on pes and the ball turns into a helium filled balloon.
I mostly play online and I cannot remember the last time I scored, or conceded a really good goal. Most goals are corners, scrappy goals with deflections with everyone standing in the box, and one on ones where 9/10 times can simply run round the keeper. Compare the shooting with lets say PES 6 (PS2), the goals on that game were immense. You could quickly turn and shoot first time, or run down the wing and quickly cut inside and strike it and being honest most of the time it would not be a goal, but would be on target or pretty close! And when they were on target they were some crackers! Shots would batter off the keeper and there was usually someone there to tuck in the rebound - it always kept you on the edge of your seat. I mean scoring a great goal on a football game?! Really?! Its unthinkable on the current PES.
Because of the awful scoring, this makes the online feature pointless. For me, the whole point of online is to compete to say who is the better player - not who is the luckiest. I mean sometimes luck happens, but in every game? I don't think so Konami. The online rating system does not make any sense and is unfair. In most games I can easily keep most of the possession and create the most chances, but am not rewarded. Then my opponent who is clearly crap, gets a lucky through ball on the counter and runs round the keeper in the last minute or heads in from a corner. He then picks up the points. Im sorry but that says he beat me and then says he is a better player than me. It would make more sense if the rating was based on the stats of the game as well as the final score - the game should take silly pieces of luck into consideration. It takes a lot of time to build up my rating then when I play someone with a rating of 350 and im on 560 they get lucky and I drop a mountain of points! I also do not understand why sometimes I will drop for example 10 points if I lose but the winner (my opponent) will only go up 6? Why am I punished more? It should be even! I am not a sore loser, hell I can take a beating - you can tell who are the really good players - I just cant stand it being unfair.
The AI is a joke. This is what makes defending impossible. Players will also randomly be standing way out of position. I set my formation so I know where my players should be standing so I can make a pass. Yeah right, they wander around and its no wonder defending is impossible. My centre back will be mid wing! My forwards will be defending when the defence will be further up the pitch!
Through balls - defenders will watch the ball go past them and they will just look at it, maybe run along side it and look at it but make no attempt in actually regaining possession or making a clearance.
Passing - Im a centre back, I run slightly to the right (shooting from left to right) press down+right to make a pass to my right back who is on the wing - the ball should automatically pass to him correct? Yes, but not all of the time. If the receiving player is not in the exact place by 1mm the player will just pass a very weak pass at plain 45 degrees and will usually go out for a throw in or the offence will run in and steal it. You have to ask yourself - Why would I want to make a pass like that?! Its obvious who I want to pass to, so just do it!!
Shooting or passing when chasing a loose ball - players will just slide way to early and completely miss the ball. Ok so maybe they have implemented a timing thing into the game now where I have to time it perfectly when I want my player to kick the ball. WHY? What is the point? Why would I want my player to slide and miss the ball? I should be able to press shoot or cross while my player is running to the ball and then when he gets there he should then make proper contact! (Like what used to happen!!) This is especially frustrating when you spend all your time breaking through a tough defence and when you finally get through you press shoot and just slides and completely misses the ball!
Keepers - run out to collect a through ball but what happens? You suddenly are in control and dribbling with the keeper! By the time you get over your shock, he has lost possession - open goal - bang - goal. He should automatcially boot it up the field! I know you can turn off the assisted AI, however what is the point in it when this is what happens? Why would I want my keeper to do that?!
Very simple things also annoy me. For example since the release on PS3 / Xbox, they have removed the man of the match. WHY? Something so simple is sadly missed!
The "Spider web" for the players stats was a super effective way for telling how good a player was. Now this rating thing does not make any sense! I mean look at David Villas overall rating! It is pathetic, yet he is very good! So you have to ignore the overall rating and go through technique, speed, phy and res individually to read all the stats - it takes ages! I do not want this - no PES fan does! The overall rating is a direct copy from FIFA - trying to be like FIFA again are we?! In master league some players have an overall rating of more than 100! Eh? How can someone be better than 100? Flawed to the MAX.
The community feature is also a disappointment (not online, but could apply). Remember on older PES games in community - there was the "Titles" Something so so simple and fun, has again been removed. There was enough stats there to keep you amazed for hours, comparing you and your friends results!
And here's the sad bit. Me and my friends to this day refuse to play any PES game with each other, other than PS2. Yes, we are still playing PES on the PS2. And it is the best piece of fun ever on a console, it cannot be beaten! We have played it that much we have accumulated nearly a million PES points on PES 2009. Konami are for some reason still releasing PES for PS2. Ok the gameplay has not changed for several years, but it is still 100 times better then the "better and new" pes on ps3. Just picked up 2012 for ps2 and we are starting a brand new community. I feel this may be one of the last proper PES games so get it while you can and enjoy!
And thats the whole point! Fun! Gameplay! Not trying to get brownie points over each other because PES has better graphics and FIFA has more licenses!
To this day, I still try to persuade people to get PES instead of FIFA, but now its getting to the stage why should I do your work for you if you are producing gameplay like this?
Get back to your roots PES! Produce a FUN and ENJOYABLE game. Not this stressful piece of garbage! I would be over the moon if PES 2013 had all fake names again but played out of this world! Wouldn't mind playing as "Senior" again as BRAZIL in ISS!
I know older games were not as realistic, but its more fun, again the reason we play games! I understand there has to be a happy medium, I don't want to play a game where I can shoot from anywhere and score. I liked how PES did take a lot of skill to learn, everyone knows that. This new game is too realistic in all the wrong places and too fake in all the wrong places.
Its a serious sad state of affairs when in this day in age with all the technology we have, there is not a new good football game to play. Its even sadder that people are comparing this brand new 2012 game on a new powerful PS3 to a game possibly older than 10 years on an older console, and yes the old one is better for gameplay - the most important!
I still very much love the PES Shop, and classic teams and players! Also edit mode is a dream. If PES was to get rid of these then they are stupid.
So please, this is my honest opinion on the current PES series, and I know thousands of people feel the same. Please Konami stand up and take notice, or you will lose all your true die hard fans, forever to FIFA?
If Konami do not listen to their imporant fans, then sadly I do not want to be their fan any more if they are going to treat them like this.
