Why has PES become more arcadey?

[El Nino]

PRO has definitely gone down the 'arcadey' route. As Kev puts it, 'arcadey' is somehting that you generally just pick up and play and I would agree with that sentiment. PRO has definitely gone down that route and the game is poorer for it.

It was the depth in the actual gameplay that PRO had that made it more true to the life than any other game. PES2008 took a different step down the arcade route. A real step backwards, and 2009 looks essentially the same game without the jitters and slightly more polished graphics, and few new other additions which means bugger all because PRO has lost that gameplay it used to have, and that is the most important thing.

For all of Fifa's 'pretty makeup' and licenses, at gameplay level it is still not as good as any of the PS2 versions of PRO and that's a fact.

Since last year PRO has lost its identity and PES2009 will not put that right.

Cant you just pick up and play any game?

 

[Amateur]

People say it has become more Arcadey because FIFA has much better Animations and the players move in All Directions -whereas- PES has very arcadish-looking Animations, players only move in 8 Directions.

So PES09 "Looks" arcadey.. I always thought PES5 and PES6 Looked arcadey, I don't see How this is New.

But still, saying FIFA09 is a Realistic Football Sim is BS.

 

[FutebolArte]

Edit: Actually, I remember seeing an old PES/WE in an arcade, but they're the old skool ones people go too when they're bored out of their asses when waiting for the movie to start at the cinema which is just next to it. :\

yeah it did remind me sort of pes2008 as far as speed... that's probably what they did.... put the glossy arcade one on the 08... this year's should be intersting

 

[Dragonfly]

I've always felt that PES has become more fluid in the movement of players, with PES2008 being the best. The demo feels more rigid, but I hope that is improved in the final build.

 

[scuzzelbutt]

People say it has become more Arcadey because FIFA has much better Animations and the players move in All Directions -whereas- PES has very arcadish-looking Animations, players only move in 8 Directions.

So PES09 "Looks" arcadey.. I always thought PES5 and PES6 Looked arcadey, I don't see How this is New.

But still, saying FIFA09 is a Realistic Football Sim is BS.

Agreed it comes down to the look , fifa looks like its a sim compared to pes but after you play both you know pes represents real football gamplay and better game for football fans

I got suckered into the fifa franchise last year its not happening again but pro really need to have better graphics and more animations next year

 

[Dundon's]

There was nothing more satisfying as giving that big fat ref a knee in the head or a sly jab hahahahaha

Do you remember the supershot that you could score from the halfway line that drove the goalkeeper through the net?

I remember the first time it happened to me in the Arcade, I didn't even know such a move was in it and it totally blew me away, I was losing and there was like no time left on the clock.

Have you got MAME? :ninja:

 

[Amateur]

Agreed it comes down to the look , fifa looks like its a sim compared to pes but after you play both you know pes represents real football gamplay and better game for football fans

I got suckered into the fifa franchise last year its not happening again but pro really need to have better graphics and more animations next year

What PES really needs is an Overhaul.. I mean, Konami cannot keep this going, the Old versions of PES where good -but- Not that good.

With Next Gen Consoles I was expecting much better Animations, New (and still needed) Stats and Special Abilities, more Types of Player Movements, an even better Editing Mode, etc, etc..

Instead, PES08 offered me No Gameplay, No Editing Mode, Nothing.

I just don't see what's so hard about Introducing a few New Stats, maybe replacing the Old 4 Types of Movements -with- a New System of 5 Upper Body Movements and 5 Lower Body Movements, etc, etc..

I think that Konami have been working for the past couple of years on a New Engine capable of an Overhaul -because- honestly speaking, if they have Not worked on a New Engine, What have they done for the past 2 or 3 years??

 

[scuzzelbutt]

Do you remember the supershot that you could score from the halfway line that drove the goalkeeper through the net?

I remember the first time it happened to me in the Arcade, I didn't even know such a move was in it and it totally blew me away, I was losing and there was like no time left on the clock.

Have you got MAME? :ninja:

I have it on mame , how do you do the supershot didnt even know that was possible

 

[zeemeister]

I've said it once before and I'll say it again. PES1 and PES2 were not exactly mindblowing compared to WE at the start of the PS2 era but they did the job. I play PES 2008 and PES 2009 seems upto it. But I am expecting PES 2010 to be what PES3 was in the jump that it made. Difference is that that this time FIFA has improved and is setting the bar when it comes to physics such as collisions, animations etc.
Problem is every year reviews and internet forums have always been saying "this year FIFA could be on par or surpass PES" but when it came down to it PES has prevailed. But this year the voices are really loud. I have preordered PES2009 and in all likelihood buy my 1st FIFA game in 10years at a later stage.

Another problem is that if you've been playing WE/PES for the last 10+years it seems all too familier and therefore more arcadey IMO. The time has come for Seabass and co to up the ante.

 

[Calzone]

I think it is more arcadey for the kids. Or they are followinf FIFA's footsteps and wanna get some of there money.

 

[Dundon's]

I have it on mame , how do you do the supershot didnt even know that was possible

To be honest fella I have no idea how I done it, like I said I was young and it came totally out of the blue, more recently it happened again when I was playing a mate, again no idea how I done it just that it was around the half way line.

I'd say you could google it, it's worth seeing.

