Constructive Criticism on PES09
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Amateur
Registered User
I've played a few games of PES09 during the week, and as usual I take notice of all the things that IMO can and should improve.
One of the most noticeable things when switching from PES6 to PES09 is that PES09 is a lot easier, at least for me. Too much Time and Space on the pitch, the off-the-ball movement is too "watered down" and isn't realistic at all.
We need to have more control over the off-the-ball movements. Only having a "pass and move" play via the R2 is hugely limiting. And only having 4 Strategies for all the individuals and positions within a team, that's another thing that needs development.
For one thing, WHY is the Defensive Play so plain?? We barely have any control over our team's defensive positioning, we just Run and Tap or Hold a couple of buttons. It's just too boring and one-dimensional. Defending requires a lot of thinking and timing in Real Life.
WHY is Defensive Play so similar to Attacking Play?? Both aspects are equally reliant on pace, rather than positioning. When we Attack we always have the ball at our feet -whereas- when we Defend we never have hold of the ball.
I think Defensive Play should be a lot more reliant on the COM and the STATS. If I can defend effectively by simply "manually" closing down gaps and going at players at full speed -then- what use would the STATS have??
In my opinion Defensive Play should be a lot different to attacking play, it should be a completely different ball game. Maybe it would be better if we never had full control of a player's defensive movement.
A different Concept. Instead of "manually" running at attackers, we would DICTATE our players defensive movements or tactical actions.
And in order to do that, we would need to "manually" control at least one player of course. But never really have full control of his tactical ability.. Meaning that we can direct the player's movements to a certain extent, but 50% of the players movement will be automatic.
No matter how well you move a certain player, if that particular player isn't good tactically he will not cover the right spots. Whereas on the other hand, if the player is a good tactician he will cover the spots that you (and everyone else watching the game from a Wide Camera) want him to cover.
His ability to cover passing lanes would depend on a lot of things, It would depend much more on your Thinking and your Timing, on How you play to your Team's Strengths.. But never on your "Manual Ability".
You would decide where you want him to be, but How he handles the execution should depend on some much needed Tactical Stats. Whereas the "Manual Ability" would gain importance once you are in a one-on-one situation.
But in order to get to that one-on-one situation you would have to Think, instead of just run mindlessly after the ball.
It's about implementing Realistic Limitations into the game. If the player is poor tactically, that would force you into using more Physical Strength, to compensate for the lack of tactical ability. And viceversa if your team is physically vulnerable but Tactically brilliant.
Which is pretty much my point this time, PES09 is very reliant on Physical Attributes, but Not on Tactical Attributes. I'm not feeling much of a difference between players who are exceptional tacticians and players who are better physically.
One of the most noticeable things when switching from PES6 to PES09 is that PES09 is a lot easier, at least for me. Too much Time and Space on the pitch, the off-the-ball movement is too "watered down" and isn't realistic at all.
We need to have more control over the off-the-ball movements. Only having a "pass and move" play via the R2 is hugely limiting. And only having 4 Strategies for all the individuals and positions within a team, that's another thing that needs development.
For one thing, WHY is the Defensive Play so plain?? We barely have any control over our team's defensive positioning, we just Run and Tap or Hold a couple of buttons. It's just too boring and one-dimensional. Defending requires a lot of thinking and timing in Real Life.
WHY is Defensive Play so similar to Attacking Play?? Both aspects are equally reliant on pace, rather than positioning. When we Attack we always have the ball at our feet -whereas- when we Defend we never have hold of the ball.
I think Defensive Play should be a lot more reliant on the COM and the STATS. If I can defend effectively by simply "manually" closing down gaps and going at players at full speed -then- what use would the STATS have??
In my opinion Defensive Play should be a lot different to attacking play, it should be a completely different ball game. Maybe it would be better if we never had full control of a player's defensive movement.
A different Concept. Instead of "manually" running at attackers, we would DICTATE our players defensive movements or tactical actions.
And in order to do that, we would need to "manually" control at least one player of course. But never really have full control of his tactical ability.. Meaning that we can direct the player's movements to a certain extent, but 50% of the players movement will be automatic.
No matter how well you move a certain player, if that particular player isn't good tactically he will not cover the right spots. Whereas on the other hand, if the player is a good tactician he will cover the spots that you (and everyone else watching the game from a Wide Camera) want him to cover.
His ability to cover passing lanes would depend on a lot of things, It would depend much more on your Thinking and your Timing, on How you play to your Team's Strengths.. But never on your "Manual Ability".
You would decide where you want him to be, but How he handles the execution should depend on some much needed Tactical Stats. Whereas the "Manual Ability" would gain importance once you are in a one-on-one situation.
But in order to get to that one-on-one situation you would have to Think, instead of just run mindlessly after the ball.
