Pes 6.a Bit Of A Let Down??????????

Pes6

nick higgins said:

I really dont care how many new eye catching tricks r in the game if this comes at the expense of a BASIC tool such as defending.What the hell is the point of having tactics,arrows,formations etc if when the whistle blows your players just do what the hell they want.

This is a direct quote from the review of PES 6 in PLAY magazine issue 146 which sums it up better than i ever could. "THE BIGGEST PROBLEM WE HAVE IS THE MASSIVE AMMOUNT OF SCRIPTING,WHERE THE GAME DECIDES WHAT IT WANTS TO HAPPEN,DESPITE ALL OUR EFFORTS TO THE CONTRARY.AT TIMES IT GENUINELY FEELS LIKE THE GAME IS PULLING AGAINST YOU AND NO MATTER WHAT U DO U CANT ESCAPE THE CRUSHING INEVITABILITYOF WHAT IT HAS PLANNED".

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Nick ,you couldn't be so right m8! And people that say otherwise are wrong unless this is the first time they are playing PES.
After a couple of weeks of playing I returned my game to the shop and got my money back, 'cos this game is unplayable unless you are part of the maybe 8-10 elite teams, and that are the ones happy with this game. If you are a supporter of a medium not to say average team 'cos with Pes6 is pointless to choose medium teams. I understand Konami programmers doesn't have a clue about football,that's why they have to employ people or ask players to give them tips, but come on to come back with this bull**it again ,no thanks.Its not the matter of being a perfectionist, but by now with their experience Konami should been delivering proper games, and not trying to cheat customers with releases just to make money. I've been playing Konami games since the 1st release of ISS in SNES,Mega Drive, Saturn, Ps1, and Ps2.Since the best ISS/PES of the series that set the benchmark = ISS Pro 98 for Ps1, Konami have been hit and miss, frustrating players with expectations that more often than not are 1 up 2 down. By 1998 Konami was already talking about fixing the new PES games with the real photos of the players and mapping their faces,and well, almost 10 years now!!!? same old thing, with all the technology available. Im not even going to talk about little collateral damages like commentary,little options here and there just to keep selling,licensed players and teams, etc. If they cant program a game with the basics needed that their experience demands ,well better hand it over to someone else. The beauty of football is his unpredictability, not these pre-programmed script .Why always at the end of 1st and 2nd half the Com gives the big team the chance to score? Why when you score 2,3 goals ,the Com gifts the opposite player a goal to keep it a close score? How is that possible after almost 16 years, a player runs into a through ball and get locked into a straight line and you cant turn him?How its possible well known international players in real life ,are turned by Konami in authentic paralised players that cant run ,pass or shoot? International defenders with response of 68? Stamina in the 60's ? come on, the best team in Champions League for the past 2 years (Lyon) with same stats as West Ham? Defenders that run away from the ball? Any 50/50 goes to the big team,leaving your player spinning and the ball in front of the striker for him to score or run? Whats the point of advertising PES6 with more teams to choose from, when Konami makes them look silly? Come on, who in his perfect mind is going to choose Ado den Haag, Recreativo Huelva,Angola or Venezuela to play when there is such an abysmal margin between teams? Konami should have more respect for all teams not only the english market,the brazilian and argentinian giants S Paulo, River and Boca are a joke,as 90% of other teams in this game. Yes, this game remains playable and above Fifa ,but we all know that!!! The main point is by now with all their experience,hi-tech and know-how is unexcusable to keep releasing PES games with such bugs and pre-programmed scripts.BOO to Konami for trying to cheat me out of my money, but no thanks!!!

PES6 is still the best football game but i agree with you m8. Last night i was playing again on the net. Mexico for me (cause i like using "small" teams), Brazil for the opponent (of course!!!). I have managed to score one goal but on the last minute the usual fumbling from the keeper the ball went straight to an attacking player and voila 1-1. Whats the point of online competitions when you know that with teams with 2 or 1 stars you cant win the game. Everyone is playing with the best teams and that is boring. I also like Lyon but you get the feeling that you are playing with a very bad team. Coupet is a superb keeper but konami believes the opposite. The goals i conceived with Lyon were silly. HOW could they ever do that? Did the programmers play the game? I am a big big fan of the series but for the first time i am critisizing so much my favourite game,because it is not fair.

I agree, i think the gameplay is OK.

but the CHEATING computer take the piss! especially in ML! it really PISSES me off when they cheat, just to earn a fuckin 'point'.

and the shooting is a disgrace, im 1-on-1, i want to slot the ball into the goal, side footed (Henry Style) then he fuckin toe-pokes the ball to the corner flag!!!! :realmad: what the fuck is that about??? i dont play it anymore, it just gets me angry.

