some observations from the Napoli vs Man City game yesterday

[DIECI]

Watching the game and the goals in particular totally reminded me of PES, think about it, all 3 of those goals were TOTAL PES!

The 1st goal, header off the corner kick from a weird angle that snuck in, then the 2nd goal off a horrible cleared ball for an easy tap in, how many times does this happen in PES and we scream at the screen saying " KICK THE FKN BALL OUT" but instead the clearence is weak, and then ofcourse the last goal, a cut back pass for a shot which went basically to the goalie but too fast to save. Then you had a lot of other instances, break aways that hit the post, and others where the player simply didnt have an agle and shot at the goalie.

So for the ppl who complain about these things, just look at that game as an example of annoying things that happen in PES that also happen in real life!

 

[techboy11]

Agree totally Dieci, in fact the more in play PES and see the amount of different goals I witness it kind of beggars belief. Last night for example, I had a game v Sunderland which was 0-0, with the last free kick of the game the kicker whipped a ball in, one of those that the defender and attacker both miss, but which the keeper is wrong footed and the ball ends it going directly in. Just class.

Then this morning, I had two goals which I haven't seen in yonks, a corner, and a flick on at the near post for a volleyed tap in at the far, and another scrambles goal after I headed, the keeper saved it onto the underside of the bar, which cannoned straight to Carroll for another scrappy tap in...just amazing stuff. Aside from that I had Aguero score a quite brilliant goal against me yesterday, a solo effort which oozed class. Quite honestly the goal variation is astounding.

 

[DIECI]

yes Tech its true, lots of variations but thats what PES has always been about. Question for you... with your PC patch, does it affect shooting as well? The accuracy, shot power and aiming this year is a bit odd and or difficult at times. I was wondering if your patch solves this issue.

 

[techboy11]

Jenkey's patch doesn't alter the way the shot dynamic executes, for example a shot from a 69 shot accuracy person will still go like a 69 shot accuracy person, ie crap.

But by adding ball weight for example you lose the balloon feel when the ball goes in the air, and by adding shot power shots execute much better.

But it's all relative to each other if you understand what I mean which means you have to spend some time altering and playing to get what you feel is the perfect balance.

I have settled for example on all these settings being used together - gamespeed 83 (reduced from 90 in the examples I showed, I agree that the games were a little too fast), but in reducing gamespeed it automatically has the slowing effect of the ball being struck, so I increased shot power to 50. I think I currently have the ball weight as one notch heavier than default.

Now all these settings combined make for a great game of footy now. The increased ball weight for example, enables you to hit more skimmy type of hots as obviously the ball is heavier. What I tried to do is take the responsiveness and quickness out of the game by lowering gamespeed slightly but keeping actual realistic ball reactions (like how long the ball stays in the air from goal kicks, if I hit the ball right with a good player it should stay hit and not go like a balloon etc etc).

 

[abu97]

That match was too fast-paced but that is how MAN CITY play. I thought it was a poor representation of a match as Man City rushed forward too much leading to holes in their defence. However these matches are rare but to be honest after playing PES on -1 gamespeed it didn't feel like the man city match, more like FIFA

 

[Rasmus]

I think some of the mentioned above are interesting points of view. How ever regarding the goal variation i have to disagree, at least what matters the cpu.
I play on superstar and they ALWAYS score on free kicks or corner. I'm getting good at defending, but somehow they manage to get ONE free kick or corner kick during the game, so they win 1-0. Maybe i'm focusing too much on the defending aspects in the game, since i don't score that many goals any more.
Actually i think the goal variation was much more visible before the patch.

 

[Makavelian]

All this gushing about pes recently i decided to play a few games today having not played it for a while and it's still a car crash.

 

[DIECI]

All this gushing about pes recently i decided to play a few games today having not played it for a while and it's still a car crash.

better a car crash than a train wreck :tongue:

 

[techboy11]

better a car crash than a train wreck :tongue:

Honestly you can't win with the FIFA boys - I show clips of PES v FIFA and everyone says PES was too fast too unrealistic. Then when someone mentions last nights game resembles PES, FIFA boys say 'yeah it was fast, but that's how City play, you can't count that' lol, oh man.