It's about implementing Realistic Limitations into the game. If the player is poor tactically, that would force you into using more Physical Strength, to compensate for the lack of tactical ability. And viceversa if your team is physically vulnerable but Tactically brilliant.
Which is pretty much my point this time, PES09 is very reliant on Physical Attributes, but Not on Tactical Attributes. I'm not feeling much of a difference between players who are exceptional tacticians and players who are better physically.
excellent thread one of the best ive read on here for a year at least
theres some very good proposals
and if you dont mind me adding the game should take into account mental attributes and what players are likely to do
FLAIR - players who score highly will be able to perform more tricks(ronaldo messi)
CREATIVITY -players who score highly will work to create space or try to pull a marker away from the player with ball,or in the case of wide players ,will hug the touchline rather than cut in(CF berbatov WF robben)
AWARENESS-players who score highly will attack the space created in goal mouth(torres ,owen)
POSISTIONING-players who score highly here will posistion themselves well to defensive situations and marshall your defensive line if he pulls back your line of defence should follow similarly if he moves foreward (terry)
DEFENCE UNDERSTANDING or COVER- as we all know defenders work better when they work together ,so players who score highly automatically move deeper and inwards to their own goal to defend space (sol campbell)
MARKING -players who score highly here will track opponents runs or pick up players in the box and will try to keep the attacker on the outside of them(woodgate)
TACTICAL AWARENESS -players who score highly here will react quicker to both attacking and defensive overloads will overlap or support a side attack ,or defensively will cover space (cole)
TEAM PLAY- players who score highly here will look to keep the team tight and compact in defensive situations and will pressure more trying to force them back from goal(carrick)
players movements ,in one movement a player when stood still can pivot using his standing leg 360 degrees using R2 (slow jog) a player should be able to R2 contol and spin using L3 to 180 degrees to sheild or lay off the ball ,also a player when in full sprint can only move 90 degrees thats 45 degrees either side ,a greater turning circle would cause a loss of balance but in jog mode (normal speed) can turn 180 degrees thats 90 degrees either side but the acceleration between the two should be gradually increased and decreased over 3 or 4 steps perhaps one second in game time ,this would increase a players direction/turning circle at slow speeds but dramitacly cut the ability of movement at top speed ,making dribbling harder
also for goal keepers the ability to come out and spread themselves maybe hold triangle +X at the point of spreading (schmeichel)
theres some very good proposals
and if you dont mind me adding the game should take into account mental attributes and what players are likely to do
FLAIR - players who score highly will be able to perform more tricks(ronaldo messi)
CREATIVITY -players who score highly will work to create space or try to pull a marker away from the player with ball,or in the case of wide players ,will hug the touchline rather than cut in(CF berbatov WF robben)
AWARENESS-players who score highly will attack the space created in goal mouth(torres ,owen)
POSISTIONING-players who score highly here will posistion themselves well to defensive situations and marshall your defensive line if he pulls back your line of defence should follow similarly if he moves foreward (terry)
DEFENCE UNDERSTANDING or COVER- as we all know defenders work better when they work together ,so players who score highly automatically move deeper and inwards to their own goal to defend space (sol campbell)
MARKING -players who score highly here will track opponents runs or pick up players in the box and will try to keep the attacker on the outside of them(woodgate)
TACTICAL AWARENESS -players who score highly here will react quicker to both attacking and defensive overloads will overlap or support a side attack ,or defensively will cover space (cole)
TEAM PLAY- players who score highly here will look to keep the team tight and compact in defensive situations and will pressure more trying to force them back from goal(carrick)
players movements ,in one movement a player when stood still can pivot using his standing leg 360 degrees using R2 (slow jog) a player should be able to R2 contol and spin using L3 to 180 degrees to sheild or lay off the ball ,also a player when in full sprint can only move 90 degrees thats 45 degrees either side ,a greater turning circle would cause a loss of balance but in jog mode (normal speed) can turn 180 degrees thats 90 degrees either side but the acceleration between the two should be gradually increased and decreased over 3 or 4 steps perhaps one second in game time ,this would increase a players direction/turning circle at slow speeds but dramitacly cut the ability of movement at top speed ,making dribbling harder
also for goal keepers the ability to come out and spread themselves maybe hold triangle +X at the point of spreading (schmeichel)
Tech_Skill
Registered User
I have said this before, the gameplay needs to be revolutionized completely to have any chance against the other game.
I think something like assigning all passing or most of it to the right stick, allowing you to weight passes and aim passes without the use of buttons (for the most part) would be a revolutionary idea in football games. A proper passing system assigned to the sticks, something like that needs to happen.
I wont bother going into detail about anything else, waste of breath, Konami have already started on the next game and they arent gonna listen to anyone.
