What they did to Juventus is...

[shaun7]

Where were you 3 yers ago when juve was sent to SERIE B because of bribery?? moggi took 1 year and 6 month of prison. There is no prove????? There are hours of telephone conversations recorded between moggi and the referees. I've heard them myself, they sent it on a docu-film on tv in Italy. it's a shame, but you as a juve supporter won't ever admit it.
i'm not a kid, maybe i could be your father, even if i know that if i had a son he would never been juventino

Get your facts right before you talk this loud and show your hatred.
Oh and those recordings COULD be faked by Moratti. This is another rumour BEING investigated by the court. All that happened IS NOT UP TO THIS DATE 100% proved. Who ever said that all of Juve accusations were true? No one so far because it's being investigated. Don't continue on this because you'll only be looking like an idiot.

 

[byrnie05]

My only problem with Juve is that rubbish Fiat Dealership sponsor. Eurgh.

Shaun, where abouts on the island do you live? My family has a Maltese background, although I've only been once - stayed near St Paul's Bay, just up from the Qawra Palace hotel if you know the area. We visited some family whilst there and they were Juventus supporters, too.

/off topic lol

 

[LUCAPLAYER]

Get your facts right before you talk this loud and show your hatred.
Oh and those recordings COULD be faked by Moratti. This is another rumour BEING investigated by the court. All that happened IS NOT UP TO THIS DATE 100% proved. Who ever said that all of Juve accusations were true? No one so far because it's being investigated. Don't continue on this because you'll only be looking like an idiot.

Non ho mai sentito una manica di stronzate come queste! Ladri!

 

[Sweey]

Lets get this straight and move on shall we?

Juventus deserved their relegation to Serie B. Whatever that investigation did or did not prove, you cannot argue with a seriously long list of refereeing decisions which were clearly wrong and in favour of the club for a number of years, allowing them to win the title. Keep reading this post though, I'm defending Juventus much further down.

Certain high-ranking members at Juventus were doing things they shouldn't have done. Siena-Juventus, April 30 2006. Siena, who have a large number of players on loan from Juventus employ a strategy with their defensive line that they haven't played all season - push up centrally to the half-way line. Juventus immediately play long balls over the top and out wide knowing what they're going to be up against and are 3-0 up inside eight minutes. Then Siena defend properly and no further goals are scored. The result stops Juventus' poor run of form that almost sees them concede the title to Milan. As a Milan fan I don't feel bitterness towards Juventus for it even though it was clear as day they bought the Siena game. For people who haven't watched the game and don't remember it vividly like I do, I suggest you don't comment as you can't even begin to imagine how bad it was.

That all said, they've done their time and deserve to be back in Serie A. The extent to which other clubs were truly involved is where I'm unsure but let us move on a little. One club who weren't good enough to win the title by themselves led the investigation and used their relationships with those at Telecom Italia Mobile to make sure they weren't caught - yes that team at the top of the league now who for the last three years have had such favouritism from referees its as clear as it was when Juventus were getting suspicious decisions for many seasons - and yes, Juve were.

Basically, LUCAPLAYER as a Roma fan is clearly pissed off with Juventus and it isn't a surprise given this is what Franco Sensi kept saying the teams from the north were doing. However, LUCAPLAYER, shouldn't you be just as angry with Inter who used it to buy their way to the top of Italian football and are doing it right now at Roma's expense even though they were part of the whole thing?

Perhaps now we can get back on topic?

Calciopoli discussion belongs here: http://www.pesgaming.com/showthread.php?t=40155

 

[shaun7]

^There are MANY big teams that referees favour. INTER, MILAN, MAN UTD.. These are all examples. The referees always favour the big teams. Oh and if Juve deserved serie B, so should Milan (because they were also involved. Slightly or not, they were still involved). And about games being badly decided by the refs. These happen now days. I do not want to go in detail because I'll be making accusations. Oh and calciopoly is STILL being investigated. So no one should talk about it unless they are 100% sure.
Let's face it, all big teams will be favoured by the referees.
Anyway as for the in game stats.
I think that Juve deserved a downgrade but not how konami made it. I mean decreasing giovinco's speed is surly a stupid move because he's one of the fastest in serie A. Juve's teamwork was the problem and some players don't fit with others.

@LUCAPLAYER Talk in english and be reasonable and stop the hatred.

 

[Sweey]

^There are MANY big teams that referees favour. INTER, MILAN, MAN UTD.. These are all examples. The referees always favour the big teams. Oh and if Juve deserved serie B, so should Milan (because they were also involved. Slightly or not, they were still involved). And about games being badly decided by the refs. These happen now days. I do not want to go in detail because I'll be making accusations. Oh and calciopoly is STILL being investigated. So no one should talk about it unless they are 100% sure.
Let's face it, all big teams will be favoured by the referees.
Anyway as for the in game stats.
I think that Juve deserved a downgrade but not how konami made it. I mean decreasing giovinco's speed is surly a stupid move because he's one of the fastest in serie A. Juve's teamwork was the problem and some players don't fit with others.

@LUCAPLAYER Talk in english and be reasonable and stop the hatred.