The trouble is, getting a generic speed on things is almost impossible, because matches play at different speeds ALL the time.

Take Manchester United v City last year, basically a disgrace to football they both were happy with the draw, the game was played at a snails pace, I mean gamespeed -10. Because both sides took no risks and were happy not expending ANY energy.

Then you take the Chelsea v Arsenal game a few weeks ago, fk me now that was PES to a tee, end to end, quick movements, open game. You take ANY Real Madrid game, they are lightening and direct so PES' speed intertwines how Real Madrid play.

Then you have that Liverpool-Chelsea game on the weekend, again totally drab, totally slow.

It just depends on the day.

That's why it's SO difficult to pin a gamespeed down. I've gone down a few pegs or two on the gamespeed after watching some games THIS WEEK, but this weekend may see teams go hammer and tong again?!?

Again what are we referring the gamespeed too? If you look at the Premiership generally, the games are played at a frantic pace. Even David Silva said in the paper on the weekend that he's never experienced anything like it and that you have to pass the ball before it gets to you, together with the physical nature of the game.

 

[DIECI]

Honestly you can't win with the FIFA boys - I show clips of PES v FIFA and everyone says PES was too fast too unrealistic. Then when someone mentions last nights game resembles PES, FIFA boys say 'yeah it was fast, but that's how City play, you can't count that' lol, oh man.

haha! yes yes I agree.... I think the best thing to do is to stay away from these forums until the next game is announced and come see the development of the game and release date... After the games come out this place starts to degenerate and becomes rather annoying to visit.

I suggest a section is made just for complaints and ppl who dislike the game and the general forum be left for game discussion.

 

[Makavelian]

Honestly you can't win with the FIFA boys .

I dislike pes12! then of course i am a FIFA fan boy aren't i?
Last time i bought FIFA was 98.
And on your videos you might want to use fraps to record matches instead of recording your screen what doesn't give a true representation of the game.

 

[techboy11]

I dislike pes12! then of course i am a FIFA fan boy aren't i?
Last time i bought FIFA was 98.
And on your videos you might want to use fraps to record matches instead of recording your screen what doesn't give a true representation of the game.

It's the best I can do Mak, if I use screen capture software it makes the game go jerky. But sorry dude, I'll nip down to Curry's and get a £900 JVC kit. Sorry to everyone.

 

[abu97]

PES is just too much end to end. The game yesterday wasn't too much end-to end compared with PES. Man City play and offensice type of build-up play and when they played last night, they don't always play like that.
Also every match on PES is end to end, so by saying one match was end-to end (not as much as pes though) is ridiculous. Everyone knows PES was made for offensive play

 

[techboy11]

PES is just too much end to end. The game yesterday wasn't too much end-to end compared with PES. Man City play and offensice type of build-up play and when they played last night, they don't always play like that.
Also every match on PES is end to end, so by saying one match was end-to end (not as much as pes though) is ridiculous. Everyone knows PES was made for offensive play

(Sigh)

Abu, do you want proof of 22 minute games that I have that ended 0-0!?! lol, Jesus.

 

[abu97]

I read half of your analysis and I agree with most however your analysis makes FIFA sound crap and arcadey and dull. This isn't true and ask most of the people that play FIFA but eventhough it doesn't have 'good' AI as PES, it doesn't mean it isn't a sim. I remember PES 2011 which had a crap AI was called a more simmed game because of it's slow game speed and build-up play but look at FIFA know, all of that with more polishing, more responsive and more free. In PES the display stats don't make sense - shots on target, possession - it's just a joke whilst PES 2011 had it more realistic. I saw your FIFA video and you played it as if it was PES- fast and arcadey which is why you thought it was a major disappointment. Whenever I play, I don't use skills much or do through balls like a lot do, I pass the ball to my defense as the COM AI aren't pressure abusers unlike PES where you get hurried in possession in the first 10 minutes. I pass the ball and swith sides eventhough the dribbling doesn't feel right for some players - Messi dribbles with the ball better on PES but that is because of speed merchant, on FIFA he paces it but the dribbling is better on FIFA as it isn't too loose like PES 2011 but too close like PES 2012

 

[abu97]

(Sigh)

Abu, do you want proof of 22 minute games that I have that ended 0-0!?! lol, Jesus.