I think something like assigning all passing or most of it to the right stick, allowing you to weight passes and aim passes without the use of buttons (for the most part) would be a revolutionary idea in football games. A proper passing system assigned to the sticks, something like that needs to happen.
I wont bother going into detail about anything else, waste of breath, Konami have already started on the next game and they arent gonna listen to anyone.
i'm not sure because i havn't really tried it but can you not use the right stick for manual passing?
Tech_Skill
Registered User
Yeah but im talking about a more accurate proper system which pretty much gets rid of the use of buttons to pass, you can manual pass using the right stick, i dont think its as accurate as button but maybe thats me.
Something completely innovative along those lines. Maybe it could be done for shooting
Example to shoot, moving the stick back to pull the foot back, and then forward to make the strike.
Im just brainstorming.
yes and have been for quite some time ,altho the manual passing on pes09 has less feel to it than pes08 and its limited to ground passes
not a bad idea but rather than use a golfing method if i`m assuming correctly thats what you mean why not switch the tactics change to R2 and slow jog/place shot to L2 that way when you shoot with the right manual if you want bottom left ,you aim bottom left and the power is guaged by the amount of time you depress ,also because you now have L1 free this could be used for an aerial ball ,almost like fifas manual controls ,but like fifa keep the auto buttons for private play and manual for online
altho this could have a negative reaction as players could tend to run more
Amateur
Registered User
I will elaborate on this matter later, as now I don't have the time.. but Passing through the Right Stick is a flawed concept.
In my opinion, what they should do is keep more or less the same Passing Controls, the Controls work fairly well.. it is the execution that feels too heavily assisted by the COM.
If you keep "brainstorming" you'll be surprised about how much better it could be.
FLAWED!! cant wait for this one
jenicek68
Registered User
Well.. About that issue with messi zig zaging.. It is problem of few things.. It is about stats, why messi can do zig zaging.. If he doesn´t have that big acceleration, than he would not be as good at that.. The best striker in PES should be good as Totti.. Every good player in PES is very over-rated.. And for example Drogba, is under-rated.. Drogba should have for example 5-7 higher acceleration, and 5-7 lower speed.. That´s what will make him looking more like real..
It is stats, which is probably biggest issue of the game..
About this issue:
QUOTE Or by double tapping (x) or in other words by (x)+(x) -the- player passes the ball and then sprints off on the tactical run you assigned to the (x) button.. QUOTE
Did u notice, that it is actualy possible to do that already?
Just go to player setting before or during the match.. Play with selected player, pick whole squad and here you go.. You will pass to other player and make some run, then you will ask for pass like in BAL, or change player and pass it forward to desired player.. It needs bit of practicing (Nothing to compere with fifa), but it works.. Me and few friends playing like..
Amateur
Registered User
Well.. About that issue with messi zig zaging.. It is problem of few things.. It is about stats, why messi can do zig zaging.. If he doesn´t have that big acceleration, than he would not be as good at that.. The best striker in PES should be good as Totti.. Every good player in PES is very over-rated.. And for example Drogba, is under-rated.. Drogba should have for example 5-7 higher acceleration, and 5-7 lower speed.. That´s what will make him looking more like real..
It is stats, which is probably biggest issue of the game..
About this issue:
QUOTE Or by double tapping (x) or in other words by (x)+(x) -the- player passes the ball and then sprints off on the tactical run you assigned to the (x) button.. QUOTE
Did u notice, that it is actualy possible to do that already?
Just go to player setting before or during the match.. Play with selected player, pick whole squad and here you go.. You will pass to other player and make some run, then you will ask for pass like in BAL, or change player and pass it forward to desired player.. It needs bit of practicing (Nothing to compere with fifa), but it works.. Me and few friends playing like..
PES09 does not offers anything of the sort. I am talking about Dictating Play, Not "manually" controlling play. Two very different things.
Manually controlling a player's off-the-ball movement is cheating and arcade-like.
Off-the-ball movement should be heavily assisted by the COM and the STATS. Meaning that we will "manually" decide how a player without the ball moves, but our "manual ability" will never render any STATS as useless.
Meaning that a player with poor Tactical Stats will not cover the right spots, no matter how well you control him. Which means that you would then be forced to play to your strengths.. if that player isn't good tactically, then you would be forced into trying a more physical approach.
For example, Espanyol vs Barcelona this past week.. Espanyol knew they could not beat Barcelona Tactically, so they turned to anti-football tactics. Using Physical Power to compensate for their lack of Tactical Ability.
Such Realistic Limitations are nowhere to be found on PES09. When I Defend (in PES09) I just run mindlessly after the ball, and that seems to work 90% of the time.
What's the use of having Defensive Stats if I can easily win the ball with any Fast and Agile player with good Balance??