You really don't know what you're talking about and I'm pretty sure it is yourself and not another user I had such a discussion with a few months back. Moggi (and I hope he comes back to Serie A soon) controlled the whole thing yet you say Milan deserved the same punishment for a) winning nothing and b) a "director" I'd never even heard of before complaining on the phone about a linesman's performance? You seriously need to take the Juventus glasses off - yes they're still on if you say Juventus deserved demotion but other teams did too even if slightly involved.

Teams slightly involved deserve points deductions, teams centrally involved deserve demotion. We were not found to have fixed anything and I think you'll find a number of clubs were said to be far more involved than us, in particular Fiorentina.

In Milan's case it was deemed beyond reasonable doubt that Meani was working of his own accord and that Galliani had no knowledge of anything Meani was saying or doing - which wasn't much anyway. A host of central figures worked for Juventus with Lazio and Firoentina not exactly being entirely innocent.

This is Italy, that's why it is still being investigated yet nothing will happen. The legal system is a joke.

As for referees favouring big teams, again take those Juventus glasses off and go and look at every single Juventus match from 2000 to 2006. You'll see its beyond that AND a lot of people including me were talking about them fixing games long before the word Calciopoli was even being used. The big Inter-Juventus head-to-head in 1998 for example - I was happy Juventus had bought the referee for that one as I didn't want Inter winning the title but it was clear as day.

As I said in my last post, Calciopoli discussion should go in the specific thread and not here. You couldn't expect to respond in here and for me to be the one to take it to that thread when I had said any Calciopoli-related responses to my post were to do so.

On topic: they've reduced Giovinco's speed for what...injury?! That's absurd. Juventus have been poor but hey, have they appropriately reduced the stats of the Lazio team to reflect their relegation battle?

 

[shaun7]

^I watch serie A and premiership and my glasses are always off and I ALWAYS try to admit the truth. REFEREES FAVOUR BIG TEAMS. Big fact.
Last year Juve lost over 10 points by bad referee decisions and they didn't cry about it like other teams. Oh and I didn't cry about it either. And I didn't say this, the statistics showed that.
BTW I never talked about calciopoly before.

This is Italy, that's why it is still being investigated yet nothing will happen. The legal system is a joke.

No. Moggi decided to take it somewhere else. IT IS STILL BEING investigated. Now when the decision is made, I'll accept whatever there was. But for now no one can talk about it.

As for the giovinco's speed reducing. So all that was because he's injured? It doesn't make sense. There were other players injured and their speed stayed the same. PATO for example (I f I remember correctly). Juve's players aren't doing great but only in teamwork and without teamwork the whole team will do bad. Juve's managment is a joke. They bought Diego (an awesome player), but the only players that Diego can play with are Del piro, Giovinco and Iaquinta because they can only understand Diego.
Every juve player is good, but they can't understand each other. So the stat reduce was a joke. They should have decreased their teamwork.

 

[Sweey]

Calciopoli thread for fucks sake! :<

Stop going on about it being investigated, Inter aren't going to have the titles handed to them taken away, Moggi isn't going to get back into Serie A before his ban is up. The "investigation" is meaningless. I'll laugh the day Inter finally get caught out though. A number of teams were on the receiving end of dodgy referreing last season, not just Juventus. By contrast this season, Inter cry when the referee gives any decision against them, even if its 100% right :faceplm:

No more posts in this thread about Calciopoli or I'm booking people. It had nothing to do with this whole thread anyway and I've now twice asked for such posts to be made in another thread.

Has anyone noticed the stats of any other teams being reduced? Lazio as I asked earlier or other teams who are in a position they shouldn't be at present.

 

[shaun7]

^As I said, I won't comment on calcioply until it's decision time (well in this thread at least). I didn't imply anything or accuse anyone and don't want to.

 

[Sweey]

I've edited my post above yours about 9,000 times so just make sure you read the final version :tongue: - I have a habit of doing that.

 

[LUCAPLAYER]

Lets get this straight and move on shall we?

Juventus deserved their relegation to Serie B. Whatever that investigation did or did not prove, you cannot argue with a seriously long list of refereeing decisions which were clearly wrong and in favour of the club for a number of years, allowing them to win the title. Keep reading this post though, I'm defending Juventus much further down.

Certain high-ranking members at Juventus were doing things they shouldn't have done. Siena-Juventus, April 30 2006. Siena, who have a large number of players on loan from Juventus employ a strategy with their defensive line that they haven't played all season - push up centrally to the half-way line. Juventus immediately play long balls over the top and out wide knowing what they're going to be up against and are 3-0 up inside eight minutes. Then Siena defend properly and no further goals are scored. The result stops Juventus' poor run of form that almost sees them concede the title to Milan. As a Milan fan I don't feel bitterness towards Juventus for it even though it was clear as day they bought the Siena game. For people who haven't watched the game and don't remember it vividly like I do, I suggest you don't comment as you can't even begin to imagine how bad it was.