0-0 doesn't mean it isn't end to end. It just means you failed to convert your chances. End to end means there is no midfield and the ball is in attack always. However some people like you, Techboy, might be able to pass the ball and keep long periods of possession but I can't on -1 game speed because the AI pressures you too much in defense. Show me one match that you can pass the ball in midfield and in defence and play like real football, not JOGA BONITO!

 

[MozzyEng]

I read half of your analysis and I agree with most however your analysis makes FIFA sound crap and arcadey and dull. This isn't true and ask most of the people that play FIFA but eventhough it doesn't have 'good' AI as PES, it doesn't mean it isn't a sim. I remember PES 2011 which had a crap AI was called a more simmed game because of it's slow game speed and build-up play but look at FIFA know, all of that with more polishing, more responsive and more free. In PES the display stats don't make sense - shots on target, possession - it's just a joke whilst PES 2011 had it more realistic. I saw your FIFA video and you played it as if it was PES- fast and arcadey which is why you thought it was a major disappointment. Whenever I play, I don't use skills much or do through balls like a lot do, I pass the ball to my defense as the COM AI aren't pressure abusers unlike PES where you get hurried in possession in the first 10 minutes. I pass the ball and swith sides eventhough the dribbling doesn't feel right for some players - Messi dribbles with the ball better on PES but that is because of speed merchant, on FIFA he paces it but the dribbling is better on FIFA as it isn't too loose like PES 2011 but too close like PES 2012

Anyone fancy watching some paint dry?

 

[abu97]

Anyone fancy watching some paint dry?

Was that mean to be funny? Because if it was, remind me to laugh later

 

[techboy11]

0-0 doesn't mean it isn't end to end. It just means you failed to convert your chances. End to end means there is no midfield and the ball is in attack always. However some people like you, Techboy, might be able to pass the ball and keep long periods of possession but I can't on -1 game speed because the AI pressures you too much in defense. Show me one match that you can pass the ball in midfield and in defence and play like real football, not JOGA BONITO!

Okay Abu. So basically you want me to engineer loads of passes in the midfield? I don't get what you mean about this 'midfield battle' thing. In FIFA it's less of a midfield battle because I can pass from front to back in four passes?!?! I've shown that in the videos, so where's the midfield battle there?

What I'll do guys is post lots of games in the next day or so, and you'll see that the PES games range from cagey tight games, to all out end to end. Then decide for yourself.

 

[.Lee.]

@Techboy, there really is no point trying to tell Fifa players that PES is better whatever the reasons you come up with. Fifa players will play fifa and love it regardless, as a lot of us do with PES.

It's what they are used to and many are unwilling to convert because they know how to play Fifa and even though they are both football games they play completely differently. With that in mind, if you can play Fifa at top level and then try PES, you will be bad at it, even if you are only going to be poor for 10 or 20 games, learning a new style to technically play a similar game seems pointless to many in this day and age of gamers, most want to be good NOW not later, so they won't like a learning curve.

"Learning Curve" lol, how many slatted PES 2012 at the start, whether it was "OMG the defending is so bad" or "WTF passing is so bad" but most of us now have got used to it.

Asking a Fifa player to then switch or as little as try OUR game, they are not going to like it and end up thinking "Fuck it, I'm going back to Fifa"

I find Fifa a decent game, but it bores me. Although I'd disagree with Fifa players saying PES is too fast, I play on -1 game speed and I find if I'm the team with the most possession I can conduct the speed of the game. How many times in real football have you heard a commentator say "They up the tempo when in possession" or "They need to slow the game down to hold on to their lead" ??

2 very similar games that are worlds apart, and for some daft reason, we feel the need to slag off each others preferred game. Silly really, but I guess that's like real life, YES I'm a MUFC fan, so I hate every single MCFC fan....even though we have two very big things in common........We both love the beautiful game and are both extremely passionate about it.