Konami are paying too much attention to Physical Attributes, whilst on the other hand Tactical Attributes are being overlooked. Which has resulted in a very one-dimensional gameplay.
So yeah, Konami definitely needs to start developing their Stats and Special Abilities. It can and should be a lot more specific and realistic. And bottom line is that it will be Necessary, as simple as.
The sooner they start implementing New Stats -the- better it will be. There's no point in trying to drag the same Old Stats on a Next Gen Console. Times change, it's time for Konami to make full use of this technology.
With that said, you have misinterpreted my idea.. I do not want to use just One player, I do not want to "manually" control my players off-the-ball movement.. I am a Player-Manager which is way more fun and interesting than only playing as a single-player.
If I double tap (x) or in other words (x)+(x) -the- passer sprints off on the tactical run I assigned to the (x) button. I do not "manually" control his tactical movement, I just dictate it.
I dictate how I want him to move, maybe in one situation I want him to execute the tactical play I assigned to the (x) button. But maybe in another occasion I want to try the tactical play I assigned to the (o) button.. etc, etc. It's about Dictating Play instead of "manually" controlling play.
An Individuals Tactical Stats should determine how well he executes my plays. And I should only have full control over the player with the ball. Whilst on the other hand, we should never have full control over a player without the ball.
Having Full Control over a player who doesn't haves hold of the ball in an Attacking Play seems like an arcade-like concept, it is cheating. If Konami goes in this direction the game will feel even more arcade-like.
jenicek68
Registered User
Well.. So, are you trying to tell me, that there is always perfect run for ball in real match? Did you ever play football? Couse this is teamplay mate, and you as a one person should not be able to affect whole team play.. Arsenal, Man U, As rome etc. etc. They have got all good teamplay and there are players runing well for ball.. Why you should control when the other player should start run for break?? If it will be like that, then you will win every match.. It will actualy repeat problem from PES 4, where Henry or Owen have been totaly unstopable.. Afterwhile we didn´t play on tournaments for England, Liverpool, France and Arsenal.. Couse who had those teams always wins.. You should get some games from before and get some practise about ideas you have got.. Some of them are nice, but some of them like this one is absolutly nonsense..
Did you ever play football? Couse this is teamplay mate, and you as a one person should not be able to affect whole team play.. Arsenal, Man U, As rome etc. etc. They have got all good teamplay and there are players runing well for ball.. Why you should control when the other player should start run for break?? If it will be like that, then you will win every match.. It will actualy repeat problem from PES 4, where Henry or Owen have been totaly unstopable.. Afterwhile we didn´t play on tournaments for England, Liverpool, France and Arsenal.. Couse who had those teams always wins.. You should get some games from before and get some practise about ideas you have got.. Some of them are nice, but some of them like this one is absolutly nonsense..
Amateur
Registered User
Well.. So, are you trying to tell me, that there is always perfect run for ball in real match?
This is a Football Sim, it is fantasy!! Do you not understand that yet??
You are a Player-manager.. in Real Life you only play as One Player -and- as a Footballer myself, may I suggest that if you want to play as a single player, you should give Real Football a try.
Because it will never happen on any Console. An IMO it will be a great waste of effort to do such a thing on a console. As a Football Player, I think the Idea of both controlling an individual and dictating how your team plays is fantastic.
And please "jenicek68" I do not know how to put this but, your pissing me off.. and your pissing me off because you clearly are Not Listening. I feel like I've explained myself clear enough.
Maybe you don't have the best disposition as a Listener. And without Listening Properly, how can you question something you do not even understand??
As for your question - Are you trying to tell me that there is always perfect run for ball in real match?????
That is precisely what I am against, it is cheating and arcade-like. It should all be highly assisted by the COM and the STATS, and the MOMENTUM -and- on How You use those Stats to your advantage.
If an Individual haves exceptional Tactical Stats -he- will run flawlessly for the most part, but not "always".
On the other hand, a player with poor Tactical Stats will have to use another approach, maybe use more Physical Strength, or more Individual Dribbling moves to compensate for his lack of tactical ability.
As a Player-Manager you decide how to make use of your players Strengths, you "dictate" how you want them to move. But their execution, that is their ability to execute your thoughts.. that would be out of your power.
The STATS should decide how well an Individual executes your thoughts or directions.
It should never depend on your "manual ability" as "manually" controlling a player's off-the-ball runs is cheating, every run would be perfect with such a concept. Which would render the Tactical Side of the game as a mere casualty.
Tactical Stats will be necessary in the near future, and if I'm not mistaken EA has already implemented some of them into FIFA09.
jenicek68
Registered User
Firstly you wrote this:
If I double tap (x) or in other words (x)+(x) -the- passer sprints off on the tactical run I assigned to the (x) button. I do not "manually" control his tactical movement, I just dictate it.