 

[El Nino]

Do you remember the supershot that you could score from the halfway line that drove the goalkeeper through the net?

I remember the first time it happened to me in the Arcade, I didn't even know such a move was in it and it totally blew me away, I was losing and there was like no time left on the clock.

Have you got MAME? :ninja:

Yes here it is.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wsKTK2LxXh0

And no i dont have it.I bought a streetfighter2 arcade cabinet last year for 800 notes
but i would love to get a hold on football champ which was one of my favs from that era.still a classic

 

[Dundon's]

Well if you were to buy an old xbox and fit it into the cabinet you could install a program on it called MAME (arcade emulator) and drop the ROMS onto the HDD.

I have ever arcade game ever here at my finger tips on the auld PC. My favs are Rastan, Double Dragon, Bubble bobble, Snowbros, Football champ, Golden axe, Gunsmoke and Mr.do. All the games are perfect and even require you to insert the credits.

MAME is God.

 

[MatTheCat]

It's a good question. I think it could have started with FIFA fans converting to PES, and preferring over FIFAs old arcadish gameplay but criticising PES for the elements of FIFA that they missed? Just a theory.

Another theory is that they are basically working on the same game every year which cannot be an easy or fun task. I think they have become "stuck in a rut" with the series. It's becoming more and more monotonous for them to create. They mastered the previous console generation with a fantastic engine and they have tried to recreate the same engine with the next gen, hoping that it will bail them out. They seem to have a "will this do" mentality. Perhaps in the time they are given to create the game, the easier option is to create a more arcade style game, as a simulation would take more time and care to develop presumably. Next gen games require so much more work than previous gens. It's all new(ish) to them.

I know that EA are a much bigger company, and this is a strong factor for Konami to compete with, but FIFA has made huge leaps since they ditched the development team that made the game stale and mouldy between 2000-2006/7. I am not suggesting that Konami sack the team, BUT I am saying that they should go totally back to the drawing board. Rumour has it that they have been doing just that since 2007, releasing what they can for now ("will this do") so they can put more effort into the new engine for 2010. Time is the other issue, and I guess only time will tell if the big 2010 rumour is true.

For now I am happy to play this game for a year and I think it will last (unlike 2008)... But my thread is wearing thin.

YUP!

I believe that both the existing dev team have gotten very bored with creating ProEv (6 of the 10 main devs have been the same since day 1) and also the team at Konami is just not set up for releasing modern day video games on a yearly basis. At least they aint until they get their new next gen engine up n running. I guess if they can crack that knut then it will be just back to refining and tweaking the same thing for another few years.

They may well be hoping to have the genuine super new improved reworked Pro Ev ready for 2010, but as a fan of video games I have come to expect delays of between 8-12 months to be standard. So hopefully it will be 2010, but probably it wont be till 2011.

 

[MatTheCat]

People say it has become more Arcadey because FIFA has much better Animations and the players move in All Directions -whereas- PES has very arcadish-looking Animations, players only move in 8 Directions.

So PES09 "Looks" arcadey.. I always thought PES5 and PES6 Looked arcadey, I don't see How this is New.

But still, saying FIFA09 is a Realistic Football Sim is BS.

Yeah....PES animations are practically just the same as they have been for years but the gameplay is much more fluid. If PES2009 was released pre FIFA08 nobodx would be screaming ARCADE at the game.

However, if u play FIFA 09 and realise the vast range of gameplay options and/or control mechanisms at the gamers disposal (that are lacking in PES) that serve to mimic a real game of footie more closely, then u would have to credit FIFA with trying to simulate the real thing. On the otherhand, PES has stood still and is the same arcade game that it always was.

Of course, where FIFA09 lets itself down a bit is in the final third. Attacking (and defending) is very watered down when compared with ProEv. This fact alone will be enough for PES to be the #1 choice for a sizeable proportion of the footie video gaming community/consumers. Arcade or not.

 

[john4]

because a carbon copy of the sport would suck long time, i play games to be entertained, not to have a 90 minute tactical battle in midfield where i get a few shots on goal like more and more football games seem to be, with the occasional exception.

every arcade game that has a simulation counterpart is better imo, best example would the time i played on virtua tennis 3 compared to top spin 2 and 3, they just dont compare.

 

[El Nino]

because a carbon copy of the sport would suck long time, i play games to be entertained, not to have a 90 minute tactical battle in midfield where i get a few shots on goal like more and more football games seem to be, with the occasional exception.

every arcade game that has a simulation counterpart is better imo, best example would the time i played on virtua tennis 3 compared to top spin 2 and 3, they just dont compare.

Arcade games rule.well at least back in the 80s lol

 

[The Messiah]

because a carbon copy of the sport would suck long time, i play games to be entertained, not to have a 90 minute tactical battle in midfield where i get a few shots on goal like more and more football games seem to be, with the occasional exception.

every arcade game that has a simulation counterpart is better imo, best example would the time i played on virtua tennis 3 compared to top spin 2 and 3, they just dont compare.

Correct me if I'm wrong but weren't the early PES games simulations? That's what made them fun. You could go a shit/average team & if you were tactically good you could win against the bigga boys.

FIFA used to get slatted for being too arcadey & you could run through teams with one player.

Oh how times have changes...