I have owned every single series of PES/WE/ISS and i have loved all of em when they have been released. But PES6, is shite! Its the first time ive ever been disappointed with a PES series!!!

i think ill be renting PES7 when it's released, if its good enough then ill consider buying it, because Konami have been SLACKING lately.

They need to get there fuckin act together!

Young GE said:

I agree, i think the gameplay is OK.

but the CHEATING computer take the piss! especially in ML! it really PISSES me off when they cheat, just to earn a fuckin 'point'.

and the shooting is a disgrace, im 1-on-1, i want to slot the ball into the goal, side footed (Henry Style) then he fuckin toe-pokes the ball to the corner flag!!!! :realmad: what the fuck is that about??? i dont play it anymore, it just gets me angry.

I have owned every single series of PES/WE/ISS and i have loved all of em when they have been released. But PES6, is shite! Its the first time ive ever been disappointed with a PES series!!!

i think ill be renting PES7 when it's released, if its good enough then ill consider buying it, because Konami have been SLACKING lately.

They need to get there fuckin act together!

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Nuff said m8!! It's piss takin' by Konami with no respect for other teams , sadly for us the majority, that plays with small/medium teams and used to make this game worth play it before!! Pre-programmed cheatin' v Com or v any opponent with a big team. Players that dribble through your body like ghosts, or physically impossible things like you controlling the ball in your chest and the defender behind you is heading out through your body,not say the goals conceded at the end of the half that makes you go nuts. It seems now Konami have turned into pickpocketin'!!

MZagallo said:

Nuff said m8!! It's piss takin' by Konami with no respect for other teams , sadly for us the majority, that plays with small/medium teams and used to make this game worth play it before!! Pre-programmed cheatin' v Com or v any opponent with a big team. Players that dribble through your body like ghosts, or physically impossible things like you controlling the ball in your chest and the defender behind you is heading out through your body,not say the goals conceded at the end of the half that makes you go nuts. It seems now Konami have turned into pickpocketin'!!

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so, so true fellas .. lol
Or i could say that you're both crap at the game, and a pair of whinging b*****ds.

I love PES6 for its realisticness, plus the score can't be huge like FIFA (sucks).

shaft85 said:

so, so true fellas .. lol
Or i could say that you're both crap at the game, and a pair of whinging b*****ds.

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Spoken like a true Real Madrid playing gamer. Bet you dont have problems because you stack your team with Figo, Christiano Ronaldo etc. Try and play as Middlebrook and then come talk to us.

PNEfan said:

Spoken like a true Real Madrid playing gamer. Bet you dont have problems because you stack your team with Figo, Christiano Ronaldo etc. Try and play as Middlebrook and then come talk to us.

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Fookin hell mate, i was actually agreeing with ya.. lol
I was being sarcastic, if you wanna know why ? ... Go back a page.

Ps, Real Madrid are shit ... laterz.

shaft85 said:

Fookin hell mate, i was actually agreeing with ya.. lol
I was being sarcastic, if you wanna know why ? ... Go back a page.

Ps, Real Madrid are shit ... laterz.

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haha sorry missed a few of the earlier pages and I was a bit p~ssed off after getting shafted by the computer. Another case of my defenders acting like wobbling turds whenever the end of a half is approaching.

Such a shame Fifa cant make a good game as Konami doesnt deserve any money from making absolutely no improvements to the game. I think I will change to Rugby instead and save myself some stress.

The computer does not cheat and it never has. Learn to play the game.

Especially Shaft85; learn to use the cancels.


Every single thing the computer does, you can do too. If you are not beating the computer in 90% of your matches, then you probably have a lot to learn about the game still. Enjoy.

Jake Small said:

The computer does not cheat and it never has. Learn to play the game.

Especially Shaft85; learn to use the cancels.


Every single thing the computer does, you can do too. If you are not beating the computer in 90% of your matches, then you probably have a lot to learn about the game still. Enjoy.

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You must be playing on Amature or Beginner levels then, because its blatantly obvious that the COM AI cheats and that the game is heavily scripted.

I cant understand why sad fan-boys make themselves look idiots by trying to nonsense something that everybody (inc magazine & gaming review sites) The most popular PES forums, and the majority of long term pes players, all agree that is evident.

Even Seabass himself admitted in an interview that there are more scripted elements and small cheat codes put into pes5/6 as an (attempt) to balance the
level of gameplay out and to obviously make it more of a challenge.

This wouldn't be a problem if it had been executed in a far better and lets say (less bruitally obvious & frustrating manner)

The higher the level the more cheating and more scripted the gameplay becomes.