I dictate how I want him to move, maybe in one situation I want him to execute the tactical play I assigned to the (x) button. But maybe in another occasion I want to try the tactical play I assigned to the (o) button.. etc, etc. It's about Dictating Play instead of "manually" controlling play.
And then this:
It should never depend on your "manual ability" as "manually" controlling a player's off-the-ball runs is cheating, every run would be perfect with such a concept. Which would render Tactical Stats as useless, as a mere casualty.:QUOTE
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You do not understand either.. I am not talking about whole sentense, but parts and now i am talking, that you should not be able to press some button, to let player run for predefined positions.. Couse is this happening on real ground? Yes, but in divisions and below or somewhere in front of house. But in Proffesional football you talking about whole different system, game and so.. Players from higher leagues got completely different system.. And I am sure, that most of your staff is good idea, but i don´t think, that you should be able to press button, and push the other player to run.. Much more realistic will be, if you will shout at him run, and ai will count from his stats, if he is sort of player capable of the acceleration, good with stamina or he will not be capable of that.. Or the situation you got your player and there will be player already shouting at you to pass (Milan Baros is really good example..), couse he is shouting all the match).. And i got feeling that PES is doing so.. I can really see, that some players lifting their hands, some of them going for runs (Roney, Messi constantly.. ).. You are going deep mate, which is good, but then you trying to put some scripts there, that is all what I am saying.. And you p.. me too, couse once, there is no 100% aplausse to your ideas, then you get pissed.. Defending yourself, that you play real footy, you got PES -60 till now, and you wont talk with someone who just signed to this forum you will realize, that you will write this ideas just to yourself..
If I double tap (x) or in other words (x)+(x) -the- passer sprints off on the tactical run I assigned to the (x) button. I do not "manually" control his tactical movement, I just dictate it.
I dictate how I want him to move, maybe in one situation I want him to execute the tactical play I assigned to the (x) button. But maybe in another occasion I want to try the tactical play I assigned to the (o) button.. etc, etc. It's about Dictating Play instead of "manually" controlling play.
And then this:
It should never depend on your "manual ability" as "manually" controlling a player's off-the-ball runs is cheating, every run would be perfect with such a concept. Which would render Tactical Stats as useless, as a mere casualty.:QUOTE
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You do not understand either.. I am not talking about whole sentense, but parts and now i am talking, that you should not be able to press some button, to let player run for predefined positions.. Couse is this happening on real ground? Yes, but in divisions and below or somewhere in front of house. But in Proffesional football you talking about whole different system, game and so.. Players from higher leagues got completely different system.. And I am sure, that most of your staff is good idea, but i don´t think, that you should be able to press button, and push the other player to run.. Much more realistic will be, if you will shout at him run, and ai will count from his stats, if he is sort of player capable of the acceleration, good with stamina or he will not be capable of that.. Or the situation you got your player and there will be player already shouting at you to pass (Milan Baros is really good example..
), couse he is shouting all the match).. And i got feeling that PES is doing so.. I can really see, that some players lifting their hands, some of them going for runs (Roney, Messi constantly.. ).. You are going deep mate, which is good, but then you trying to put some scripts there, that is all what I am saying.. And you p.. me too, couse once, there is no 100% aplausse to your ideas, then you get pissed.. Defending yourself, that you play real footy, you got PES -60 till now, and you wont talk with someone who just signed to this forum you will realize, that you will write this ideas just to yourself..
Amateur
Registered User
QUOTE:It should never depend on your "manual ability" as "manually" controlling a player's off-the-ball runs is cheating, every run would be perfect with such a concept. Which would render Tactical Stats as useless, as a mere casualty.:QUOTE
You do not understand either.. I am not talking about whole sentense, but parts and now i am talking, that you should not be able to press some button, to let player run for predefined positions.. Couse is this happening on real ground? Yes, but in divisions and below or somewhere in front of house. But in Proffesional football you talking about whole different system, game and so.. Players from higher leagues got completely different system.. And I am sure, that most of your staff is good idea, but i don´t think, that you should be able to press button, and push the other player to run.. Much more realistic will be, if you will shout at him run, and ai will count from his stats, if he is sort of player capable of the acceleration, good with stamina or he will not be capable of that.. Or the situation you got your player and there will be player already shouting at you to pass (Milan Baros is really good example..
No, I'm just pissed because you clearly do no understand me even though I have repeated myself a fair number of times. And while I'm at it, I'm the type of person who easily gets pissed off, but not in a bad way. So if you are the sensitive type who easily takes offense, I apologize.
Anyways, before arguing any further, which is pretty much the point of this thread; "Constructive Criticism".