That all said, they've done their time and deserve to be back in Serie A. The extent to which other clubs were truly involved is where I'm unsure but let us move on a little. One club who weren't good enough to win the title by themselves led the investigation and used their relationships with those at Telecom Italia Mobile to make sure they weren't caught - yes that team at the top of the league now who for the last three years have had such favouritism from referees its as clear as it was when Juventus were getting suspicious decisions for many seasons - and yes, Juve were.

Basically, LUCAPLAYER as a Roma fan is clearly pissed off with Juventus and it isn't a surprise given this is what Franco Sensi kept saying the teams from the north were doing. However, LUCAPLAYER, shouldn't you be just as angry with Inter who used it to buy their way to the top of Italian football and are doing it right now at Roma's expense even though they were part of the whole thing?

Perhaps now we can get back on topic?

Calciopoli discussion belongs here: http://www.pesgaming.com/showthread.php?t=40155

It's the same with inter, they took the scudetto off ours shirts two years ago...but iuve began back in the '80s, so it's a long story. It's the price to be onest in Italy. I agree with you this is not the right place but i'm sorry i could not resist!

 

[Stormrider]

Glad they nerfed Amauri. His old stats from past few years made him a goal machine which he never was and never will be. I think Giovinco's acceleration is still quite high so it's not exactly the end of the world for him. Apart from maybe Giovinco, I fail to see how anyone else is underrated.

I think Juve should be nerfed even more. Their defense is still too good in Pes lol, as are Buffon and Melo.

 

[shaun7]

^Buffon is still pretty good, but the defence is horrible. What can 1 goaler do to save the day? Nothing with a bad defence.
Maybe I will agree with Melo.
But Juve's players as individuals are still great.
See this is where people get confused.
It's useless to have great individuals but no teamwork and that's what Juve are lacking. TEAMWORK. It's pes' fault that the teamwork attribute is not effective so Juve nerfed even more won't be realistic. Nerf down the teamwork but not the individuals.

 

[Zardo]

juve is locally the most succesful team, let me tell 6 champions league titles are by FAR more important than 30 dometic leagues. juve is only 2 times champions and 4 champions league trophies are by far a lot of difference.

 

[Zardo]

buffon is making so many mistakes , for me he is not even in the top 5 GK acutally in the world, JULIO CESAR is by far the best one and GIVEN is making just an awesome campaing. CAsillas or CEch a lot better than him

 

[DIECI]

buffon is making so many mistakes , for me he is not even in the top 5 GK acutally in the world, JULIO CESAR is by far the best one and GIVEN is making just an awesome campaing. CAsillas or CEch a lot better than him

Buffon is hurt, he's been hurt all year, hes not even playing now!
We got spoiled by seeing him perform on the WC in 2006, that performance was legendary, he had some amazing saves that kept Italy going..... Can't expect him to be on that form forever, especially not 4 years later and with the countless injuries.

 

[DIECI]

Glad they nerfed Amauri. His old stats from past few years made him a goal machine which he never was and never will be. I think Giovinco's acceleration is still quite high so it's not exactly the end of the world for him. Apart from maybe Giovinco, I fail to see how anyone else is underrated.

I think Juve should be nerfed even more. Their defense is still too good in Pes lol, as are Buffon and Melo.

Juve is very good in PES, I use them occasionally, I being a Juve fan used to use them religiously and exclusively back on the PS2 games. They were really good, fast, and great on defense, especially the year with Ibra, Trez, Cannavaro, Del PIero (who was still fast in the game) and great midfielders like Nedved who had a wicked kick and Camoranesi, Viera, Zambrotta etc etc etc.....I just don't use them that much because I get annoyed at their real life perfomance this year + Im not a big fan of Diego and Amauri.

 

[shaun7]

buffon is making so many mistakes , for me he is not even in the top 5 GK acutally in the world, JULIO CESAR is by far the best one and GIVEN is making just an awesome campaing. CAsillas or CEch a lot better than him

You can't speak because I'm sure you do not watch Juve like I do.
As the above mentioned. Buffon was hurt most of the year.
BUT, look at the begining of the season. That's the buffon we know. He's still there.
Oh and in mid season, Juve's defence was so horrible that even god would have conceded goals.
And Cesar males mistakes. He's looking good, because he's got good defence around him.
Casillas and Cech?:no:
They both make so many mistakes. Watch carefully next time.

 

[DIECI]

You can't speak because I'm sure you do not watch Juve like I do.
As the above mentioned. Buffon was hurt most of the year.
BUT, look at the begining of the season. That's the buffon we know. He's still there.
Oh and in mid season, Juve's defence was so horrible that even god would have conceded goals.
And Cesar males mistakes. He's looking good, because he's got good defence around him.
Casillas and Cech?:no:
They both make so many mistakes. Watch carefully next time.

apart from the golies skills, he is only as good as the defense infront of him. Cesar has arguably the best defense in the world, or a top 2 or 3 in Inter, while Buffon has a ready to retire Cannavaro and a mediocre Juve defense. Switch them and you'll see how awesome Buffon would be and how mediocre Cesar would be. A perfect example is Buffon in 06 with a wall of a defense in the WC and what he has today.

 

[shaun7]

^Basically you agreed with what I said right? As long as you weren't sarcastic
I meant what your post said anyway.