PES6 is scripted to death, and if you cant see it then i suggest a trip to your opticians is in order, mate.
Ps. Konami aren't going to pay you or give you some kind of award for defending their heavily flawed game you know ? lol

As for using auto cancel ... What you need to be asking yourself is why you haven't got full control over your (P1 iconned) players movement & direction in the first place ?.

Why do the players still run in set, track like patterns anyway ?..
As soon as you click or switch player using L1, you should automatically have complete control over that players movements.
Thats one thing that i've never been able to understand about PES's gameplay. You dont need to use cancels in Fifa.
It's just down to poor or lazy programming imo.

Besides, i've already posted links to other forums that are discussing this matter, and heres another one, for the hell of it.

http://www.soccergaming.tv/showthread.php?t=140951

Ps. it must be bad if people are are actually owning up & complaining about it on PES's main Fan-Boy forum .. lol

Let me just state my observation with out leaning towars either side.
Started playing Pro Evo from PES5. I have played the game almost daily one game on 30 minutes and usually I am between 3* to 4*.
I have now played PES6 since it has been released on PSP cause it is the only console I have.
When I start playing it first it was frustrating due to the problem mentioned above.
As I continue to play the game, though, things started to improve. What I usually would allow 3 to 4 goals a game I am now allowing about 1.5 on average while scoring about 2.5 on average. I haven't mastered Regular difficulty to advance to the higher difficulty.
The point I am trying to make is I believe I am learning to play the proper was and the scripting aspect of the game is diminishing. For instance, what used to frustrate me so much was I would consume a goal just after scoring and no matter what I do could not avoid it. Another one is when the CPU attacks you with an intention on scorring it seems to score no matter what you do.
Now however it is not the case. Difending is much more pleasurable, not easy by any streach of the imagination. Now it feels like I am palying the game and it realy feels when I loose it is lack of my expertise.
For sure there is scripting involved in this game but I am convinced when playing properly it can be overcomed. You might need to unlearn the way you used to play in previous PES games.

Great points mate and i agree with most of what you're saying.
First thing i'll say is knock it up a level and see if your theory still remains.

End of the day we reaslise it's a video game, and the best /only way to beat video games is by get used to the AI's movement and attacking patterns then counteract it, and finding little errors in the coding, such as the classic cutback goal.

To me, this was all fine and good about 5-6 years ago , but now i'd like (or i'd expect) a so called footy sim to play like Real football, and Not still dictate the tempo & style of the match/play to me.

Why should i mostly have to resort to playing about a million passes between my players, when at times i could opt for either a couple of quick through or long balls to 1-2 wingers or forwards making inteligent runs (those inteligent runs which are supposed to be added to the game, but i've failled to notice yet).
What i'm saying is, that you should be able to play to your own style, that suits the ability and type of players in your team or the tactics that you are personaly trying to apply and not get sucked into the type of game that the COM AI wants you to play.

I'd also like to know how you're supposed to attempt quick passing counter attacks, with the painstakingly slow passes that most of your players do ?
What makes matters worse is when your recieving player stands rooted to the spot waiting for the ball to arrive at his feet (even auto-cancel wont move them at times) this just allows for easy COM steals.

Not to mention the number of piss poor attempts the keepers make, of trying to save shots that are straight at them.

shaft85 said:

Great points mate and i agree with most of what you're saying.
First thing i'll say is knock it up a level and see if your theory still remains.

End of the day we reaslise it's a video game, and the best /only way to beat video games is by get used to the AI's movement and attacking patterns then counteract it, and finding little errors in the coding, such as the classic cutback goal.

To me, this was all fine and good about 5-6 years ago , but now i'd like (or i'd expect) a so called footy sim to play like Real football, and Not still dictate the tempo & style of the match/play to me.

Why should i mostly have to resort to playing about a million passes between my players, when at times i could opt for either a couple of quick through or long balls to 1-2 wingers or forwards making inteligent runs (those inteligent runs which are supposed to be added to the game, but i've failled to notice yet).
What i'm saying is, that you should be able to play to your own style, that suits the ability and type of players in your team or the tactics that you are personaly trying to apply and not get sucked into the type of game that the COM AI wants you to play.

I'd also like to know how you're supposed to attempt quick passing counter attacks, with the painstakingly slow passes that most of your players do ?
What makes matters worse is when your recieving player stands rooted to the spot waiting for the ball to arrive at his feet (even auto-cancel wont move them at times) this just allows for easy COM steals.

Not to mention the number of piss poor attempts the keepers make, of trying to save shots that are straight at them.