Before continuing you should maybe re-read some posts, because I simply do not understand what your arguing against. It seems like you have skipped some posts, because You are arguing against something that you do not understand.
It's a complicated concept what I'm trying to explain. But to put it simply, all the teams have Different Systems, which goes hand-in-hand with playing to your players Strengths.
And playing to your players strengths haves a lot to do with Tactical Play. So its as simple as, you choose 4 Tactical Runs for each player, which means that every team would play differently. Which also goes hand-in-hand with Team Chemistry.
It is about you as a Player-Manager deciding How to use those Stats, dictating Some of your players tactical movements.
If the player doesn't haves the Stamina?? Who cares, you tell him to run that way and he will run that way. But consequently he will tire out faster, which may result with him not running at all after awhile, because of fatigue. Which would force a substitution.
It's all up to you, you decide how to use their abilities. On the other hand you have no power over their actual ability at executing your directions.
How they execute your thoughts and directions??
It all depends on the Stats, and it shouldn't be some arcade-like execution where you tell him to go Right and he goes to the Right very obviously.
There would be no such thing as "scripting". Which is something that Konami has implemented into every version of PES, most notably PES09.
You would have a different set of Tactical Strategies for when Attacking or Defending. Which means that there would be "tactical plays" from both Attackers and Defenders. Both trying to counter and anticipate each other with each passing Play.
There would be no scripting, everything would rely on the Stats of your players, on your Timing, on how you use your Team's Strengths.
A team is made up of 11 players, not just 1. And we can only "manually" control one player, which means that we should have the power of "dictating" the movements of other players that aren't under our control.
Point of the matter is to force the player into THINKING. Before achieving a one-on-one situation both when Attacking or Defending, we should be forced into Thinking a lot more.
Unlike the "running mindlessly after the ball at full pace" tactic that always seems to work on PES09. It's embarrassing. PES09 feels very slow, for the immense time and space available on the pitch, but Mainly because you barely have to THINK at all.
Run, Run, Run, Cut the ball, Run, Run, Pass the ball, Tap R2, Run, Cut the ball, Pass the ball -- Goal!!
Konami treats the Tactical Aspect of the game as a mere casualty.
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P.S - If you cannot understand the difference between "manually controlling" a players tactical movement -and- "dictating" a players tactical movement..
There's nothing I can do about that, it is as clear as it can be, maybe you lack some knowledge.
It is as simple as, when a President sends someone into a battle field, they are dictating things.. How that someone (that person) executes the task is a completely different matter.
jenicek68
Registered User
But I dont like your idea about that.. Do you understand??
I dont like to dictating players tactical movements.. I would like to dictate them pace, marking, different type of positions and roles which they should play.. Passivelly call at them via head set, let them deside (the ones, which aren´t controled) what to do and once they recive pass, controle them and carry on.. That is how should next gen look.. Description of the word dictation is wide term u should rather use offer him to run, but let him deside or something like that..
I can tell you about Dictation, Dictator´s, Dictatures, Dictates plenty.. For example:
If president sends someone to battlefield just by his choice, he have to be Strong Dictator..
The strong dictator has, for any social goal he/she has in mind (e.g. raise taxes, having someone killed, etc.), a definite way of achieving that goal. This can be seen as having explicit absolute power, like Sulla or Amateur.
Description of the word Dictation (exercise) is, when one person speaks while another person transcribes what is spoken.
Anyways.. Sometimes is better talk about staff directly, than use some words to look more important..
were do i start i think the game has not evolved much on the next gen consoles and konami are not trying hard enough to get the most out of the game by not adding new ground breaking ideas they seem to be just playing it safe by just changing a few minor things every year.dont get me wrong i love the game and how fluid the passing is etc iv played konami football games since hyper soccer on the nes so am a big fan of their football games, but 09 is just not all the game it can be does any agree??
heres a few ideas i think would be great for the next game.....
-make the game a bit harder it becomes to easy after the first few months.
-more teams they dont have to be licenced as the edit mode was great this year and can fix all the stuff that needs to be done.
-more stadiums with differnt size pitches as all pitch sizes are not the same, this would add to the difficulity of playing on small pitches with less space.
-bring back the old style goals and nets, the ones in fifa 09 look class i think everyone who has seen them would agree.
-better commentry the current one is just a bit boring and doesnt have enough phrases its the same over and over, 09 was had setanta sports boards around the pitches why not use there commentry team??
-keepers need to be improved a hell of alot they havent been the best on next gen consoles, i think they could do with having more animations that make them harder to sore against also when they catch the ball why cant they sprint to the edge of their box to try start off quick counter attacks like what reina does for liverpool??
-i like the idea fifa has were you hit one the l1 or l2 button and the player makes a run into space ahead of you, this would be a good addition because sometimes the computer controled players in pro do not make them.
-more animations for dribbling, volleys, headers, keeper dives etc.
-graphics could be a bit better not saying last years wasn't an improvement but it could be pushed a bit further like what happened to the dirty jerseys i used to think that was a nice touch.
-bring back the old training games remember the dribbling courses and the freekick target pratice.
-make the stats to reflect to what the player is in real life, for example in 09 rooney was faster then torres and ronaldo was a better dribbler then messi com on konami thats not true in real life.
-add classic club teams and have say a best of all time team with pele,maradona etc...and a current all star team messi,ronaldo etc it would be a nice addition.
heres a few ideas that i think would make the master league better and more realistic.
-change points system to real money
-have a real calendar year for matches and instead of having the GO TO NEXT WEEK option change to GO TO NEXT DAY so you could have the option of say 2 training sessions in between each match to work on your players like you currently have at the end of the season, this would mean you can have a better influnence on how better your players get and you can work on areas that they are not good at (speed,passing,scoring etc)
-reserve team or youth team, with weekly reports on whos playing well
-fan/board confidence metre 0-100%...if it reaches 0% you get sacked...things that have a good effect say winning leagues,cups signing world class players etc...things that have bad effect losing alot,league position selling popular players etc... if its up around the 100% you can demand more money for players or the club rewards you for winning things with money
-chance to change to a different club instead of having to stay at the same one
-press conferances being able to pick a comment that will have a + or - affect on the team...having something like sky sports news (PES NEWS) having breaking news information (kaka hands in transfare request,ronaldo signs for madrid in world record transfare deal etc)that would bring a buzz to the game
-transfares(get rid of the stupid arrow thing)... if a club refuses your offer you should be given a reason(do not want to sell to rivals,offer too low etc) if player refuses contract state reason(club not big enough,wants more money etc)..option to put clauses & bonuses in player contracts(buy out clause ctc)(goal scoring,clean sheet,assist etc)...if your negotiating with a player you should see what he demands from the cub so you have an idea of what to offer...unhappy players from your own club should to able to put in transfare requests...option to loan your youth players or fringe players out...computer teams seem to do some unrealisic transfares too for example everton signed cesc,silva,joe cole in one close season and they were a team fighting relegation the season before thing like that dont really happen unless an arab takes over..option to state how much you value your top players this could scare off clubs bidding or making them offer over the odds.
-no more reincarnation of retired players
-realistic injuries...state injury & how long the player will be out of action
-more leagues they dont have to be licenced the editing option can fix this...at the very least the leagues below them (coca cola championship,seira b etc) should be included to avoild having teams from different countries in them.
-being able to edit manager apperance
-choosing the captain should have some affect on the team or moral for that matter, how about a leadership stat being put into every player or a star for special ability
-have goal flashes from other games at top of screen during master league games... if your losing an your league rivals are winning this would put added pressure on you to go all out for the win and would add a realistic feel instead of finding out at half time.
-sort out the stamina ratings players tire way too easy
-proper suspentions...1 for 5 yellows & 3 for straight red
- Sponsors...the more popular or successful your team gets real or fictional companys offer big money for advertising boards around the stadium.
- Upgradable stadia...amend ticket prices so the more popular or successful your team gets you can higher or lower them to affect how much money can be made.
and finally does konami even bother to check fourms like this because i have seen some great ideas on pages like this that could of easily been added to the 09 game and they never were!!
heres a few ideas i think would be great for the next game.....
-make the game a bit harder it becomes to easy after the first few months.
-more teams they dont have to be licenced as the edit mode was great this year and can fix all the stuff that needs to be done.
-more stadiums with differnt size pitches as all pitch sizes are not the same, this would add to the difficulity of playing on small pitches with less space.
-bring back the old style goals and nets, the ones in fifa 09 look class i think everyone who has seen them would agree.
-better commentry the current one is just a bit boring and doesnt have enough phrases its the same over and over, 09 was had setanta sports boards around the pitches why not use there commentry team??
-keepers need to be improved a hell of alot they havent been the best on next gen consoles, i think they could do with having more animations that make them harder to sore against also when they catch the ball why cant they sprint to the edge of their box to try start off quick counter attacks like what reina does for liverpool??
-i like the idea fifa has were you hit one the l1 or l2 button and the player makes a run into space ahead of you, this would be a good addition because sometimes the computer controled players in pro do not make them.
-more animations for dribbling, volleys, headers, keeper dives etc.
-graphics could be a bit better not saying last years wasn't an improvement but it could be pushed a bit further like what happened to the dirty jerseys i used to think that was a nice touch.
-bring back the old training games remember the dribbling courses and the freekick target pratice.
-make the stats to reflect to what the player is in real life, for example in 09 rooney was faster then torres and ronaldo was a better dribbler then messi com on konami thats not true in real life.