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Dont even bother Shaft!! Some of this so-called players just start playing PES now, and all of them with overrated Inter,Chelsea and Man U stacked with a bunch of other fake players they edited themselves. I bet he's got his own face in there.
Once they realised it takes only a few weeks for some option file editors around here, to come up with good OF that completely changes the game, and KONAMI spends the whole year scratching their bollocks and then as soon FIFA announces a release,hey here we go with another PES full of bugs, put together in 2 weeks pretending they were working the year round, they will start complaining. Its time for people to realise KONAMI doesn't give a rats ass about us. Almost 20 years since I first played the first PES on SNES and still have the same bugs today,like the throughball to striker and you cant turn the f*cking player to receive the ball,cos' he's locked on a straight run!!

shaft85 said:

You must be playing on Amature or Beginner levels then, because its blatantly obvious that the COM AI cheats and that the game is heavily scripted.

I cant understand why sad fan-boys make themselves look idiots by trying to nonsense something that everybody (inc magazine & gaming review sites) The most popular PES forums, and the majority of long term pes players, all agree that is evident.

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I play on the highest difficulty settings. Your appeal to popular support is weak as the only place I've heard this complaint is from sub par players or just good players who don't quite understand all of the gaming mechanics. If you explain your problem specifically with the game, I will try to help you.

Here's a start: did you know that the ref will often not call a foul against you unless you have another action queued up to happen after it? This is the cause of many people thinking that the computer can get away with things that they, personally, cannot; it's not true, it's just that the computer ALWAYS has actions queued up. Notice that if you get tackled in a nasty way, and the ref appears not to be making a call, hit a button and the whistle will blow.


And OF COURSE the game uses scripts; if it didn't you'd be having even more problems. Can I ask how far you've incorporated using the cancels and super cancels into your game? I will tell you that my game is such that I don't often go 10 seconds without super cancelling some animation. That is not to one up you or brag, but just to let you know how much control you REALLY DO HAVE over what is happening.

Now I repeat, if you cannot win 90% of your matches against the computer at the highest difficulty settings, you have more to learn about the game.

PES has its problems but the computer cheating is just not one of them.


PS: link me the interview with Seabass in question before bringing it up again..

MZagallo said:

Dont even bother Shaft!! Some of this so-called players just start playing PES now, and all of them with overrated Inter,Chelsea and Man U stacked with a bunch of other fake players they edited themselves.

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Personally, I play with Ajax and Roma almost exclusively (and Netherlands in int'l).

like the throughball to striker and you cant turn the f*cking player to receive the ball,cos' he's locked on a straight run!!

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Learn to use the tools you've been provided and this problem disappears. When you hold R1 and R2 at the same time, your currently controlled player is released from his script and you can do with him whatever you wish. This technique is absolutely necessary to mastering the game. But you appear more concerned with mastering the technique of incessant bitching.

Lets gather vid evidence....here is one.

Lets post some cheating evidence to show the doubters...

Here is a typical last minute corner that the CPU always gets

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uz8VgStiX8o&NR

This video shows why the PES/WE CPU always score from Corner-Kicks, the CPU striker simply "enters" into our defender's body making him totally useless, as you can see.

PE6 keeper errors

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OiRJ3DcI9Us&mode=related&search=

usual calamity keeping that PES/WE gives us.

That's just textures clipping. You think they purposely program it so that textures clip for one team so that they have an easier time scoring? ..... come on...

I could post a million replays of me doing the same thing.


Keepers are brutal though

Konami is lazy and sloppy

The headed goal replay must strike a chord with you as it did me when I saw it ....how many times has it happened... that however far behind your defender the opposition is and irrespective of his height, he is 98% of the time going to head a perfect goal. In real football it isnt likely that a player would go from behind the defender up to his back, miraculously jump higher and head the ball first? not without a whistle anyway.

PES works these cheats subtly to try and artificially create a close game. Which is a nice idea and to some extent works enough to make the gameplay the best out there. I think people are now complaining about it because its been years and Konami hasnt moved on...hasnt found a better way to code. PES is making millions and to see a couple of months worth of programming going into each rerelease is shocking.

I compare it to Escape from LA by John Carpenter. Essentially the same movie as the good Escape from New York but ... that sucks. People need to progress, move on, improve. We dont want to wait years and spend more money to see the same thing, however good it was.

I bet you EA Sports have 2 or 3 teams working on PS3 Fifa 08 right now improving gameplay along with another team of people coming up with new exciting options and features to expand the game. Konami probably has an near empty office with 2 high school students working out how many more special flicks they can give Christiano Ronaldo.