-add classic club teams and have say a best of all time team with pele,maradona etc...and a current all star team messi,ronaldo etc it would be a nice addition.
heres a few ideas that i think would make the master league better and more realistic.
-change points system to real money
-have a real calendar year for matches and instead of having the GO TO NEXT WEEK option change to GO TO NEXT DAY so you could have the option of say 2 training sessions in between each match to work on your players like you currently have at the end of the season, this would mean you can have a better influnence on how better your players get and you can work on areas that they are not good at (speed,passing,scoring etc)
-reserve team or youth team, with weekly reports on whos playing well
-fan/board confidence metre 0-100%...if it reaches 0% you get sacked...things that have a good effect say winning leagues,cups signing world class players etc...things that have bad effect losing alot,league position selling popular players etc... if its up around the 100% you can demand more money for players or the club rewards you for winning things with money
-chance to change to a different club instead of having to stay at the same one
-press conferances being able to pick a comment that will have a + or - affect on the team...having something like sky sports news (PES NEWS) having breaking news information (kaka hands in transfare request,ronaldo signs for madrid in world record transfare deal etc)that would bring a buzz to the game
-transfares(get rid of the stupid arrow thing)... if a club refuses your offer you should be given a reason(do not want to sell to rivals,offer too low etc) if player refuses contract state reason(club not big enough,wants more money etc)..option to put clauses & bonuses in player contracts(buy out clause ctc)(goal scoring,clean sheet,assist etc)...if your negotiating with a player you should see what he demands from the cub so you have an idea of what to offer...unhappy players from your own club should to able to put in transfare requests...option to loan your youth players or fringe players out...computer teams seem to do some unrealisic transfares too for example everton signed cesc,silva,joe cole in one close season and they were a team fighting relegation the season before thing like that dont really happen unless an arab takes over..option to state how much you value your top players this could scare off clubs bidding or making them offer over the odds.
-no more reincarnation of retired players
-realistic injuries...state injury & how long the player will be out of action
-more leagues they dont have to be licenced the editing option can fix this...at the very least the leagues below them (coca cola championship,seira b etc) should be included to avoild having teams from different countries in them.
-being able to edit manager apperance
-choosing the captain should have some affect on the team or moral for that matter, how about a leadership stat being put into every player or a star for special ability
-have goal flashes from other games at top of screen during master league games... if your losing an your league rivals are winning this would put added pressure on you to go all out for the win and would add a realistic feel instead of finding out at half time.
-sort out the stamina ratings players tire way too easy
-proper suspentions...1 for 5 yellows & 3 for straight red
- Sponsors...the more popular or successful your team gets real or fictional companys offer big money for advertising boards around the stadium.
- Upgradable stadia...amend ticket prices so the more popular or successful your team gets you can higher or lower them to affect how much money can be made.
and finally does konami even bother to check fourms like this because i have seen some great ideas on pages like this that could of easily been added to the 09 game and they never were!!
Amateur
Registered User
But I dont like your idea about that.. Do you understand??
Description of the word dictation is wide term u should rather use offer him to run, but let him deside or something like that..
I can tell you about Dictation, Dictator´s, Dictatures, Dictates plenty.. For example:
If president sends someone to battlefield just by his choice, he have to be Strong Dictator..
The strong dictator has, for any social goal he/she has in mind (e.g. raise taxes, having someone killed, etc.), a definite way of achieving that goal. This can be seen as having explicit absolute power, like Sulla or Amateur.
Description of the word Dictation (exercise) is, when one person speaks while another person transcribes what is spoken.
Anyways.. Sometimes is better talk about staff directly, than use some words to look more important..
In other words, you do not understand, and that's about it.
In PES09 the COM dictates everything for you.. Are you telling me that you prefer to only Pass or Shoot the ball whilst the COM takes care of everything else for you??
You know, I never THINK whilst I play PES09, and yet I still manage to win 99.9% of the time.
I just Run, Run, Pass the ball, Tap R2, Run, Pass the ball -- Goal!!
Or when Defending I just Run, Run, Run, Push and Shove -- I win possession back.
That's not Football.
A Football Manager Dictates how he wants his Team to play. And every Player executes the task differently, in accordance to his ability and strengths.
If an Individual does not plays to The Manager's Rules, he will find his way into the bench or the reserves eventually. Therefore a Manager can be easily compared to a Dictator.
This is the last post that I will waste on you, not because I'm pissed, but because I consider it a waste of time and effort.. there's no point in arguing with someone who doesn't knows how to read or listen properly.
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P.S - I'm well aware of what "Dictation" means, I do not need anyone reminding me that. Instead of talking nonsense, maybe you should try and practice something "constructive".
Instead of arguing against things that you clearly do not understand.